International Birding on no budget! lol!

[nightheron28]

Hey everyone,

I was just wondering if there are some of you out there that like me are just struggling in life, but still manage to find an interest in birds and birding and despite your best efforts it seems that all your denaro, pounds goes into bills with little (i mean little left) for birding I mean I can barely afford the gas/petrol to get to birding locations. What have you done or what kind of strategy did you use to get to exotic birding locations. When I say exotic I mean other countries where you can litterally increase your list by the hundreds if you spent a few days there. For me going to somewhere in south america, Europe, Australia, Asia, Middle East (oh wait I am whiter that a sheet and american, cant go there lol!), anyway going to these places would literally give me hundreds of birds.

Or do I just have to wait it out and win the lottery lol!

Thanks.

[tom mckinney]

All sentiments echoed!

You can do it, but it requires lots of careful planning. If you want to do a foreign trip on an extreme budget then what you need above all else is lots of time. You see people doing North India, China, Peru in 10-14 days and think "WOW that must be easy." Then of course you discover that they are flying everywhere, using guides and hiring drivers. Aim for 3 times the length it takes an organised trip for your own schedule.

I did North India for a month when I was an undergrad student living on a total of £6,000 for the whole year. I covered everything that the big tour groups do and got almost as good a trip list, but it just took a lot longer to do. Where people would fly we would go by bus. Where groups drove to special sites off the beaten track we would either walk or hire a bike.

It was huge fun. My advice would be to beg, borrow and steal to scrape enough together to do it.

Have fun!

[Tim Allwood]

worked as an English Teacher abroad, Indonesia and Greece. Good way to see a place and a few birds.

Foreign trips are cheap - only real expense is the flight. Some countries are very cheap. Peru for example, the Manu Road - best birding in the world perhaps costs nothing, just your food. Maybe a couple of dollars to pitch a tent next to one of the very few buildings on it. Most 'developing' countries have cheap hotels, very cheap food (I recently ate very well in Sri Lanka for less than 50p a day).

Do it yourself, save some cash and savour the experience. Tour groups dash everywhere madly. No fun. Hardest thing is to get the time.

Great birds, great people, great experiences, great food and drink. Adds to the richness of life.

[Tero]

If the climate is OK, bicycles and youth hostels may work. Try summer, or go really south.

[Tim Allwood]

yep Tero

South America (Peru and Ecuador are good value)

Anywhere in the Orient is pretty good. Indonesia is wonderful, very cheap and the birds are disappearing fast. Whole Indian subcontinent is very good value, as are Cambodia adn Vietnam Once you take the plunge you realise just how easy it really is. And once tried, everyone goes back for more it seems

[Botaurus]

There is a guy from the UK who founded a network of birding folks that try to cut costs by traveling together. And there is an other site, that is for people living near interesting places and willing to help others as free guides and hosts. I dont know if it is allowed to link to sites like this here...

Best you google for "budget birder" and for "birding pal", and you will find them and their concepts soon. I do not know if it is really good tho', I have no personal experiances with any clubs like this, just have known the guy who founded the budget-birding club online for some time on a now defunct forum, and I think he is a very nice and trustable person. :-)

[Hanno]

That is exactly why I went into the hotel business. I get to travel the world, and am being paid doing so (OK, the 16-hour work-days are not always ideal for birding, but I do get my fair share in.) As Tim said, Asia can be extremely cheap. I figure you could survive on less than USD 20.00 a day here in Vietnam, and that includes lodging, fodd, and a couple of beers after a day's birding. And follow Botaurus' advice by visiting 'Birding Pal".

[Tim Allwood]

http://birdingpal.org/

[jurek]

I don't know what your situation is. If you have young children or a member of family who needs medical care, I can do little to help you.

The general advice to get rich is don't buy things which cost you futher money (like big house or car where you pay maintenance, repair etc.) but buy things which bring you more money (like self-education or shares). Still not worked for me, yet :)

Tropical birding IS cheap. Lots of Asian and S.American countries cost $10-$30 per day with budget lodging and ground transport and have fantastic birds, sights and are safe.

1. Look at Lonely Planet website and guides for info on expenses etc.

2. Look in Internet for cheapest air tickets.

3. On the spot - go (usually) without a guide, travel by coach or train and stay in budget hotels. But remember not to overstetch yourself. Eat enough, sleep long, beacuse otherwise you will not have a stamina for birding.

4. I assume that you have time. That will repay the lack of guide. Some of the most cracking bird reports come from people who went on their own away from regular birding tour circuit. Example is this Frenchman who discovered Iraq Babblers and Bald Ibis in Syria or another who saw the recently described laughingtrushes in VietNam. See it at worldtwitch website. http://www.worldtwitch.com/ This is good inspiration.

And, end with being serious and on a lighter side: see Vladimir Dinets website. http://dinets.travel.ru/ But don't believe in everything on this particular website. The chop himself admitted that he is coloring.

[nightheron28]

Wow thanks everyone for all the great and wonderful suggestions!

My biggest problem is not that I am materialistic, but having to pay for all these things which are really necessities and having so little left. Things like a car, you would be suprised at how expensive this necessary evil is in this country when you account for insurance/car payment/gas (petrol) costs. I also have rent and utility bills which seem expensive, but is not that bad for this area. I also owe on a $4500 loan.

Plus I have been in kind of a rut lately job wise it has been very slow up until now, luckily I landed this freelance gig which will give me a years worth of work.

I am hoping my new strategy for having a car, (buying reliable used) in about 6 months will pay off and allow me to have more free money since I will not have a car payment. Then it will just be a matter of getting some time off from work.

[Karl J]

If you can afford a plane ticket & cycling is your thing, and personally i can't think of a better or cheaper way to get about, there's plenty of inspiration on the web. Stay in campsites to keep the cost down even further.

Plenty of travel journals on here but I particularly liked this one .... http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/journal/author/?opts=300&author=Rachel_Kimler ... a couple who cycled 300km along the Icefield Parkway in the Rockies towing their 10 month old daughter in a kiddie-trailer. Shows just what can be done if you really want to.

[Tim Allwood]

hey Carlos
thanks for the idea
I've thought of this before.....a bike would have come in handy for me more than a few times in the past....I reckon in many places you could buy a decent bike very cheaply indeed and sell it on at the end of the holiday

[Karl J]

a hugely overlooked means of transportation, in my opinion. Mind you tim i'm not too sure i'd fancy biking through the rainforest ;)

[Tim Allwood]

Hi Carlos

I did use bikes in Way Kanan - they were very poor but i took them out at night when frogmouthing etc - I was a bit scared as there was a tiger in the close vicinity and i figured (probably very mistakenly) that the bike would help me get away if needed.........how stupid is that? I think i would have had no chance.!

many places with forest would be bikable though - Fraser's Hill, Khao Yai (amd many other sites in Thailand, Turkey and Morocco

[Karl J]

I eagerly await your next trip report !

actually some of the old seemingly poor bikes are some of the best you can get. If you can get hold of an old fashioned steel frame bike it'll be far more comfortable than modern aluminium, and last forever. but hardly anyone want steel ones cos they're not fashionable so most have ended up on the dump.

[Tim Allwood]

Carlos,

to digress a moment, I'm after a mountain bike at the moment to bike around Waxham and north norfolk etc.....any good places to pick up a reasonable bike 100-150 or something like that?

[Karl J]

Do you really want a mountain bike ?

First place i'd look for a bike suitable for norfolk roads is Ray Freeman in Norwich. Or Streetlife Cycles has shops in Norwich and Lowestoft.

some of the cheaper ones ie. Apollo bikes from Halfords, are that sort of price bracket but won't last long.

[Keith Reeder]

Tim,

unless you can find a decent 2nd hand "proper" mountain bike a few years old, I'd advise you to keep your money in your wallet.

As Karl suggests, the cheap Halfords/Argos/QVC specials will make your life misery then break - most likely when you're miles from home...

[Tim Allwood]

thanx for the advice - i'll take it! Will look for something 'decent' instead.

and anyone into going it alone and loking for adventure should certainly check out Vladimir Dinets site as mentioned by Jurek above at http://dinets.travel.ru/ I posted a thread on Vlad somewhere on BF recently....

atb
Tim

[erik]

You know, having not that much money myself i am still planning on biking to Sweden next summer (stil enthusiastic about it though...) If it won't work out, hitch-hiking is a good option here in europe. We now and then have hitch-hiking contests to Paris and it gets u there in 8 hours (Central Netherlands to Paris). And that for no money at all. So for the europeans among us (sorry Nightheron...), hitch-hiking is the way (well at least when ur young coz people tend to take you with them easier.

[Karl J]

Biking to Sweden ... interesting. I'm thinking of touring around in Sweden myself next year for a couple of weeks

Have you got a route worked out erik ?


Don't know if the practise still occurs (i guess maybe not with security etc these days) but it used to be possible to work your passage on container boats ....

[erik]

Hey Karl, no i don't have a route yet, but i'll think i'll go through Germany and Denmark :D

It's just the fact that an aussi friend of my brother, who lives in the Netherlands now, biked to Denmark in three days, past october, just on a simple bike. So i figured if he could do so, why wouldn't i be able to go just a little further...

There has also been this 'Let me stay for a day' project. A dutch guy wanted to see wether he could travel without any budget, so this is what he did: He set up a website and asked people in the Benelux to let him stay for a day and eventually bring him to his next stop, or he would go hitch hiking. He promised those people to write about them in his weblog. It worked really well so after that, he did a worldwide tour and he managed to get addresses all over the world where people would let him stay for a night and a day and feed him. Pretty cool if you can work that out!

[Karl J]

Travelling the world on the promise of a mention on the internet, that's some achievement.

I was thinking about joining the vrienden op de fiets (spelling ?) as that seems to be based on cheap B&B accomodation for cyclists, but never got round to it. Doesn't matter now anyway as i spent all my money moving house and have to stay in campsites when i'm over next week.

[erik]

So will you be in Holland next week? or am i wrong? You did the spelling perfectly btw. Where will you be staying?

[Karl J]

No, you're right i'll be on my way over at the weekend (btw, return ferry & rail travel, from anywhere in East anglia to anywhere in Holland costs £50, about 75 Euro's ... which is pretty cheap in my book)

I haven't made my mind up where exactly to go yet but i've got plenty of ideas .... and a bike.

[Rasmus Boegh]

yep Tero

South America (Peru and Ecuador are good value)

Anywhere in the Orient is pretty good. Indonesia is wonderful, very cheap and the birds are disappearing fast. Whole Indian subcontinent is very good value, as are Cambodia adn Vietnam Once you take the plunge you realise just how easy it really is. And once tried, everyone goes back for more it seems

I couldn't have said it any better than above.

If you can find the money for a plane-ticket the rest can be done rather cheaply if your willing to "rough it" - the top birds are in those localities anyway. I have been on several top bird-tours, but mostly birded independantly in recent years... and it is a much more satisfactory experiance. Going out there, finding the birds yourself. It just requires homework (and is it really work when it's your own interets?). In recent years I have also been on the other side (being the guide) and I must say, that I have a somewhat hard time with the fact that many people who go on these expensive guided tours just put a mark in their book - not having a clue if the guide indeed is right. I actually had a rather laughable experiance in Ecuador where I stumpled upon a guided group. Suddenly the guide pointet; Tanager-finch! A real rarity. Everybody wrote it down in their note-book. Well, in reality it was a Black-capped Hemispingus! The people on the tour didn't seem to have a clue, they were just happy to get their much wanted tick. The guide claimed I was wrong, but when I pished the bird out... Black-capped Hemispingus indeed.

You basically pay for three things when you go on a top birding-tour:

1) The guide - do your homework (localities, voices, ID-features etc.) and you can manage without. For some parts of the world it is a very good idea to practice on the local language (ie. Spanish for South America) before you leave...
2) Top lodges - do you really need warm water in the rainforest? Most (but admittedly not all) localities can be visited via cheap hotels or camping. Do note that there are a few localities around the world where it is downright dangerous to visit without a local contact.
3) Private transportation - in many of these countries there are loads of busses going to every corner of the region. In some out-of-reach areas there are trucks or horses instead, it's all part of the fun! The minus obviously is time/speed: Private transportation usually is faster than getting there yourself. It should perhaps be mentioned that Africa in general is the exception: For many localities you DO need private transportation.

So, choose a country (I would recommend Ecuador, Peru, Venezuela, Brazil, Indonesia, Malaysia or Thailand) and start planning... it's much easier than you think...

[Karl J]

How safe would you consider the countries you recommend, Rasmus ?

[Rasmus Boegh]

How safe would you consider the countries you recommend, Rasmus ?

As safe as the US. By this I mean that most areas are safe as long as you behave according to the culture. A few localities are always "no-go"; 100% off limits. Rather like LA or New York - there are a few neighbourhoods where you just don't go! A combination of a guidebook, your embassy, asking locals and common sence will get you through without trouble (of course pickpockets are a risk as everywhere else). Of course there are a few regions you really should stay away from. Recently these areas have included far northern Ecuador in the vicinity of the border with Colombia, parts of north-central Peru (where small fractions of "Sendoro Luminoso" aka the Shining Path still exist) and northern Sumatra & various other parts of indonesia where there have been civil unrest. I can say the same here as I did earlier; if you do your homework there should be no trouble.

[Tim Allwood]

Echo that Rasmus

the safety question isn't really an issue in most places birders go at the moment. I lived in central Jakarta for two years and never once felt in any danger. I travelled thru eastern Indonesia (Flores etc) when the East Timor business was on and it was peaceful and the people were fine. Just use common sense and avoid obvious danger spots as much as possible as you'll be fine. In many of these places like Indonesian reserves and Manu Road etc there's hardly anyone there to give you any bother anyway. Certainly safer than U.K. and U.S.A these days.

Do it - don't dip!
atb
Tim

[BarbaraM]

To add to the thread - Birding Pal is great - I found it on the Fat Birder website when I was researching birding possibilities in London and stumbled on that site - or you can just search on Birding Pal. I used Birding Pal for my trip to Amsterdam and London and had wonderful folks who took me out in both places. I gave about a months notice on when I would be in the area. Not everyone from the city I was interested in responded (and a number were going to be away when I was going to be in their area) but it was plenty to get great local assistance.

Within days of when I signed up someone contacted me and I took her out. It's designed to be an exchange process so no fair charging a fee for the guiding. One doesn't really need to be an expert but that should probably be made clear to the visitor. One of the folks who helped me out in Amsterdam had gone out with the guy who moderates the list when he was visiting Toronto.

Another idea is to contact birding or birdwatching clubs in the area where you plan to travel. Many of them post trips that they have planned and if the timing is right you can go also.

As for biking - I last rode a bike about 15 years ago but when in Amsterdam last month got talked into taking the train east to a large nature preserve (Nardermeer), and renting a bike - my Birding Pal guides brought their bikes on the train. It was wonderful! Of course Holland is pretty flat... but I'm in fair shape so hills would have been just fine. I did whimp out on renting a bike in Amsterdam and riding through the city to get to an outlying area - the traffic was too intimidating for this 50+ year old, inexperienced, used to fall off the bike nearly every time I rode one person. But I may be more adventurous next opportunity.

Finally, one of the most frequent experiences I had on that trip was talking with folks about all the places they had birded in the US that I have never been to. There is so much diversity of habitat in this country (and continent) that one could just bird the western hemsphere (and folks have done it all on bicycle and by hitchhiking) and see vast numbers of wonderful birds. Barbara

[erik]

Barbara, that is a cool story. Using bikes and trains here in the netherlands is pretty common. During my college years (which ended just some weeks ago) I could travel by all public services for free during the week and with 40% reduction during the weekends, so i could just travel anywhere on free days and go birdwatching. And lookng back on this period of four years i have hardly done that and i regret that so much! But biking is a good alternative eventhough it keeps you closer to home most of the time.

[jurek]

About the general safety and conditions - Lonely Planet website has free online mini-introductions to the countries from the point of view of an independent traveler. Safety, costs, weather, major sights etc.

http://www.lonelyplanet.com/destinations/loc-asi.htm
http://www.lonelyplanet.com/destinations/loc-ame.htm

[nightheron28]

I think my biggest problem is the fact that I am so socially inapt that It would be very hard for me to contact someone in another country and keep their interest long enough to want to show me around. :P

Well anyway these are all awesome ideas and thanks to all that have contributed.

I am really wanting to go to either Australia, Thailand, or South America.

Incidentally if anyone is planning on a trip to one of these places some time in 6 months let me know, maybe if you like my personality we could travel together, maybe make things easier.

[jurek]

Incidentaly, I am probably going to Thailand this November/December. If you feel like it, we can talk on priva.

[Vectis Birder]

Wow thanks everyone for all the great and wonderful suggestions!

My biggest problem is not that I am materialistic, but having to pay for all these things which are really necessities and having so little left. Things like a car, you would be suprised at how expensive this necessary evil is in this country when you account for insurance/car payment/gas (petrol) costs. I also have rent and utility bills which seem expensive, but is not that bad for this area. I also owe on a $4500 loan.

Plus I have been in kind of a rut lately job wise it has been very slow up until now, luckily I landed this freelance gig which will give me a years worth of work.

I am hoping my new strategy for having a car, (buying reliable used) in about 6 months will pay off and allow me to have more free money since I will not have a car payment. Then it will just be a matter of getting some time off from work.
I have EXACTLY the same problem. I am currently lodging with a friend (which does make things a bit cheaper), and running a very old Mazda car which I can't really afford to run. Yet, I am hoping to do a trip at the end of 2005 to either Peru/Ecuador or Northern India - I haven't quite decided which yet.
I have just (in the last few days) got myself a permanent job, paying £7 an hour plus bonuses so hopefully (if I can keep that job!) will be able to accrue enough dosh to get me to one of those places! I do have a Royal Navy pension (had an accident and was forced to leave on medical grounds in 1992) which, although it's not enough to live on (less than £400 a month), does help.

I have just had a succession of temporary jobs, none of them lasting more than a week (partly my fault, partly that being the way temping goes) with gaps of weeks in between and that is very demoralising, but where there's a will, there's a way.

With the new job things are looking up...

[Vectis Birder]

I think my biggest problem is the fact that I am so socially inapt that It would be very hard for me to contact someone in another country and keep their interest long enough to want to show me around. :P

I am really wanting to go to either Australia, Thailand, or South America.
Don't put yourself down! You'll be fine - go for it!

I can really recommend Australia. It's a great place, the people are friendly and the birds are superb. Don't forget to look at the night skies either if you are out in the rural areas - the southern hemisphere night skies are far more impressive than our northern hemisphere ones. Lucky accident of nature for the Aussies, Kiwis and others that live south of the Equator.

Like I said in my above post, I am hoping to do South America or India next year; I haven't decided which, but have a leaning towards South America. If you want to do your trip at the end of 2005 you are welcome to join me.

[nightheron28]

Unfortunately I just got this new job about 2 months ago, so I wont be eligable for vacation until next August more then likely. As of right now I am having to pay off debt, just got a used car that I owe $5,000 on and a student loan with $4,000 on it. I want to get rid of these things to be free to go on a birding trek without worrying that I owe someone.

[Vectis Birder]

Don't know if the practise still occurs (i guess maybe not with security etc these days) but it used to be possible to work your passage on container boats ....
I don't know about working your passage on a ship, but you can certainly pay to travel on a container ship from Europe to Asia and it costs less than an equivalent journey on a cruise ship (world cruise segment, etc). If you have the time it would beat flying and think of all those pelagic birds!

Type "freighter travel" into Google and see what it comes up with.