Ivory Billed Found!!

[Ryder]

Hi:
Just heard that the Ivory-billed Woodpecker has been found in Arkansas!

Apparently a male has been filmed and was reported in "Science" magazine.

Lets hope there is a viable population.

Craig Ryder

[CJW]

http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=32548

[curunir]

This leads me to wonder about the validity of the old sighting in Louisiana. This new information is promising.

After 7000 hours and presumably some of the most expensive glass in the world, I hope they have a good image. Also, does this mean the IBW is back on the endangered species list? Hope it's covered under the migratory bird act or something to keep collector's at bay. Do suddenly unextinct animals have any protection at all?

Good news anyway.

[carol poole]

like most people who love birds i am astounded that this fantastic bird lives. the one thing that puzzles me is how a bird of this size can manage to remain undetected in a country like north america for so long

[gthang]

Bush's Stand: Big Bird, small role in conservation
Our Stand: Giant Bird, Giant role in conservation

[curunir]

while it is true that the ibw is a big bird, how many times do people who work in the forests of the west see a mountain lion or even more elusive, a wolverine. the ibw habitat, while perhaps not as large, is every bit as isolated.

[Andy1]

For the story about the discovery of the ivory bill woodpecker from the people involved in the search, here is the place to read about it:

http://www.birds.cornell.edu/ivory/

While reading and celebrating the discovery of this bird, please consider supporting the Lab of Ornithology as a member. They have been doing great work in bird conservation for a long time. In the future, it'll be hard to top this achievement though! Conservation takes $$$ and much of the money comes from membership fees, so join the effort!

:clap: :clap: :clap:

[Andy1]

Here is a link to a satellite photo with text describing the image of the refuge where the bird(s) were found.

http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/Newsroom/NewImages/images.php3?img_id=16896

Amazing............
B (:

[rb_stern]

I have just finished reading the newly published book - The Grail Bird- by Tim Gallagher, one of the discoverers. It's available at online bookstores - I got mine at Amazon.com. It's an excellent read, and chronicles the search, based on credible sight reports, and the eventual proof, very nicely.

Richard

[Stuart Watson]

Should make interesting reading Richard - thanks for pointing this out!

[aubrey]

I ordered it from Amazon.com too and it's suppose to arrive next week. I'm looking forward to reading it.

[stefanyoungs]

I loved the "Grail Bird" and appreciated that they were able to write the book, keep it under wraps, and give us all something to read in this exciting time once they went public with the discovery. You can also order a cool shirt at this site below with the Ivory-Billed on the back and Cornell Lab or Ornithology on the front.

http://www.sapsuckerwoods.com/

Stefan

[Pileated_MO]

I loved the "Grail Bird" and appreciated that they were able to write the book, keep it under wraps, and give us all something to read in this exciting time once they went public with the discovery. You can also order a cool shirt at this site below with the Ivory-Billed on the back and Cornell Lab or Ornithology on the front.

http://www.sapsuckerwoods.com/

Stefan

I'll definately be ordering the book now that I know that it does mention the recent discovery.

As for that cool t shirt..I had seen one that you could get upon donating 100.00 to the Cornell Lab or something similar. Believe me, if I had $100.00 to spare I would...but I'd love to be able to just order that shirt. I'll look at that site, thanks!

[Curtis Croulet]

The book is a quick read, very entertaining, and remarkably up-to-date (March 2005). It's also disturbing. There's a -- how should I phrase it so I don't start an off-topic flame thread? -- a strong, anti-science element in the USA, and within or adjacent to that "element," there is also a substantial number of people who, though somewhat accepting of science (particularly science that leads to high-tech weapons for the military), are skeptical of scientists' motives and objectivity. In their view, scientists stupidly ignore or -- worse -- "cover up" reports of UFOs, alien abductions, life on Mars, cold fusion, free energy from hydrogen peroxide, undescribed monsters in Loch Ness, etc. In other forums I have defended scientists against some of these claims (and another I'll not discuss here; I don't want to divert the thread). In my view, over the long term, ideas with proper evidence will prevail, and ideas without proper evidence will die. That's the way it's supposed to work, anyway. But an anti-science type reading The Grail Bird will have their skepticism about scientists confirmed. We read about a refusal at the highest levels of science to entertain anything contrary to the prevailing orthodoxy (i.e., that the Ivory-bill is extinct), and even the most distinguished scientists were not immune to having their reputations smeared by giving some credence to sightings and even photographs of Ivory-bills. It sounds like something out of the Stalinist USSR or, closer to home, the McCarthy Era in the US.

In addition, I tend to agree with Mary Scott's views, to the extent that they are presented accurately in the book. I see little good coming from the announcement of the rediscovery of the Ivory-bill. The only "good" comes from the protection of additional acres of bottomland forest. If that's all that happens, then perhaps the birds have a chance. But inevitably, the rediscovery will also bring hordes of twitchers and -- worse -- an activist viewpoint that demands that we "do something" to help the Ivory-bill recover. The suggestion that birds be captured for breeding falls into this category. The Ivory-billed Woodpecker may be surviving by the slimest of threads, but that slim thread is a direct and fortuitous byproduct of the official disdain that prevailed over the last 60 years. I'm saying that the birds' prospect of survival would be better if it had continued to be "undiscovered" -- the various sightings relegated to UFO and bigfoot lunacy -- than in the new world where conservationists and public officials will insist that "something be done." It's very depressing.

[jurek]

I did not read the book.

If Mary Scott really scolded the scientists, she should admit now that she was partly wrong. There are many conservation groups not dominated by scientists, which might support her. Few birders want to visit the swampy forests - so there is nothing like flood of twitchers. And scientists in Cornell lab and elsewhere don't support catching ivorybills for breeding.

These words sound similar to what I heard previously from some other passionate conservationists. I think it is like a dream vision of wild nature that exists away from man.

My view is sadder and perhaps more cynical. Such wild world no longer exists. People will get anywhere to get timber, minerals etc. If we leave nature alone and unprotected, this nature will not stay untouched - other people will quickly destroy it.

[Curtis Croulet]

Mary Scott didn't "scold" any scientists. She withheld her own apparently valid sighting for several weeks for fear of the consequences to the birds. I think her fears are justified. Earlier reports by others at other times were dismissed by experts as invalid.

[jurek]

I see. Thanks, I had a wrong impression.

[choupique1]

Having seen Ivory Bills and spoken directly with several other who have.... IF mary scott saw one at the distance she claimed... then she missed 2 glaring things that "stick out" when an IBWO is encounterd that close......

[timeshadowed]

Having seen Ivory Bills and spoken directly with several other who have.... IF mary scott saw one at the distance she claimed... then she missed 2 glaring things that "stick out" when an IBWO is encounterd that close......

OK . . . I've read this several times on this forum, now I have a question that I'd like answered.

Just WHAT are these 2 glaring things that 'stick out'???

Please answer before I use up all of my nine lives 'dying to know'.

TimeShadowed

[timeshadowed]

Thanks for the Private Message choupique1. I kinda figured out your #1, but had no clue as to the rest of what you said. Now I can sleep better without trying to figure it out!

TimeShadowed

[Jesse Gilsdorf]

Yes, but what about the rest of us dying to know the two things that stick out? Could somebody clue me in on these things. Anyway, are there any photos of trees that have been worked over by an IBW. I found one on BNA's web site, but the bark was already off the tree. I would like to know if there is a picture of the peeled bark anywhere. Can anyone help?

[Bluetail]

Yes, but what about the rest of us dying to know the two things that stick out? Could somebody clue me in on these things.Indeed. Surely secrecy on these points achieves nothing?

[choupique1]

yes it does achieve something..... it leaves a couple of "qualifiers" for sightings.... helps experts toggle bewteen reality and make believe..... or mis-identifications.

it makes it much easier to call BS on many purported sightings....

[Curtis Croulet]

Having seen Ivory Bills and spoken directly with several other who have.... IF mary scott saw one at the distance she claimed... then she missed 2 glaring things that "stick out" when an IBWO is encounterd that close......

When seeing an unexpected bird, I have sometimes missed "glaring things that 'stick out.'" Yet I had no doubt about the ID, because identification rests on many characters, not one or two. I suspect even expert birders have, in the excitement of the moment, sometimes failed to notice things that are obvious when looking at a study skin or mounted specimen.

[choupique1]

the more correct details..... the more reliable/credible wouldn't you say?

[Curtis Croulet]

the more correct details..... the more reliable/credible wouldn't you say?

Maybe Gallagher's book tacitly agrees. It wasn't Mary Scott's report that sent Cornell to the swamps, it was Gene Sparling's.

[choupique1]

CC... i would wholeheartedly concur......

the white/cahce area was on the radar screen regardless of scott or sparling... sparling got it in high gear.

[timeshadowed]

When seeing an unexpected bird, I have sometimes missed "glaring things that 'stick out.'" Yet I had no doubt about the ID, because identification rests on many characters, not one or two. I suspect even expert birders have, in the excitement of the moment, sometimes failed to notice things that are obvious when looking at a study skin or mounted specimen.

It is much like describing what one observes when one sees a robin on the lawn. The chances are that the robin was TILTIING its head to listen for worms, RUNNING a little bit, then STOPPING for another listen. Or one may describe the robin as pulling a worm from the ground.

In other words, if you see an IBWO, it's BEHAVIOR will be what sticks out at you.

Mary Scott's posted 'report' of her IBWO is not a case of OMISSION, but rather one of reporting the WRONG "glaring things that 'stick out.'". Using the robin's behavior above as an example - would you believe someone's 'report' if they stated that they saw the robin STANDING in ONE PLACE for about 15 minutes eating GRASS. I doubt that you would believe that that person's 'report' could be that of a robin. Yet that is how far 'off the mark' Mary's report of the IBWO is!

TimeShadowed

[choupique1]

thank you very much timeshadow..........

[harry eales]

There was a very intersting programme on BBC Radio 4 at 9.05pm today fourth July, In interviewer was taken out into the swamps for several days, and actually saw the bird himself, accompanied by the man who discovered it. He mentioned that he had been looking for it for more than thirty years. Apparently it feeds on only one particular species of Beetle grubs. So conservation of that species is vital for the survival of this bird.

The local populace are cashing in, Tee shirts, Ivory Bill Beefburgers and just about anything else you can think of. lol.

Harry

[Goatnose]

O.K. From a local, the local newspaper quoted that the Army Corp Of engineers did a study and concluded that the pumping station being built on the White River just downstream of the sighting did not pose a threat to the Ivory Billed. The Arkansas Fish and Game commission responded with " That is ludicrous". :brains:

[johnnydr87]

O.K. From a local, the local newspaper quoted that the Army Corp Of engineers did a study and concluded that the pumping station being built on the White River just downstream of the sighting did not pose a threat to the Ivory Billed. The Arkansas Fish and Game commission responded with " That is ludicrous". :brains:

:gn: :brains: :-(

[Curtis Croulet]

It must have been a grim day at the Army Corps of Engineers when the Ivory-bill's rediscovery was announced.

[TexasFlyway]

O.K. From a local, the local newspaper quoted that the Army Corp Of engineers did a study and concluded that the pumping station being built on the White River just downstream of the sighting did not pose a threat to the Ivory Billed. The Arkansas Fish and Game commission responded with " That is ludicrous". :brains:

Did the Arkansas Fish & Game commission representative actually read and evaluate the study and is commenting on it? Or is the quote merely a knee jerk response to some news reporter's baiting question?

[MMSLouis]

Hi:
Just heard that the Ivory-billed Woodpecker has been found in Arkansas!

Apparently a male has been filmed and was reported in "Science" magazine.

Lets hope there is a viable population.

Craig Ryder

It is interesting that this woodpecker has been rediscovered, along with a growing list of others that were once presumed extinct. I wonder if perhaps the Carolina parakeet might be found again, considering reports of it being sighted up to 1935, (after it was presumed extinct in 1918.) On the other hand, in addition, one species I feel is certainly extinct is the fruit dove Ptilinopus arcanus of the Philippines. This dove is, or was, only known from a single specimen, the island (as with the entire country) in the Philippines where it was found has suffered from habitat destruction, and it may have hybridized with similar species.

[tunpin.ong]

It is interesting that this woodpecker has been rediscovered, along with a growing list of others that were once presumed extinct. I wonder if perhaps the Carolina parakeet might be found again, considering reports of it being sighted up to 1935, (after it was presumed extinct in 1918.) On the other hand, in addition, one species I feel is certainly extinct is the fruit dove Ptilinopus arcanus of the Philippines. This dove is, or was, only known from a single specimen, the island (as with the entire country) in the Philippines where it was found has suffered from habitat destruction, and it may have hybridized with similar species.


I think there is still some hope for the fruit dove that you had mentioned. There was an unconfirmed report in 2002 of Negros Fruit-Dove. Even if it is confirmed to have survived, this may not last long without serious conservation actions.

See BirdLife International link:

http://www.birdlife.net/datazone/species/index.html?action=SpcHTMDetails.asp&sid=2701&m=0

[Jos Stratford]

yes it does achieve something..... it leaves a couple of "qualifiers" for sightings.... helps experts toggle bewteen reality and make believe..... or mis-identifications.

it makes it much easier to call BS on many purported sightings....

Doesn't achieve anything, 'cos the answer is available by PM! Gives the impression of some trying to create an elite of 'those who want to know something others don't'!

[timeshadowed]

Doesn't achieve anything, 'cos the answer is available by PM! Gives the impression of some trying to create an elite of 'those who want to know something others don't'!

I do not agree with you on this one. How do you know that "the answer is available by PM"??

TimeShadowed

[Jos Stratford]

I do not agree with you on this one. How do you know that "the answer is available by PM"??


A discussion along the lines of the following gives that impression...

Post Just WHAT are these 2 glaring things that 'stick out'???
Please answer before I use up all of my nine lives 'dying to know'.

Next post Thanks for the Private Message choupique1. I kinda figured out your #1, but had no clue as to the rest of what you said. Now I can sleep better without trying to figure it out!

Happy birding, suppressing the means of identifying a bird is a new one on me! ;)

[timeshadowed]

Happy birding, suppressing the means of identifying a bird is a new one on me! ;)


The information is available online to everyone who reads the BirdForum postings by choupique1.

Happy reading!!

TimeShadowed

[Ivory Bill]

like most people who love birds i am astounded that this fantastic bird lives. the one thing that puzzles me is how a bird of this size can manage to remain undetected in a country like north america for so long

I would hide myself if i were a bird or animal from all of the insanity in this country today .... these birds went as far as they could to elude destruction
by man ... it is because of man they are all nearly gone and because of man they are in hiding as well ... i would run to if i could ...
We need responsible people in all aspects of leadership and have needed this for a long long time and we have not had it ... so all that is good gets flushed by all of the greed .. and that is it in a nutshell ..
thanks
Shawn