Binoculars useful for a sailboat trip?

[Microtus]

An acquaintance of mine is going to be sailing across the North Atlantic later this spring. He was wondering about good rugged binoculars, with a range about two miles, that he can use on his sailboat. Would anybody have any recommendations?

Thanks,

Rob

[Sancho]

I know there are specific nautical binoculars available in sailing shops, but I've never seen through a pair and don't know how they differ from ordinary bins. My brother sails and uses a simple pair of Olympus 10x50 bins that cost him 100 euro, perfectly adequate for the task (he's not a birder). A lot of sailing folk use IS (Image Stablisation) bins, 'cos obviously the boat moves up and down. Canon make the cheapest ones, but only one model is waterproof, the 10x42 IS "L-series". Amazing optics, but strange in the hand, quite large and heavy. I have the Canon 12x36 IS version, it's not waterproof but it is rainproof (well, showerproof), fine as long as you don't drop it in the water. The IS feature is really amazing, steadies an image wonderfully to eliminate hand-shake and presumably sea-swell. The 12x36 cost about 700 euro. The waterproof 10x42 are more expensive, I think about 1200.

[J. Moore]

Hi Rob. No specific recommendations, but I did a search on Google looking for the words "boating" and "binoculars" and came up with a lot of useful stuff, including this page of recommendations:

http://www.just-binoculars.com/merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=J&Category_Code=BOATING

It looks as though there are a lot of ways to go. 7 x 50 seems like a popular configuration, because that will give you a large exit pupil and make it easier to stay on target when the boat is rocking. And a relatively low magnification will minimize the adverse effects of motion.

There also appear to be several binoculars specifically designed to float in the water, and some that claim to be resistant to fogging up.

And then there are also various image stabilized binoculars, which come in a wide variety of price ranges, and should theoretically enable you to see better at greater distances despite the rocking motion of a boat. But I think these often require batteries, and not all are waterproof.

You might also want to specify what your friends price range might be, what specifically he is going to be using the binoculars for, and whether he wears glasses.

Hope this helps,
Jim

[ceasar]

Check this website.
http://www.captainsnautical.com/ Be sure to read Bill Cook's article there: http://www.captainsnautical.com/article.asp?article_Id=521&d_id=17456&l2=&l1=17456

They should be water proof, and have a large exit pupil. 7 x 42 is a good format.

Calm Seas!

Bob

BTW, Bill Cook KNOWS binoculars! He's a retired US Navy Chief Opticalman and posts often on this forum and the Binocular forum of "Cloudy Nights."

[etc]

Canon IS seems like the winning ticket...

Bring spare AA batteries or NiMH rechargeable cells...

[Pinewood]

Rob,

Even with image stabilisation, a 12x36 has an exit pupil of 3 mm.; while a 10x42 has an exit pupil of 4.2 mm. A 7x42 has a 6 mm. exit pupil, which is probably advantageous for night work, and there is no problem with batteries. Should your friend chose a Porro binocular, it should be individual focus, as they are more waterproof than any center focus Porro glass. Do batteries keep well on board a sailboat?
Incidentally, the traditional marine binocular is a 7x50, but modern 7x42's are as bright as the 7x50's of thirty years, ago, but the 7x50's still have a larger exit pupil, making it easier to keep the glass trained on target from a moving deck.

Buon voyage to your friend,
Arthur

[etc]

Isn't 7x50 traditional marine binocular configuration?

[jjg213]

Hi Rob, IMHO the most practical size for most boating activities is still 7x50. In that size the Fujinon Polaris series can be obtained with or without a built-in compass. It is a heavy (1.4Kilos), relatively expensive, waterproof, rugged design with (nearly) flat field, long eye relief and very bright image. That company also makes a lighter version, also available with a built-in compass called the Oceanic CX, it lacks some of the best features of the Polaris, but is much more economical. I own both, and while my sailing is MUCH less ambitious than your friends, I find either of them most satisfactory. That said, there are a lot of other waterproof 7x50's on the market that would do a good job, I'm sure.
I have no connection with the Fujinon company other than that of a satisfied customer!
Regards, John

[stereotruckdriver]

I recently got to try a Nikon marine binocular that an individual was using for wildlife observation. It was 7x50, felt very solid. If you can view through Nikon Action EX you will have an idea as to the optical performance not bad but not great! Porro's or roof's in any configuration below 10x will work, 8x50,8x43,8x42,8x40,7x50 etc... Just make sure it is water-proof. Traditionaly porro's were used and the ones still designed today Fuji,Nikon and the like are built like a tank, though I would opt for a better built roof prism! Stereo...

[mooreorless]

Check this website.
http://www.captainsnautical.com/ Be sure to read Bill Cook's article there: http://www.captainsnautical.com/product.asp?Product_Id=47706

They should be water proof, and have a large exit pupil. 7 x 42 is a good format.

Calm Seas!

Bob

BTW, Bill Cook KNOWS binoculars! He's a retired US Navy Chief Opticalman and posts often on this forum and the Binocular forum of "Cloudy Nights."

Hi Bob I agree with all you say about this and on this site there is this model http://www.captainsnautical.com/product.asp?Product_Id=47707 not real pretty but from reports of people that have them they like this binocular. There is also a review for these on CN and here it is: http://www.cloudynights.com/item.php?item_id=1633
Regards,Steve

[ceasar]

Steve,
That's a great review from Kenny. Makes me want to go out and buy one too! Hope he's back soon.
Bob

[mooreorless]

Bob, Yes I miss him too, I also agree about the review.
Steve

[Microtus]

Thanks, guys. My friend is now monitoring this thread.

[bosun]

I don't wish to be a wet blanket, but the fact that your friend needs to ask the question causes me to wonder whether he is sufficiently experienced to be attempting a transatlantic crossing. (Unless he has seriously experienced people on board with him).

My advice is to go for CHEAP 7x50. They will suffer salt water splashes, possible immersion and possibly being dropped overboard, none of which is much fun when they cost a lot of money.

You can get cheap "sailing binoculars" (often made in China), sealed, Nitrogen purged (to eliminate condensation & fogging), yellow (so that you can see them in the water) with a flotation strap (so you have some chance of getting them back if you drop them in the water) and a built in compass (for taking bearings). These would be my best recommendation.

I also have a tiny pair of 6x18 Nikula waterproof Nitrogen purged binoculars (also yellow with a flotation strap) which are very handy for immediate use.

It is close to impossible to properly waterproof binoculars that have central focussing so it is better to go for individual eye piece focussing.

[etc]

I think in a journey of this magnitude, I would want something better quality..

Maybe a cheap, compact backup?

[ThoLa]

I think in a journey of this magnitude, I would want something better quality..

Maybe a cheap, compact backup?

this one maybe:
http://www.zeiss.de/C12567A80033F8E4/Contents-Frame/436FD37CCBF86D1941256A690045E754

hard to beat on a boat,
I suppose

[etc]

the link is broken

[NoSpringChicken]

There are some rather tasty Steiner models. I don't think they will be cheap though. ;)

http://www.steiner-binoculars.com/binoculars/marine/marine.html

Ron

[ThoLa]

the link is broken

?????

just click; works fine (on my steam engine at least).
Tom

If not, try zeiss.com
A few clicks from there you'll find the 7x50 Marine (non-magnetic!).

[mooreorless]

?????

just click; works fine (on my steam engine at least).
Tom

If not, try zeiss.com
A few clicks from there you'll find the 7x50 Marine (non-magnetic!).

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/63634-USA/Zeiss_525505_7x50_B_GA_T_I_F_.html

Tom,Have you ever tried that one? I would love to.

Regards,Steve

[ThoLa]

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/63634-USA/Zeiss_525505_7x50_B_GA_T_I_F_.html

Tom,Have you ever tried that one? I would love to.

Regards,Steve


no, sorry.
They have individual eye focussing which is not quite the right thing for wildlife observations. Perfect for astronomy, though.
I love the Porro design. Unfortunately this is the last porro model Zeiss offers, if I am not wrong. Given their usual level of excellence, I guess it will be truly impressive. If they had an alternative version with central focussing, .... (sigh).

If you have a chance to try it, give us a report, please.

Best regards, Tom

[mooreorless]

Hi Tom, Unless the local Amish Shoe Shop has one, they have Zeiss Fl series, I doubt I would ever see these to try.:-( B&H doesn't stock these by the looks of it.
Regards,Steve

[ThoLa]

Hi Tom, Unless the local Amish Shoe Shop has one, they have Zeiss Fl series, I doubt I would ever see these to try.:-( B&H doesn't stock these by the looks of it.
Regards,Steve

Tricky ....
It's not one of the regular models.
Maybe you can ask a shop if they can get one for inspection. Swarovski is willing to send out items for inspection, but I am not sure about Zeiss in this respect.

Shops that equip yachts may have it (?). Maybe there's a posh marina around?

It sure looks very solid. Good luck with your purchase.
Thomas

[Pinewood]

Hello,

I have access to one which is about four years old, but I would like some suggestions about what the report should contain. It is great for astronomy from areas with dark skies, but I live within 2.2 km. of Times Square. It was described as no compromise design by a friend. Unlike the Fujinon, distortions are much less pronounced but distortions are not that big a deal on the ocean.

Happy observing,
Arthur

[jjg213]

Hi Arthur, I did own, and compare the Zeiss 7x50 BGA' and the Fujiunon 7x50FMTR-SX at the same time, I would be surprised if the Fujinons exhibiting distortion were the FMTR series, their top line. They do produce other lines. I found that the Fujinons had a flatter field and both were quite brilliant, but the downside in the comparison was the difference in weight. The Zeiss at about 42 ounces and the Fujinons at about 53 ounces.
Regards, John

[Pinewood]

Hello Jig 212,

I found that the Fujinon 7x50 FMTR-SX made buildings look like they were falling back. The field may have been flat, in focus to the edges, but square objects looked as if they were falling backwards, as I recall. On examining them, I wrote that the view of square buildings were no longer fully square, which is no big problem for either astronomy or marine use.

Happy observing,
Arthur

[ThoLa]

I wrote that the view of square buildings were no longer fully square, which is no big problem for either astronomy or marine use.
Happy observing,
Arthur

Maybe that's the next step in binocular evolution. Heavy instruments with "gravitational lensing".
Relatively general,
Tom

[kabsetz]

Rob,

Having tested and used quite a number of binoculars and also having sailed quite a bit (although never in the Atlantic), I'll offer a suggestion or two based on what I've learned. Sailboats are a special environment, and the requirements are very different from those we encounter on dry land. Instruments are there for real use, and they do tend to get bumped around quite a bit, even with people who otherwise take great care of their gear. With ground under my feet, I prefer image stabilized binoculars, and they have their uses in the boat as well, but I would not have them as my only pair on an ocean-crossing for the simple reason that current models are not yet durable enough to be 100% dependable under extreme conditions. For the same reason, I would avoid cheap porroprism binoculars, or cheap binoculars of any kind. And, it is essential for the binocular to be waterproof. On a boat, it will get wet, and the conditions can be so damp that within a few days a non-waterproof binocular will be so full of internal condensation that you would not see anything with them even if the outsides of the lenses were clean. In a sailboat, binoculars are a safety feature more than anything. If I could have two pairs of binocular in the sailboat, then Canon's 10x42 IS L would be the second one, since with stabilization it will show more detail sooner (from a longer distance) than any conventional marine binocular can. But, I would keep it well stowed inside and only take it out for real need. And since I don't always know ahead of time when the real need arises, there needs to be a trustworthy first-choice binocular always on the deck.

For that one pair that is always within arm's reach on the deck, a sturdy and waterproof 7x is perhaps still the best. If you want one with a compass, the Fujinon FMTR-CSX is really excellent and well proven. If the compass is not necessary, my first choice would be Swarovski SLC 7x42. The SLC is nice, compact, extremely durable, completely waterproof, has first-rate image, and compared to the Fujinon or any marine porro, has a shape that is better in your hands and less likely to get tangled with ropes or clothing. If you were to be standing in the storm with a binocular hanging on your chest, the SLC will also be less uncomfortable and lighter than 7x50 marine porros.

Finer points of image quality are pretty much irrelevant in a boat that rocks and sways almost all the time anyway (and if it does not, it is also not moving very fast so there is no rush to see the smallest details). Perhaps the most important aspects are brightness (during the night) and good flare suppression (when viewing against the glare of the sunlit waves). In both regards, the Swarovski and the Fujinon are first rate.

Kimmo

[Microtus]

My friend and I again thank you for all your responses.

Rob