I think this might be a good idea

[the_handy_andy]

I think my earlier idea of trying to build a list of who makes what and for whom (8-P) is probably a bit of a non starter / needle in haystack / can or worms. But I am going to give up.!!! This forum presents an ideal oportunity to provide information for someone looking to buy a good pair of bins

So here is an alternative....how about some sort of top 20 makes list (OK it could be top 15 but not top 10 as I think that is too few). Ok we would probably have to have different lists for different geographical regions as not all make are available in all regions but we wouldprobably find that there would be some cross over due to the similarity between models.

There is a very good point to doing this (actually there is more than one).

1. There are too few reviews (ok reviews are subjective but they give a good starting point)
2. People would know what to avoid if they cannot easilly try before buying.

So here are my thoughts on a possible top 20 for the UK (in no particular order)

Leica
Ziess
Swarovski
Opticron
Swift
Bushnell
Hawke
Vortex
Nikon
Pentax
Minox
Meopta
Canon
Kowa
Viking/RSPB
Olympus
Meade/Simmons/Bresser
Kahles
Konus
Celestron

OK I struggled to fill 20 slots so some makes are in the list based on my experience of other products (astro scopes).

Sothing else that could be done is that each of the top 20 is given some sort of code that they make good budget / mid-price / high-end bins (budget = A, mid-price = B and high-end = C). The way things are at the moment the budget could be up to 250 to 300 (GBP, Euros, USD) mid-price up to 600 to 650 and high-end 651+.

Just to show I've thought this through if someone in the top 20 produces mainly budget bins which have a mid-price performance then a double letter system could be used. So for example:

Brand W - A(A) B(B) C(C)
Brand X - A(B)
Brand Y - B(C)
Brand Z - C(C)

Of course:

Brand A - B(A)!!
Brand B - C(A)!!!!!!!!

Of course if they were top 20 this wouldn't happen

Ideas? or am I barking up the wrong tree again?

Andrew

PS It could fo course be top 5/6 in each price band

PPS I emailed someone local about what they have in stock....the phrase diddly squat springs to mind

PPPS If we come across a good review post it on here

[Kevin Conville]

Ideas? or am I barking up the wrong tree again?


Why don't you be handy, Andy, and give this up?
It's still an exercise in futility, I think.

Cheers, B (:

[dustyview]

Don't be discouraged, Andy. I've noticed in my short time on BF that there are some crotchety guys here who seem to have little better to do than shoot down others. I agree that some kind of a buyers guide (with regular updates) might be of great help to people who find the forum because they are looking for good binoculars of a certain type or focal length. Your system might be a bit complicated, but I appreciate the direction you're going.

EDIT: My comments above were meant to be read at least somewhat humorously (hence the word crotchety), and not to cause great offense. My apologies to Kevin and/or anyone else who was offended. I felt Andy was making a sincere attempt at trying to simplify some "what to buy" information for forum visitors who probably don't have any intention of trying ten pair of binoculars in order to find one that is just right for them... ;) . You can put me in the same category of crotchetiness (sp?) if you want, after posting this message.

[CLRobles]

Andy.... Where's your Docter Optic! Easily in the top ten but left off you list? That's OK Andy, very overlooked here in the States too....

[Kevin Conville]

You can characterize me that way if you want Dusty, but I see this as starting an endless thread that has no consensus, and will get off topic countless times. The scope is too broad, opinions too varied, people's wants and needs too different.

Maybe you and Andy need to read more of the existing and recent threads before you sign off on this as being a useful idea. "Try before you buy" and "everyone is different" are common mantras here, and for good reason. There are many variables that make up a good binocular and everyone places a little bit different weight to each of them. Some are quite intangible, like ergonomics.
I would make the case that it's fairly naive to presume to create a list of bins with a value placed upon them based on some universally accepted standard. I'm afraid you'll wind up having to conclude what bin is best for you on your own, like everyone else, without a list to do it for you.

[FrankD]

I admire your tenacity but have to respectfully agree with the others for both some of the same reasons and for some different ones. The main issue I see with your idea is that there are so many models of varying quality within any given manufacturer (with the exception of some high end models). How many Opticron models are there? How many Bushnell? Some are very good in my opinion and some are quite poor.

Then there is the issue of customer service. The customer service for one company might be perfectly fine now but was poor in the past. You have to factor in customer service and/or warranty issues when rating a company on their products in my opinion.

What I think would be useful and what has already been started here on the forum is a "one liner review" thread of various bins that individuals have owned. I forget who started it or how far back in the pages it is now but I thought it was very useful. One could read through the pages and get a general consensus on the quality/experience of a particular bin.

Just a thought. Maybe it is time tor ressurect that thread. I certainly need to add to it.

;)

[Steve C]

Andy,

I think everybody has been at the same place as you are now. It can be both maddening as well as frustrating to try and figure out optics choices. Nothing much worse than buying the wrong binocular.

At the risk of sounding "crotchety", this will lead nowhere. Your list is not one that will find any sort of universal acceptance. Neither will any list I make find any universal acclaim, or anybody else's list either. There are too many choices and people are simply too different in their personal tastes to rank something like that. Look at it this way. If there was a universally acclaimed best binocular (even expanding that into a best for price category and size class), that is all anybody would buy and the only choice we'd all have. Drudgery!

[Kevin Purcell]

"Try before you buy" and "everyone is different" are common mantras here, and for good reason. There are many variables that make up a good binocular and everyone places a little bit different weight to each of them. Some are quite intangible, like ergonomics.


"All binoculars are compromises" pretty much sums up this viewpoint. It's one I hold too.

Perhaps the most useful mantra just after "try before you buy" (or "buy from someone you can return the bins to if you don't like them" which doesn't quite have the same style).

[FrankD]

Your thoughts on revising the original suggestion Andy?