Hummingbird Attracting Discs, is yours out yet?

[Lilbirdz]

No longer interested in partipating here.

[crickieheather]

Basically it's my old round blue plastic saucer sled from when I was little painted bright red with four yellow flowers painted on it.

Ring any bells?

Yep, looks just like the business end of a Hummingbird Feeder!

I'm a bit confused as to why we'd want to put fake feeders out when we could put out real ones. I mean, I have 2 16oz Hummzingers and one of the Wal-mart blown glass hanging ones. The hummzingers are on opposite sides of my apartment, one on a post, the other on a window mount.
Why would we want to trick them with fake ones?

Edit: Just understood that these things are HUGE. Now I see how they work. :( I have nowhere to put one in an apartment. How do you keep it from killing your grass?

[Lilbirdz]

Hi crickie! It's easy! Patios are made out of concrete, not grass. ;)~

Seriously though, if you wanted to put one out in the grass and you just laid the H.A.D. down on the ground your grass would die if you never moved it around. However, if you made one that sat on a pole much like a bird bath, then the grass wouldn't be effected.

If your apartment complex would permit it you could make a H.A.D. out of a 1/4" piece of plywood or masonite and hang it from a screw or nail in the side of the building by your door. Or if there's a flag post holder you could hang it from that, or even your porch light if there is one.

You'd be suprised by the weird things folks hang in their yards to attract Hummingbirds. Red flags, red ribbons, fake flowers, red windmobiles, flourescent tape, you name it if it's red or orange it's probably used by someone to help lure the little ones to their lawn.

I put out fake flowers around my feeders in the early Spring just to help get the feeders noticed. The Hummers take about a half a second look at the fake flowers and then stick their beaks in the feeders and look at you with a "Hey, I'm no dummy!" look on their faces and then sit down for a nice long drink. They only check out the fake flowers once and then totally ignore them. Once I have some real flowers to put out, the fake ones go back in the garage for the rest of the season.

I also have some brass Hummingbird Sprinklers which have 4" flowers as their tops and I painted those bright fire-engine red too. The little brass Hummingbirds on them I just left as polished brass.

However, I did make a Hummingbird Decoy out of a fallen branch a couple of Summers ago and painted it up like a female Ruby-throated. It's fun to put it out on a feeder. Though I've never seen a Hummer interact with it, I did use it last Fall with a little guy who hadn't figured out what a feeder was yet. I set it on the feeder and stepped back and let him look at it for a few minutes while I pointed at the feeder and said "See, that's where you should go. Come on. You can try it, I guarantee you'll think I'm the greatest friend you'll ever have. It's really good. Nate's Sweetwater makes you go Mmm, mmm, mmm good!" Then after that didn't work I stepped back over to it and as I reached out for the Decoy the little guy's crest feathers shot straight up and he puffed out like a fur ball! So I sat it on another feeder and all his feathers slicked back down into position. It was a hoot and a half! This all happened with the three of us about 5' from one another. The second or third day he had the feeders figured out.

What a great Hummerteacher I am. "pat,pat,pat" "Owe, my shoulder!" hehee!

Here's a pic of the sprinklers...

Brass Rose and Hummer.... http://i12.ebayimg.com/02/i/03/9a/dc/5a_1_b.JPG

Brass Sunflower and Hummer....
http://i4.ebayimg.com/01/i/03/9a/b3/08_1_b.JPG

I bought some of mine from F&M and some from Meijers. They were about $5-7 dollars a piece. I hooked up 6 of them together with some lawn sprinker hose and fittings and made it so that I could just attach my garden hose to it via a quick connect. It's fun to see 'em in action!

Have fun! ~Nate.http://home.comcast.net/~phampton246210mi/Nate/hellobye.gif

[Lilbirdz]

Guess it was the folks at Operation RubyThroat, not the folks at Jouney North....oops.

Here ya go, the seed for the original idea came from here...

Super -Stimulus Project 2003 (http://www.rubythroat.org/FakeFeeder2003.html)

A big THANK YOU goes out to Gary Springer of Carnesville Georgia for his idea back in 2002!

Though I'd opt for solid objects as opposed to fabric or plastic sheeting. Before I wired in the brick, a gust of wind picked up my sled and gave it a good toss one night. I was still up and heard it leave the ground and come crashing back down. Scared the yoohoo out of me! I ran out back and grabbed it as it headed for the fence. The next morning she was all lashed down and from then on stays right where I put it.

I can't imagine how quickly the wind would blow away a bit of fabric left outside! ~Nate.http://home.comcast.net/~phampton246210mi/Nate/hellobye.gif

[humminbird]

Makes no sense to me either - if I want to put out a hummingbird attracting dish it is either going to be a dish they can secure a drink from (read feeder), or a dish they can receive a drink and insects from (read a large patch of catchy flowers, preferably red, in an open area that they can see from miles away. I am not going to lure them in with a useless item they get no benefit from.

Mark
Bastrop, TX

[Katy Penland]

I really and truly don't understand the rationale behind making a huge "attractor" to lure in hummers. For eons, they've been capable of finding the tiniest flowers. Why not just plant hummer-friendly flowers which will have many side benefits to other taxa as well (bees, insects, cover for other birds and animals, etc.)?

If hummers aren't visiting an area where typical nectar feeders are offered (I mean, without the use of lures like fake flowers or HADs), I'd be more interested in finding out why the birds are avoiding the area in the first place.

[Curtis Croulet]

There's a famous hummingbird expert who (I have it on good authority) painted her entire house red!

[KCFoggin]

There's a famous hummingbird expert who (I have it on good authority) painted her entire house red!
I am familiar with a guy who hangs surveyors tape and feeders from trees and you know what? He is usually the first to have the hummers and keeps quite a few through the winter

[humminbird]

Hey Curtis, I think we both know who that famous hummingbird expert is, but I have also heard from the same authority that that famous hummingbird expert has a wonderful hummingbird garden.

Mark Klym
Bastrop, TX

[Lilbirdz]

Hi Curtis! Glad to see you on this forum! Is it Nancy Newfield? That'd be my bet.

I guess those of you who get lots of Hummers or have them year-round don't have a frame of reference for how desperate some of us other Hummbirders get suffering through the winter blahs without them.

Again this is a fun project for people of all ages. I've seen Hummers scan my neighborhood at 50+ feet up in the air. I'll do everything possible (except put red dye in my nectar!) to make sure a migrating Hummer will see my lawn as they pass over.

I get a kick out of it and if you don't get it that's ok. Like I said, I view this as a big freeway sign for Hummingbirds so that they can see it from far away. Remember these things are at least 3 feet in diameter, not 3 inches. Unlike southern states, we won't be able to have plants out safely up here until late April. The benefit for the Hummers is that there's a feeder up at my house (up today @ 2:06PM ~YIPPEE!).

Ruby-throated Hummingbird males migrate a couple weeks ahead of the females and are known to feed from Sapsucker wells in areas where flowers have not yet come into bloom. Which totally describes my neighborhood for the next few weeks. So, if there's a little guy out there surviving on tree sap and little gnats and spiders, I'm giving him every chance I can to invite him into my yard for a drink.

In the Summer my yard consists of:

8 Trumpet Honeysuckles
2 big patches of Lady in Red Salvia
2 Trumpet Creepers
2 Red O'neil Horsechestnuts
1 Firebush
2 Azaleas
1 Weiglia
8 hanging baskets of Cigar plants (this year it'll be 25 baskets)(Can you guess who's been growing cuttings this winter? ;) )
3 patches of Lillies
1 patch of Russian Sage
1 Bleeding Heart
2 Hostas
some Cannas
some Lucifer Crocosmia
some Gladiolas
some Hyacinth
some Red Bee Balm
some Dwarf Lavendar Bee Balm
some Columbines
1 Hall's Honeysuckle
4 hanging baskets of Koralle Fuchsia
1 Lilac
1 Mini Hummzinger
2-6 Artine Flower Bouquet Feeders
3 Opus Feeders

and a partridge in a pear tree! So, it's not for lack of trying or lack of resources. I break my back for the little ones - believe you me. And yet I only have 1 consistent visitor throughout the Summer. I've been putting out a feeder since 1996. Same Bat-time, same Bat-channel.

If my big red disc with 4 yellow flowers on it attracts another Hummer to my yard, I'm all for it! If not, it hasn't hurt a thing and I enjoyed making it. And I sit on my back porch from Early Spring to Late Fall with my Audobon Bird Call chiriping out Hummingbird calls for hours at a time. When they're around they come a runnin'! It's a hoot! I get a kick out of it, and it works for me. ~Nate.http://home.comcast.net/~phampton246210mi/Nate/hellobye.gif

[humminbird]

[ And I sit on my back porch from Early Spring to Late Fall with my Audobon Bird Call chiriping out Hummingbird calls for hours at a time. When they're around they come a runnin'! It's a hoot! I get a kick out of it, and it works for me. ~Nate.http://home.comcast.net/~phampton246210mi/Nate/hellobye.gif[/QUOTE]

First, I want to thank someone for calling this last paragraph to my attention. Talk about irresponsible!

The continuous bird calls will in all likelihood lure males away from mating opportunities. It will in all likelihood pull females off their nests. Not hurting anyone? Give me a break!

I would encourage you to read the Migratory Bird Treaty Act - especially the part about harrassing the birds!

Mark
Bastrop, TX

[humminbird]

I want to appologize for my tyrade, but certainly not for the sentiment. The irresponsible use of tapes and calls is something that naturalists have to deal with in this electronic age. There is a reason that nature preserves, wildlife refuges, and other responsible wildlife viewing locations discourage or outright ban the use of electronic calls during the nesting season (and that is exactly what we are talking about here). The vocal call has a very significant impact on adults of both genders.
I have watched in amazement as bird banders, early in the season, have used electronic calls to capture as many as five male warblers from a single net setting. That call, at the right location, represented a sixth male threatening to intrude on the territories of the established male. I have watched female warblers respond as dramatically as the males. To play a call over and over, especially through the breeding season is, in my opinion, nothing short of irresponsible.

Mark
Bastrop, TX

[Katy Penland]

I guess those of you who get lots of Hummers or have them year-round don't have a frame of reference for how desperate some of us other Hummbirders get suffering through the winter blahs without them.
Well, I certainly don't have hummers year-round where I live in northern Arizona, and the number I get each season can vary greatly for several reasons. Odd, no winter blahs here. ;)


So, it's not for lack of trying or lack of resources. I break my back for the little ones - believe you me. And yet I only have 1 consistent visitor throughout the Summer. I've been putting out a feeder since 1996. Same Bat-time, same Bat-channel.
I don't understand -- you only get a single, individual Ruby-throated hummer in your yard every year? Since 1996? You are aware, no doubt, since your profile mentions your early affiliation with Cornell's Lab of Ornithology, that RTHU isn't attracted by the color of the feeder so much as it is by the location of the feeder? Is it possible that your huge, red lure may be the reason the birds aren't coming into your yard? ;)


And I sit on my back porch from Early Spring to Late Fall with my Audobon Bird Call chiriping out Hummingbird calls for hours at a time. When they're around they come a runnin'! It's a hoot! I get a kick out of it, and it works for me.
Sorry, Lilbirdz, but I have to second Mark's concern over your abuse of bird calling. This is an absolute no-no during breeding season, and no responsible birdwatcher will use this technique except very sparingly at any other time.

[Lilbirdz]

I think you're both over reacting. It's easy to read something someone has written and misunderstand it and quickly pass judgement. So let me try and assuage your woes a bit.

I'm a very responsible Hummbirder. I spend hours calling because there's nothing around yet. The reason I call is to help them find a great resource.

The reason I've had so few visitors over the years is that there simply aren't that many Hummers in my area.

This is an urban environment full of an ever increasing number of new subdivisions and strip malls. Lots of natural habitat is being destroyed. If a Hummer is passing through on it's way up North would you begrudge them an opportuntiy to replenish themselves on their journey. I won't. If they happen to be in earshot maybe they'll come investigate and find my yard.

When they are here, I don't call.

I'm not pullin' Momma bird off of her nest. At most I'm helping the Hummers find my yard. When I say they come runnin' and it's a hoot...well of course it's fun, I've waited weeks for their arrival. I'm not so ignorant as to pat myself on the back as the soul reason they showed up. They were probably hardwired to pass through this area for eons. I just happened to be out back when they passed through. But on the other hand I can take pride in the glimmer of a chance that I possibly helped them find my yard. That I provide a wonderful habitat in my little yard that will at least let them fill up again before they continue on their journeys. Can't I? Would you begrudge me even that?

The last couple of years with the big red disc have also been the most active. I'm not saying it works, but I'm not going to assume it doesn't either. Since, the number of visits and visitors has been on the rise these past couple of years I can hypothesize that...the red disc is helping...that I've been successful helping Hummers find a great resource...that a few of them have remembered me as a rest station on their migration route...it's not a bad thing if they continue to return.

The disc is 10 feet from the feeders and flat on the ground. It sits adjacent to one of my big Lady In Red Salvia beds. The Hummers hover mere inches above it when they're feeding there. It poses no threat to them whatsoever.

The feeders are all in shade. Well off the ground where predators cannot harm my little friends.

My bird call is not electronic. Far from it, it's just wood and metal. I know that's not your point. I bought it in Cornell's book and gift store in 1985. The Audobon Bird Call looks like this...

http://www.audubon-birdcall.com/images/ABC_nederlands.jpg

The folks at Cornell taught me how to use it. I enjoy talking with the birds. I'm not harrasing them. Between the Chickadee's, the Goldfinch and the Hummers, all their calls that I mimic are the happy ones that they make while feeding. I'm just talking to the birds guys. I encourage you to try it, it's very heartwarming to communicate in some way with nature. Y'all have a great day, it looks like we might even hit 60*F up here today! YIPPEE! ~Nate.http://home.comcast.net/~phampton246210mi/Nate/hellobye.gif

[humminbird]

I will respond and, if I over reacted, I apologize however I assure you I reacted to what you stated - not to a misinterpretation. Where appropriate, I will quote.


I spend hours calling because there's nothing around yet. The reason I call is to help them find a great resource.
[/img]

To quote what you told us yesterday at 17:10, "And I sit on my back porch from EARLY SPRING TO LATE FALL with my Audubon Bird Call (emphasis mine) chirping out Hummingbird calls for hours at a time." Which is it? Before they arrive or "Early Spring to Late Fall" as you told us first? I assure you, that was not a misunderstanding. "Early Spring to Late Fall" certainly encompasses the nesting and reproductive season in Michigan.

Quoting Nate again:
The reason I've had so few visitors over the years is that there simply aren't that many Hummers in my area.

Not at all surprising - there are not many hummingbirds in Michigan which is at the extreme of the range. Any naturalist knows that when looking for a bird you do not go to the periphery of the range but to the heart of the range. The birds you do get however deserve the best of habitat that you can provide - not a cheap trick.

Quoting Nate again:
If a Hummer is passing through on it's way up North would you begrudge them an opportuntiy to replenish themselves on their journey.

Not at all. I would prefer to see it natural but a feeder is very appropriate. A fake feeder is a totally different story.

Quoting Nate again:
When they are here, I don't call.

Let's have consistency - is it before they arrive or is it for hours at a time from "Early Spring to Late Fall"?

Quoting Nate again:
The last couple of years with the big red disc have also been the most active. I'm not saying it works, but I'm not going to assume it doesn't either. Since, the number of visits and visitors has been on the rise these past couple of years I can hypothesize that...the red disc is helping...that I've been successful helping Hummers find a great resource...that a few of them have remembered me as a rest station on their migration route...it's not a bad thing if they continue to return.


How do you rule out natural increase in population in an underutilized habitat that I am hearing of from other hummingbird enthusiasts who have restored habitat?

Quoting Nate again:
The feeders are all in shade. Well off the ground where predators cannot harm my little friends.

Mistake number one in my mind. Archilochus hummingbirds IMHO prefer an open area feeder. My feeders are under my eves where the bottles are shaded by the eves, but the birds are in the open and can see the sky. My least used feeder is under a liveoak tree where open sky is not visible from the feeder. That feeder RARELY has a bird on it. The greatest predators for these birds, especially in MI, are not going to come from the ground - they are coming from the sky. These birds want to see their threat before they are seen.

Quoting Nate again:
My bird call is not electronic.

I concede - an assumption on my part. Not being familiar with the Audubon calls I should not have jumped to that conclusion. Electronic or not, it is still an auditory stimulous. The only call I will use is from my own mouth - either a screech owl or a pisch. I would never DREAM of using it more than once or twice and NEVER during nesting season.

Please understand Nate, this is not personal. I do not like to see any birds lured by useless (for them) materials or harrassed by meaningless (to them) calls. I have no objection to a bird feeder - but a fake feeder has no place in my understanding of a wonderful habitat.

Mark
Bastrop, TX

[Lilbirdz]

Sorry if I've inconvienced anyone. When I joined this forum I wasn't looking for a place to come and have an arguement. Certainly not over a big red dot that lays on the ground.

Goodbye. ~Nate.

[humminbird]

I too am not looking for a place to have an argument. Nate, I hope you will continue to participate in other discussions. All, I appologize for pursuiting the matter so agressively.

Mark

[Curtis Croulet]

Hmm. I wonder if this is the Nate from Michigan who visited the Gardenweb hummingbird forum last year.

Feeder placement: My experience is that they should be located for maximum visibility. Hummingbirds working on a feeder attract more hummingbirds, and the birds need to see the feeder and the activity.

[humminbird]

Feeder placement: My experience is that they should be located for maximum visibility. Hummingbirds working on a feeder attract more hummingbirds, and the birds need to see the feeder and the activity.

My sentiments exactly Curtis. I generally use the Natures Best type feeders, with an attempt to keep the bottle as cool as possible - thus under the eves. This tends to allow me an extra day or so between changing out the syrup. The perches where the birds are feeding though are very visible and in the open with the exception of one feeder - that feeder is definitely the least used. I have tried to discontinue feeding there, but there are a couple of birds each year that come looking for that feeder.

Mark Klym
Bastrop, TX

[crickieheather]

Feeder placement: My experience is that they should be located for maximum visibility. Hummingbirds working on a feeder attract more hummingbirds, and the birds need to see the feeder and the activity.

:( So, how do they find the ones with no activity? I know there are some hummers in my area (reported seen already), but I have none at my feeders so far. I had one feeder under the eaves of my apartment last August through november, visited by a female and a male, then later two juv. males and the female. It was a hanging feeder. I switched to a pair of Hummzingers in december. One is mounted on a post out from under the eaves, but in the same area. The other is window mouted on the other side of my apartment. They're both in quite visible locations, and should be much easier to see compared to last year's placement, but I still haven't seen one at all. Could it be that they remember where to go, and the ones that used my feeder last year aren't up yet?

I also read somewhere that red ribbons tied to the feeder will help. They flap in the breeze?

[humminbird]

:( So, how do they find the ones with no activity? I know there are some hummers in my area (reported seen already), but I have none at my feeders so far. I had one feeder under the eaves of my apartment last August through november, visited by a female and a male, then later two juv. males and the female. It was a hanging feeder. I switched to a pair of Hummzingers in december. One is mounted on a post out from under the eaves, but in the same area. The other is window mouted on the other side of my apartment. They're both in quite visible locations, and should be much easier to see compared to last year's placement, but I still haven't seen one at all. Could it be that they remember where to go, and the ones that used my feeder last year aren't up yet?

I also read somewhere that red ribbons tied to the feeder will help. They flap in the breeze?

Crickieheather:
First, before I answer your question, I want to make a distinction between red ribbons, red houses, red cars, etc. (used by a number of people) and a device deliberately designed to look like a feeder that offers the birds nothing. In my opinion, the latter is highly unethical.
There are a number of things I do not know that make answering your question difficult, but I can make some general statements. New feeders are found only by sight. Birds have very poor senses of smell, so any attempt to attract them must make use of their highly developed sense of sight. (by the way, because of that poorly developed sense of smell, buying fruit SCENTED (not the foods with real fruit in them) foods is making you feel good but doing nothing for the birds).
Hummingbird authors and feeders are unanimous on one point - big splashes of bright red color are a key to attracting these birds. You are clearly in an apartment. I would focus on hanging baskets of red flowers, NOT artificial flowers, red flower pots, red cushions on my furniture. I would not tie anything that is going to move with the wind to my feeders, but away from the feeders and where the birds could see it a red ribbon, red flags (even Old Glory) will help.
Keep the food fresh.
If you are in an urban area, you have a big strike against you known as the concrete jungle. ADVERTISE, but not deceptively.

Good birding
Mark
Bastrop, TX

[Curtis Croulet]

crickieheather: There's only so much you can do. The best feeders with the freshest nectar with the best attracting flowers nearby are useless if there are no birds in your area. Being in so. Calif., I have feeders up year-round, and I have traffic on at least one of my feeders most of the time. But I live in suburbia, and it's a big event to see three or more birds at a time, and lately even two at a time has been unusual. Other people in better locations get way more birds. To some extent, you just have to accept what nature gives you.

[humminbird]

crickieheather: There's only so much you can do. The best feeders with the freshest nectar with the best attracting flowers nearby are useless if there are no birds in your area. Being in so. Calif., I have feeders up year-round, and I have traffic on at least one of my feeders most of the time. But I live in suburbia, and it's a big event to see three or more birds at a time, and lately even two at a time has been unusual. Other people in better locations get way more birds. To some extent, you just have to accept what nature gives you.

Wow Curtis. I never thought you had such a hummingbird depressed locale. Well, great answer. I need to learn to put it in that many words for some of those I get questions from deep in the jungle of Dallas and Houston.

Mark

[Curtis Croulet]

My particular neighborhood seems to be in a hummer desert. I think it's the lack of natural habitat nearby (coastal sage scrub and chaparral in our region). There are other sites nearby with lots of hummingbirds, but they are surrounded by at least some native habitat. I know a guy in the mountains who has more hummingbirds than you can imagine, especially when Rufous/Black-chinned southbound migration is at its height in August. He uses six 96 oz P-P feeders, which he refills daily. His feeders are visible for literally miles in almost all directions. There's a restaurant at a highway junction below his home, and from the restaurant you can see the hummingbirds coming in from all around to go to his feeders. For myself, I don't get the big numbers, but I almost always have one or two. If I want to see big gobs of them, I know where to go.

[Katy Penland]

I've been so shocked at how many hummers I get here in NE Arizona (coming from so Cal myself), living at 7,000 feet in conifer forest, i.e., no flowering plants except for the wildflowers that occur mid-late summer. Not the bazillions of birds the southern half of the state gets, especially SE AZ, but we'll get 60+ birds daily (four species: rufous, black-chinned, broad-tailed and calliope) at the busiest part of the season, running 3 feeders (hung under roof eaves) that have to be refilled twice daily. I don't even know why hummingbirds are at this elevation with so few native flowering plants -- lots and lots of tiny flying insects, though, during the summer -- but I'm sure glad they're here every year. They're just incredible little birds.

[crickieheather]

Birds have very poor senses of smell, so any attempt to attract them must make use of their highly developed sense of sight. (by the way, because of that poorly developed sense of smell, buying fruit SCENTED (not the foods with real fruit in them) foods is making you feel good but doing nothing for the birds).
If you are in an urban area, you have a big strike against you known as the concrete jungle. ADVERTISE, but not deceptively.

I find it somewhat funny that I mentioned nothing about fruit or scent in my post, but you thought to write a paragraph on it. :) I'm rather new to hummers, but not to birds in general. Did you know that parrots have no taste buds on thier tounges? They're actually located in the back of their throts. interesting, but not really important. :) Tangent!

Yes, I am in an apartment, but the current feeder is actually in a more visible spot than the one I had up last year. There aren't any red plants around here, not yet anyway. I have many plants going in now to help attract them. Butterfly bushes, four o' clocks, some Salvia, lots of red glads and daylillies. I even started some nice cardinal climbers on some trellises back in January. I won't put up anything fake to attract them.

I suppose I was mostly wondering aloud if hummers remember where food sources are located. If the female, male, and two juv. males remember mine from last year, would they show up again? Or will anything that shows up here be just out of luck that they flew over and saw it?

[Curtis Croulet]

I don't know if there's any experimental evidence that hummingbird remember feeder locations, but it appears to me that they do remember locations from day to day and even from season to season. I've seen them look for feeders that are no longer hanging in places where they were hanging last year -- or so it appears to me. It's common practice when banding to take down all feeders but those inside the traps, and hummingbirds will continue to look for the missing feeders.

[Curtis Croulet]

I've been so shocked at how many hummers I get here in NE Arizona (coming from so Cal myself), living at 7,000 feet in conifer forest...

Katy, roughly where are you? We own a piece of undeveloped property in Apache Co., halfway between Show Low and Concho. The elevation is about 6600 ft. It's out on the Plateau. The vegetation is pinion, juniper and sagebrush (Artemesia tridentata). I've often wondered what kind of hummers might visit there. I've always assumed there'd be Black-chins and Broad-tails, but I know Magnificents supposedly range up to the Mogollon Rim, and I've wondered if they get any further north, at least on occasion.

[humminbird]

I find it somewhat funny that I mentioned nothing about fruit or scent in my post, but you thought to write a paragraph on it. :) I'm rather new to hummers, but not to birds in general. Did you know that parrots have no taste buds on thier tounges? They're actually located in the back of their throts. interesting, but not really important. :) Tangent!


Actually, it is not all that much of a tangent, and the discussion was not about taste so much as smell. Many people seem to think these guys can find food sources by smell when they can not. You do have a point though - a VERY significant part of the ability to taste is the ability to smell!

Regarding fruit, many people will put out fruit to attract both hummingbirds and butterflies. It does work.

Yes, as Curtis said, there is no direct evidence that hummingbirds "remember" where feeders were found, but there is plenty of annecdotal evidence. One bander tells of being able to predict not only the day, but the hour that she will catch a certain hummingbird in a certain trap each year.

mark
Bastrop

[humminbird]

I know a guy in the mountains who has more hummingbirds than you can imagine, especially when Rufous/Black-chinned southbound migration is at its height in August. He uses six 96 oz P-P feeders, which he refills daily. His feeders are visible for literally miles in almost all directions. There's a restaurant at a highway junction below his home, and from the restaurant you can see the hummingbirds coming in from all around to go to his feeders. For myself, I don't get the big numbers, but I almost always have one or two. If I want to see big gobs of them, I know where to go.

Sounds familiar. I know a family in the Davis Mountains of Texas that last year had decreased their feeding by the weekend of the Festival there - they were only running I believe he said 115 feeders at that point. It is amazing to sit on their back deck and listen to the birds buzzing about you - you do more listening than looking because you can't possibly take it all in! Last year, at that location, in three hours I saw Black-chinned, Ruby-throated, Magnificent, Rufous, Allens, Anna's, Lucifer, Broad-tailed, Broad-billed, Calliope. Wonderful sites in dem dere mountains! Your place in AZ sounds like it could be a Meca!

Mark

[Katy Penland]

Katy, roughly where are you? We own a piece of undeveloped property in Apache Co., halfway between Show Low and Concho. The elevation is about 6600 ft. It's out on the Plateau. The vegetation is pinion, juniper and sagebrush (Artemesia tridentata). I've often wondered what kind of hummers might visit there. I've always assumed there'd be Black-chins and Broad-tails, but I know Magnificents supposedly range up to the Mogollon Rim, and I've wondered if they get any further north, at least on occasion.
I'm the other direction, roughly halfway between Show Low and Payson in Overgaard (Navajo Cty).

Wow, I'd die to have a Magnificent but never have here. My Annotated Checklist (1981), which still lists it as "Rivoli's" hummer, says it's been found on the Rim, notably "since about 1973 has been found north and west to Greer, White Mountains... and west to Flagstaff..." and "several times in extreme southwestern Utah." Sounds like it would be only a matter of circumstance for you to see them on your property in Concho. Some Audubon friends used to live in Concho, I'll ask them if they've ever had Magnificent at their place.

When I do the USFS neotropic migrant surveys in May/June, I hear/see Broad-tails at almost every waypoint of all 3 routes, which cover a 30+-mile line of the Rim itself. The Calliope is the least common in my yard, and last year I never did get one at all -- but overall hummer numbers were waaaaay down last season, too, to the point I never did need to put up the 3rd feeder.

[Curtis Croulet]

Here in Temecula we've had Anna's (95% of what we see), Costa's, Black-chinned and Rufous. We've never seen a Calliope, but sightings in so. Calif. lowlands have all been in April, so this month gives us another chance.

[Katy Penland]

Best of luck on that! When I saw our first Calliope, even before I saw the streaky, elongated gorget, its overall smaller size than the other three spp was obvious, making it easy to pick out on those perched at the feeder. It was also much shier than the rest, preferring to wait in a nearby juniper until there were fewer birds around before coming to the feeder. But once there, unless it got a direct hit from a male or female "ruthless," it would stand its perch against all comers. Don't think I have a decent photo of it, either. Yet. ;)

[Curtis Croulet]

Katy, somehow I think we had this Overgaard/Show Low discussion last year. Sorry, I'm 60, and sometimes my memory slips.
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Edited to add: We chatted about this Sep 29, 2004.
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Chances of a Calliope in migration here are really quite small. Most seem to be recorded from the immediate coast (we're 25 miles inland). In fact, a Broad-tail would probably be at least as likely as a Calliope. Several are reported from so. Calif. every year, and the banders we've worked with get one or two every year.

[wings]

Two more weeks and I'll be in SE Arizona, hummingbird capital of the U.S. I'll check in to all the "canyons" and hope to go to Portal, on the east side of the Chiricahuas.

Kathy, what kind of clothing can I expect to wear this time of year. Should I bring rain gear? Elevation will be about 4000 - 5000 ft.

[Katy Penland]

Let me ask some people who live in that part of the state and will get back to you. When I was in the SE in February a couple years ago, we had everything from hot days to foggy, cool mornings to strong afternoon wind. Rain's not in the extended forecast right now, but let me see what I can find out.

[Curtis Croulet]

wings: be prepared for anything. You might also contact Southeastern Arizona Bird Observatory (i.e., Sheri Wiliamson & Tom Wood) for info.

[Katy Penland]

Hi, Wings,

The consensus coming back to me is almost verbatim what Curtis said: To be prepared for any type of weather. Temps in Tucson are from the mid-70s into high-80s for the next 10 days, but that's in a valley, not up in any of the canyons or Chiricahuas.

Would urge you to subscribe to or check in on the AZ-NM Bird listserve every day as there have been some recent mentions of canyon closures or delays due to construction, weather (mud/rock slides/flooding), etc. It's also THE best list for hearing about rarities, migrants, and other bird-related stuff for the SE part of Arizona. Invaluable, in fact.

http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/AZNM.html