White-tailed eagle re-introductions to England?

[Amarillo]

Did anyone watch the programme on BBC2 about the re-establishment of white-tailed eagles, red kites and ospreys in Britain after extinction/near-extinction?

With the white-tailed eagle population still fairly precarious, it seems there are people wanting to build up further populations away from the existing one in the western isles. The Moray firth on Scotlands east coast was mentioned, along with Norfolk/Suffolk.

Does anyone know if this is a serious proposal? It would be amazing to see these huge birds down south.

[Tiger_mz]

Did anyone watch the programme on BBC2 about the re-establishment of white-tailed eagles, red kites and ospreys in Britain after extinction/near-extinction?

With the white-tailed eagle population still fairly precarious, it seems there are people wanting to build up further populations away from the existing one in the western isles. The Moray firth on Scotlands east coast was mentioned, along with Norfolk/Suffolk.

Does anyone know if this is a serious proposal? It would be amazing to see these huge birds down south.
It was a really great programme wasn't it?

The proposals are serious but when they will happen is anyone's guess. It depends on quite a number of things and no doubt finance is one of them.

[rezMole]

If the birds get a seriously good foothold in the areas they are in currently, won't they just "spread out" naturally anyway? Surely the Western Isles can only support so many eagles - in which case the younger birds will have to move to new pastures. It may take a long time, but perhaps that's the best way forward.

[Amarillo]

If the birds get a seriously good foothold in the areas they are in currently, won't they just "spread out" naturally anyway? Surely the Western Isles can only support so many eagles - in which case the younger birds will have to move to new pastures. It may take a long time, but perhaps that's the best way forward.

Some birds don't always naturally spread out. For example the red kites in Wales didn't for many years, partly because of the communal habits of the birds and partly because of the limited gene pool that an isolated population has. Now that there are other populations of red kites mixing up the gene pool a bit, the scattered populations should start to spread more and all join up.

[sparrie]

The sea eagles will struggle to spread out because they are still being killed and having their nests raided. The authaurities wont tell you half of what goes on because they are probably failing in the protection of these birds. Please note that is my opinion from what I have heard and dont know exactly but it still goes on.

Gary

[Andrew]

I think they might need a hand cos when they spread out they need to be lucky enough to go to a spot where there is a partner there. Chances of two of opposite sex reaching Norfolk may be dicey.

[jurek]

If the birds get a seriously good foothold in the areas they are in currently, won't they just "spread out" naturally anyway?

They will, but we are unlikely to see white-tailed eagles breeding in England in our lifetime. They do it very slow. In Poland, white-tailed eagle increased from 50 to 500 pairs in 60 years time.

One strange thing is that raptors tend to settle near others of their kind. This means, that they often try to breed in very poor areas nearby rather than spread away. So bringing young can actually spped growth.

For me it is OK to bring back native raptors just for birdwatchers interest. White-tailed eagle is charismatic bird and can coexist with people really well (there is now a breeding pair on the Berlin outskirts). We meddle with nature for many silliest reasons, why not to bring this wonderful bird?

[DavidP]

I believe there last england nesting was on the Isle of Wight in 1780 so maybe they should be brought back there. It seems like there may be more anti raptor interests in Scotland than in some parts of England, is that why red kites aren't doing so well in the Black Isle area but have doen very well in the Chilterns or is it just habitat.

[Andrew]

What about Black Kite?

[Jos Stratford]

What about Black Kite?


I think there's some debate as to whether the 'Black Kites' that scavanged the streets of London in bygone eras were actually not in fact Red Kites. Even if Black Kites were a former breeder, it would seem that enough occur as occasional visitors that the odd pair would have bred in recent years if conditions were suitable for them.

As regard White-tailed Eagles, as Jurek pointed out for the case in Poland, the population here in Lithuania is also expanding fairly rapidly ...and, as most are at least partial migrants, regardless of whether birds get reintroduced to Eastern Britain, you will probably get ever higher numbers of winter vagrants to keep you UK birders happy!

[yorkshire83]

For me it is OK to bring back native raptors just for birdwatchers interest. White-tailed eagle is charismatic bird and can coexist with people really well (there is now a breeding pair on the Berlin outskirts). We meddle with nature for many silliest reasons, why not to bring this wonderful bird?


I agree with the bringing back of native raptors, however i dont agree that it is, or it should be for the birdwatching interest. These birds were successful here in times gone by, living successfully on their prey until they were persecuted by man. So i feel because WE erradicated them, we should atleast make an attempt to re-introduce them as they should rightfully be here!

I would love to see a WTE breeding pair in England!!!!

Rob

[Bluetail]

I believe there last england nesting was on the Isle of Wight in 1780 so maybe they should be brought back there.Depends what you count as England, David. It bred on the Isle of Man until 1815 (but we can ignore that - just coz it will annoy Chris!) The last birds were a pair on Unst. The male was shot in 1908 and his mate disappeared in 1918.

I wonder whether the Isle of Wight would still be suitable these days. Maybe it would; but the area where it last bred - the Culver Cliffs north of Sandown - must be very different now from what it was back then. Far more populated for one thing (it's a very popular tourist area). On the other hand, if what Jurek says is right, perhaps that's not significant.

[DavidP]

Depends what you count as England, David. It bred on the Isle of Man until 1815 (but we can ignore that - just coz it will annoy Chris!) The last birds were a pair on Unst. The male was shot in 1908 and his mate disappeared in 1918.

I wonder whether the Isle of Wight would still be suitable these days. Maybe it would; but the area where it last bred - the Culver Cliffs north of Sandown - must be very different now from what it was back then. Far more populated for one thing (it's a very popular tourist area). On the other hand, if what Jurek says is right, perhaps that's not significant.



You're probably right although I wonder if perhaps some of these re introductions would perhaps get off to a better start if they were in more fertile areas. I presume that prey would be more available but maybe not. Presumably there last stronghold in the western isles had more to do with remoteness from persecution than anything. I've been to Mull and seen some there but I can attest to the fact thats theres more rabbits on Culver or Alum bay downs than anywhere i saw in Mull. Although perhaps thats not there main source of food but I would have thought that perhaps fish populations may be more numerous as well.

[Bluetail]

Lord, I'm dim sometimes. I really ought to have learnt the difference between England and Britain! That's what comes of posting in the middle of the night. Yes, the last English nesting does seem to have been the one in the IoW.