Zeiss Conquest bins

[John Cantelo]

Launched in November, according to bumf I've seen, these bins do not seem to have surfaced in the UK yet. Has anyone seen them? What are they like? Are they any better than similar models at a lower price sporting a less fashionable name? John Cantelo

[mak]

Arrived in the UK in the 3rd week of December 2003. 10x30BT*, 12x45BT* & 15x45BT* are available now, the 8x30 BT* should be here any time now.

[ps11aj]

I bought the 10x30 and I must say that I am pleased with them. They are small and easy to carry and they feel very robust. They are brighter than for example SWIFT Audubon 8,5x44 HHS and they are very sharp. I could not see any difference in brightness between these binoculars and much more expensive ones in the same size. The field of view is maybe not so great but it is a middle prise binocular so you can't get everything. I think they are very price worthy.
Pierre

[Andy Bright]

I tried the 10x30 last weekend and was very impressed by these lightweight binos. Close focus seemed very good, as did light gathering and general clarity.

[John Cantelo]

Pierre commented that the new Zeiss 10x30 Conquests are "are brighter than for example SWIFT Audubon 8,5x44 HHS and they are very sharp". This is quite extraordinary given the lesser power and greater OG size of the Audubons and indicates to me at least that they must be astonishingly good instruments. Personally, I'd wait until they bring out x8 or x10 bins in the 45mm range instead of the absurdly over powered bins they propose,
John

[ps11aj]

Pierre commented that the new Zeiss 10x30 Conquests are "are brighter than for example SWIFT Audubon 8,5x44 HHS and they are very sharp". This is quite extraordinary given the lesser power and greater OG size of the Audubons and indicates to me at least that they must be astonishingly good instruments. Personally, I'd wait until they bring out x8 or x10 bins in the 45mm range instead of the absurdly over powered bins they propose,
John

It did suprise me to. However; I had the opportunity to compare and saw it with my own eyes. It might be the difference in colour that has fouled me. The Swift was more yellow than the Zeiss but I did compare in dark conditios. I think I will find out if I have wrong, soon in this forum. But the reason I choosed them was the smaller size and lighter weight.
Pierre

[Tim Allwood]

can't see them being £700 or £800 better than what is available already.......

only 15 quid to join OBC!

[mak]

can't see them being £700 or £800 better than what is available already.......

only 15 quid to join OBC!

The RRP in the UK is £350, £380, £430 & £460 for the 8x30, 10x30, 12x45, 15x45.
Where does the £700 bit come in?

[ps11aj]

I gave 6000 sek (swedish crowns) for mine. Prices in Sweden is higher than in UK so this is midle price class here.
I work at least half of my time outdoors so I want small binoculars that does not interfear with my work and I found the Zeiss conquest 10x30 small inoff and still having very good optics. But of course bigger ones should be brighter. However I found these bright inoff to choose the 10x instead of the 8x.
Pierre

[DHB]

I just received a pair of the 8x30 Zeiss Conquest and the previous comments are correct. Very, very sharp and very bright. Here are my likes and dislikes so far:
1- very sharp, like razor sharp.
2- bright, bright as my 8x42 Eagle Optic Platinum Rangers.
3- perfect focus ratio- not to fine not to course.
4- Light, I'm not sure if they are as light as advertised but nice.

1- Lack of clarity at the outer most 15-20% of the edges.
2- some glare on oculars lens' with sun at your back or odd angles.
3- focus knob should have same armoring as body (a little larger would've helped too) it would make it easier to turn.
4- cheap rain guard and no obj lens covers.

Dave

[ps11aj]

I just received a pair of the 8x30 Zeiss Conquest and the previous comments are correct.
Dave
The main reason that I choosed the 10x30 was that I couldn't wait for the 8x30 to arrive. I haven't have any reason to regret i yet. These binoculars feels very steady in my hands and are also bright.

[DHB]

I sent my 8x30's (Conquest) back to Zeiss for inspection. The glare or flaring or reflection was totally annoying. I don't know if they are defective but Zeiss should receive them today. I will post the results.
Dave

[Steve Napier]

I would love to try the 15x45 Conquest model on the Moon.
I have a pair of cheap 20x60 Tento binoculars that were bought specificaly for Lunar observation.
A 15x magnification with Zeiss quality in a compact 45mm instrument sounds amazing.
Does anyone know why these are a LOT cheaper than other Zeiss models?
Thankyou
Steve.

[Leif]

Does anyone know why these are a LOT cheaper than other Zeiss models?


I suspect that were you to compare them to something comparable but twice the price, you would see that they produced an image that was not quite as bright, not quite as high resolution, not quite as high contrast, with more edge distortion and softness. It might also be that the build quality is not as high as the best, and they are not quite so durable. In other words they probably produce a decent image and perform well, but not quite as well as the best. In optics you tend to pay a lot for small gains.

[normjackson]

I dare say there has been some "streamlining of production costs"; less parts, cheaper materials, simpler assembly. Currently doesn't appear to be a step too far in that direction, though, as perhaps the Diafun was. Seem to recall reading somewhere that the Diafun was assembled, or maybe even completely manufactured in Eastern Europe to help cut costs.

[Leif]

I dare say there has been some "streamlining of production costs"; less parts, cheaper materials, simpler assembly. Currently doesn't appear to be a step too far in that direction, though, as perhaps the Diafun was. Seem to recall reading somewhere that the Diafun was assembled, or maybe even completely manufactured in Eastern Europe to help cut costs.

I think the Diafun was made in Hungary. Zeiss make a point of indicating that the FL is made in Germany! I heard that Leica have production facilities in Germany and Portugal and some people have the perception, real or imagined, that the quality is higher in Germany. Maybe one of the big manufacturers will ship production out to China and then costs should drop a lot, assuming the savings are passed on. There are some amazingly cheap but useable optics already coming out of China and favoured by amateur astronomers.

The car industry shows that made in Eastern Europe need not mean inferior quality, and in fact the converse can be the case c.f. Skoda and Volkswagon which are both owned by the same company and share some components.

[Curtis Croulet]

I guess it's just me, but if I buy an expensive binocular bearing the name of a legendary German optics company like Zeiss or Leica, then I expect the product to be made in Germany. Merely being "made to the same high standards" in some other country with cheap labor doesn't cut it for me. I'm spending extra bucks over, say, Pentax and Nikon, not just for the German name, but also for the fact that it's made in Germany.

As for Chinese optics -- a personal friend of mine makes and sells reflecting telescopes. His ads appear frequently in the American astronomy magazines Sky & Telescope and Astronomy. The primary and secondary mirrors in his scopes are made in his own factory. He is competing (with difficulty) with several companies whose scopes use Chinese mirrors. He attempted to lower costs by importing his diagonals from China, but the quality was so poor, he rejected the entire shipment and returned to making his own. Yet other brands are using these same diagonals right now. The Nov 2004 issue of Sky & Telescope has a review of a Chinese-made scope whose optics would have never left my friend's factory, or would be replaced if they accidentally slipped through. So I'm skeptical about Chinese optics!

[Leif]

So I'm skeptical about Chinese optics!

There must be a lot of variation and I suspect it depends on the quality control for each item. For example the Synta maksutovs are said to be very decent with many reviews all expressing surprise at the performance and low cost.

[Jonathan B.]

I guess it's just me, but if I buy an expensive binocular bearing the name of a legendary German optics company like Zeiss or Leica, then I expect the product to be made in Germany.

The Leica BC/BCA line (8x20, 10x25) is made in Portugal, and was made there prior to the name change from E. Leitz to Leica. I believe the 32mm and larger Trinovids have been made in Germany all along, as are the Ultravids.

I could not say that my 8x20 is less well-made than any other Leica binocular. It performs on a par with 8x20s from Zeiss, Swarovski, and Nikon.

[Curtis Croulet]

I'm surprised nobody has come back to challenge me with, "How do you know your 'Made in Germany' binoculars are really made in Germany?" Answer: I don't. For all I know, most of the parts are made in Malaysia or somewhere and it's only assembled in Germany.

[Steve Napier]

Leif,
I agree that you have to pay for the VERY best quality optics.
It was a bit surprising to find that a company of the stature of Zeiss release binoculars that are NOT of the highest possible standards both opticaly and mechanicaly.I didnt realize Zeiss done this so,thanks for the information.
As for the Chinese optics. they do not even come close to the top of the range REFRACTOR optics of companies like TMB,ASTRO-PHYSICS,TAKAHSHI,and TELEVUE.
These companies DONT release telescopes that are optically inferior,Im very surprised Zeiss do.
Thankyou
Steve.

[hinnark]

Leif,
I agree that you have to pay for the VERY best quality optics.
It was a bit surprising to find that a company of the stature of Zeiss release binoculars that are NOT of the highest possible standards both opticaly and mechanicaly.I didnt realize Zeiss done this so,thanks for the information.
As for the Chinese optics. they do not even come close to the top of the range REFRACTOR optics of companies like TMB,ASTRO-PHYSICS,TAKAHSHI,and TELEVUE.
These companies DONT release telescopes that are optically inferior,Im very surprised Zeiss do.
Thankyou
Steve.

Steve,

I don´t understand your point. Which products of Zeiss are inferior and comparing to which other product? AFAIK Zeiss Conquest binoculars are made in Hungary. Why shouldn´t a company like Zeiss offering binos for the mid range market? Maybe it´s not a bad idea not to let this market for Japanese manufactorers alone. Nikon for example is offering products from cheap to high quality. Maybe Zeiss was angry about the success of Minox in this part of the optical market ;) I like best quality optics too but there are some people who can´t or don´t want to spend the money that is needed for the very best.

But if a company with high quality reputation is producing in foreign countries the customers have to be sure that quality controll is working very tight.

Steve

[normjackson]

Maybe we've been watching too much coverage of the American elections (just teasing). Inferior is a comparative term, so taken out of context the line "Zeiss produce inferior optics" sounds rather like something a politician might say.
Can't be too many companies who can focus entirely on producing state of art products. They'd probably need to be a company of cottage industry size cf Leica, Zeiss etc. with a backlog of orders runnning into years. Didn't the reality of marketing mean that Al Nagler had to develop a reputation for his company producing Plossls before he was prepared to release his new premium price eyepieces bearing his name onto the market. And didn't he later chose to move Televue production of those Plossls to the far East to remain competitive. And what about the excellent but less than state of the art scope the Ranger the company produced to capture a new market.
At the moment looks as though in these new Conquest bins Zeiss may have produced something highly competitive in their price range. That seems a laudable achievement.

[Atomic Chicken]

Greetings!

I just checked my Zeiss Victory Compact 8X20's, and they have "Made by Carl Zeiss in Hungary" on the underside label. Kind of surprised me... I always assumed they were made in Germany. Are all Zeiss Victory Compact binoculars made in Hungary? Or is this a recent changeover?

Best wishes,
Bawko

[Leif]

It is a bit odd to criticise Zeiss for producing a mid-range product, though I guess this is all about brand management. I get the impression that in the birding world Nikon do not have the cachet of Leica and this might be because they also produce 'budget' binoculars. Thus the Nikon logo does not guarantee premium quality. Some companies avoid this 'cheapening of the brand' by creating another brand. Thus Lexus is a posh Toyota. Maybach is a very posh Mercedes or Volkswagon (I forget which). I think Minox and Leica are somehow linked, with Minox producing mid-range kit and Leica premium.

Anyway Leica are in some trouble as the digital revolution is cutting sales of their high end photographic optics.

[Steve Napier]

Hi Lads.
I didnt critcise Zeiss for these Binoculars,I merely thought that Zeiss made ALL their Binoculars to the highest possible standards.I wasnt aware that they made mid price models.
Now,thanks to your replies I do know.
Televue no longer produce the Ranger and Pronto models.
Thanks,
Steve.

[normjackson]

Hope you didn't start feeling the gang were turning up on you, Steve. Maybe we should try to organise a kick*ss weekend in Rochdale, check out some serious optics :
www.pennineonline.com
then maybe trash a few police cars ;)

All the best.

[rosharb]

I sent my 8x30's (Conquest) back to Zeiss for inspection. The glare or flaring or reflection was totally annoying. I don't know if they are defective but Zeiss should receive them today. I will post the results.
Dave
While doing a search I found this, did they fix your binocular to your satisfaction? I just bought the same binocular and had that problem and also sent them to Zeiss in the US and they sent them to Germany to be repaired.

[PYRTLE]

It is a bit odd to criticise Zeiss for producing a mid-range product, though I guess this is all about brand management. I get the impression that in the birding world Nikon do not have the cachet of Leica and this might be because they also produce 'budget' binoculars. Thus the Nikon logo does not guarantee premium quality. Some companies avoid this 'cheapening of the brand' by creating another brand. Thus Lexus is a posh Toyota. Maybach is a very posh Mercedes or Volkswagon (I forget which). I think Minox and Leica are somehow linked, with Minox producing mid-range kit and Leica premium.

Anyway Leica are in some trouble as the digital revolution is cutting sales of their high end photographic optics.

Afraid I agree with Leif.......for example, the Nikon ED 50mm is a fantastic piece of kit given its size, price against performance - but AHHHHHRRRRRR -ITS MADE IN CHINA! Gadzooks!
I have been testing this for several months and will add one to my collection of pure optics such as Zeiss 8x32 FLs and Swarovski 65HD scope.

Personally I don't see a problem. Of note - Components for Leica eyepieces are made by subcontractors outside of Germany..eg Portugal/Czech Republic?/Hungary.......will this make Leica televid owners recoil in horror and get rid of their optics.. I don't think so.

Zeiss Conquests in 45 mm spec have been available in the UK for at least six months - overall, they are a very good mid priced roof prism but not as good as FLs.....you pay your money etc.

Happy birding.

[Otto McDiesel]

Zeiss Conquests in 45 mm spec have been available in the UK for at least six months - overall, they are a very good mid priced roof prism but not as good as FLs.....you pay your money etc.

Happy birding.

I think that the Conquests are not as good as the older ClassicC T*P* either, but there may be eyecups issues there with eyeglass wearers.

[Otto McDiesel]

While doing a search I found this, did they fix your binocular to your satisfaction? I just bought the same binocular and had that problem and also sent them to Zeiss in the US and they sent them to Germany to be repaired.

You can still find the ClassicC T P 8x30, and they are better than the Conquest, in my opinion.

[bodromarsh]

I checked out a pair of Zeiss Conquest at Cabela's in Buda Texas, and was appalled at their lack of quality. Basically all I saw were halos of light all over the view. I am sure this was due to the binoculars, and not the store's lighting as I have tested many other binoculars there.

As an aside, the Zeiss Conquest rifle scopes are "Assembled in USA" and have as good an image as the Diavari rifle scopes costing twice as much.

[Otto McDiesel]

I checked out a pair of Zeiss Conquest at Cabela's in Buda Texas, and was appalled at their lack of quality. Basically all I saw were halos of light all over the view. I am sure this was due to the binoculars, and not the store's lighting as I have tested many other binoculars there.

As an aside, the Zeiss Conquest rifle scopes are "Assembled in USA" and have as good an image as the Diavari rifle scopes costing twice as much.

i'll second that about binos and riflescopes. I think that the Conquest binoculars are just inexpensive components and coatings, probably nothing wrong with them being assembled in Hungary.

[Tero]

I have had the 10x42 Conquests for half a year now. I mainly get use out of them in winter, as I use 8x a lot in summer and spring.

The optics are overall better than my Monarch 10x42s. However, they have two problems.
1 Glare at sun rise and sun set. No problem on cloudy winter days
2 hard eye cups
http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=83092

I was aware of these problems right away and could have sent them back. However, for this price I did not what else I would get. The warranty is good, and the overall build is quite solid. I expect these to work pretty much the same for 10-20 years.

Sometimes I go out with two pairs, and if I carry a 8x32 around my neck, and some other 10x in the back pack, it is usually the Monarchs at 20-21 oz. On most outings I do not even take them out. But I carry them as I am too lazy to carry a scope more than half a mile.

[Paul Godolphin]

I sent my 8x30's (Conquest) back to Zeiss for inspection. The glare or flaring or reflection was totally annoying. I don't know if they are defective but Zeiss should receive them today. I will post the results.
Dave

Dave, I've been watching this thread for a long time now, waiting to see your results. I can't find them. Forgive me if I've overlooked the posting of these promised results. I have also commented on this characteristic of the 8x30 Conquest (it's much worse on the 10x30) so I am eager to hear the outcome.
Did you post it somewhere?
Paul

[Robert / Seattle]

Dave, I've been watching this thread for a long time now, waiting to see your results. I can't find them. Forgive me if I've overlooked the posting of these promised results. I have also commented on this characteristic of the 8x30 Conquest (it's much worse on the 10x30) so I am eager to hear the outcome.
Did you post it somewhere?
Paul

Paul,

I would guess that not very much happened as this "flaring" is an unrepairable characteristic in all Zeiss binoculars I've tried -- including the FLs and the ClassiC T* B/GA. Under field test conditions my Swarovski 8x32s show much less flare, and my Leica Ultravids show almost none. The best solution is to cup one's "free" hand over the affected occular(s) as if providing a lens hood. This does work surprisingly well.

Robert

[KorHaan]

Hi all,

I had an opportunity to obtain a Zeiss Conquest 10x30 today, for half price, at an opticians store. New in the box.
They had an annoyingly stiff focuser, one of the worst I've ever seen. Using the bins was near to impossible. This is the second sample of CQ 10x30 with a bad focuser I tried in a year; I've tried three so far and only one had an acceptably smooth focus wheel. Not great, but acceptable.

Of course I did not buy them, I wouldn't want to have them for free as far as I'm concerned; but it is beyond my comprehension these bins pass Zeiss' quality control.
It makes you wonder if there's any q.c. whatsoever?


These things are sold for 700 Euros, who would want to buy this rubbish?
Instead I bought a nice Bynolyt Buzzard 10x42 roof for half price ( 243 Euros ).

Greetings, Ronald

[Tero]

I have had the 10x42 Conquests for half a year now. I mainly get use out of them in winter, as I use 8x a lot in summer and spring.

The optics are overall better than my Monarch 10x42s. However, they have two problems.
1 Glare at sun rise and sun set. No problem on cloudy winter days
2 hard eye cups
http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=83092

I was aware of these problems right away and could have sent them back. However, for this price I did not what else I would get..
In hindsight, the Pentax 10x43 DCF SP would also have been a good choice, and with the lighter weight, I would probably choose them now. On the other hand, the Zeiss, with trnasferrable warranty, have good resale value. The glare I do not worry about now in winter, for a good 4 months to come.

[Paul Godolphin]

I sent my 8x30's (Conquest) back to Zeiss for inspection. The glare or flaring or reflection was totally annoying. I don't know if they are defective but Zeiss should receive them today. I will post the results. Dave

HI all
Dave just sent the following result:


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Re: Conquest returned: Your results?
Sorry Paul. Zeiss said there was nothing wrong so I had Zeiss return them to the vendor I bought them from. Maybe a combination of my facial structure and the bino's. Not sure but they were unusable for me.
Dave

[Robert / Seattle]

HI all
Dave just sent the following result:


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Re: Conquest returned: Your results?
Sorry Paul. Zeiss said there was nothing wrong so I had Zeiss return them to the vendor I bought them from. Maybe a combination of my facial structure and the bino's. Not sure but they were unusable for me.
Dave

Just as I predicted (post #36, above).

[Paul Godolphin]

Just as I predicted (post #36, above).

Yep, no surprise Robert. That was my #1 post on the review of the 8x30 too. I've got used to it now, but it would certainly spoil the binoc for other folk. I think they're 'throwaway' instruments (rather like a disposable cigarette lighter) so I don't care. But if I'd paid out for FL's I'd be pretty sick about it.
Tupperware indeed.......
Paul