EOS 10d vs d60 vs 300d vs 20d

[Sarel]

Sorry for the confusing Thread, but I am looking for a good 2nd hand camara.
And now I am comfused myself!
What is the difference between thes camaras.
I do use at the moment the EOS 5, and would like somthing more or less the same, and thought the EOS 10d was good. But what is the difference between the EOS 10d and the EOS 60d??
I don't care about pixels, if it's more than 6, i am happy(and all of them are above the 6)

So, who can help me with a quick view of the differences between:

10d vs d60
edit: (the others as well, but they are more expensive i think)

Thanks
Sarel
edit 2: I will be using the 28-135 is and 300/4L is and 1.4x EF converter on the camara

[robski]

Hi Sarel

If you can afford it go for the 20D

Longer battery life.
Faster switch on and wake up time.
8.2 M pixel
Lower noise images at higher ISO
5 frames per second.

If not a 20D then maybe a secondhand 350D

Robert


Sorry for the confusing Thread, but I am looking for a good 2nd hand camara.
And now I am comfused myself!
What is the difference between thes camaras.
I do use at the moment the EOS 5, and would like somthing more or less the same, and thought the EOS 10d was good. But what is the difference between the EOS 10d and the EOS 60d??
I don't care about pixels, if it's more than 6, i am happy(and all of them are above the 6)

So, who can help me with a quick view of the differences between:

10d vs d60
edit: (the others as well, but they are more expensive i think)

Thanks
Sarel
edit 2: I will be using the 28-135 is and 300/4L is and 1.4x EF converter on the camara

[Sarel]

robski,
ok, and why not a 10d? or d60?
(i was actually looking for one of these! don't ask why, i don't know, possibly money....)

[compa]

robski,
ok, and why not a 10d? or d60?
(i was actually looking for one of these! don't ask why, i don't know, possibly money....)

If I may presume to answer for robski ...

Both the 10D and D60 are near antiques as far as digital cameras go! The 10D is the immediate predecessor of the 20D (which, by the way, is due to be replaced itself in the next year). The D60 is even older.

The 20D is an excellent camera and the prices on it have already dropped some. The 350 is also excellent and it is a less expensive model than the 20D. I agree with robsi completely on his recommendations.

[robski]

robski,
ok, and why not a 10d? or d60?
(i was actually looking for one of these! don't ask why, i don't know, possibly money....)

Compa has answered as for the reason why.

If it was me the order of choice from 1st to last would be.

20D 350D 300D 10D 60D

Based on performance, features and price.

I upgraded from a 300D to 20D for the following reasons in this order

Faster boot up time
Lower noise
better view finder
Higher resolution
Better build quality
faster frames per second.

Robert

[postcardcv]

If it was me the order of choice from 1st to last would be.

20D 350D 300D 10D 60D

I upgraded from a 300D to 20D for the following reasons in this order

Faster boot up time
Lower noise
better view finder
Higher resolution
Better build quality
faster frames per second.


I'd agree with the order that Robert has given. Personally I use the 350D, I upgrade to it from a 300D and have noticed most of the same advantages that have been given for the 20D. If you're on a limited budget the 350D is well worth considering it also has the fast boot up/wake up time and higher res. Though the 20D feels better built and has a higher frames per second shooting rate image quality is basically comparable between the two.

[paul goode]

robski,
ok, and why not a 10d? or d60?
(i was actually looking for one of these! don't ask why, i don't know, possibly money....)


Hi Sarel,

As has been said before the D60 has been around a while now and probably is rather dated. The 10D is used by a lot of photographers who get excellent results from them. However to buy one now they still seem to fetch a good price compared to a new 350D, which maybe apart from durability should outperform the 10D.

For wildlife photography the 300D has its limitations - small buffer, slowish burst rate and no A1 servo focus, and still some high prices on Ebay.

The 20D is the most expensive option - but seemingly getting cheaper by the day. £50 less today than I paid for one 2 weeks ago. Grrrrrr. That aside it is the best camera in the line up.

If price is your main factor my vote would be for the 350D

Hope that helps.

[Robert L Jarvis]

As I have a 300D, must say I concur with Paul about it's limitations. Basically suffering from being the first reasonably priced DSLR.

[robski]

The 300D is a great general purpose camera. In the first year I mainly used it for landscape and flower close ups. During the second year I started to take more bird shots. In the end I was getting so frustrated with the camera lined up on subject waiting then for it to kick in and take the shot. The number of gift shots I've lost because of the slow wake up time. ( bird exit left )

Robert

[christineredgate]

The 350 is the lightest of the cams,but may be hard to find a used model.20d is superb,but I have just had hubbies 300d cleaned and serviced,and the shots taken are great,very clear and sharp.There are these models to be had quite cheaply.

[Sarel]

Thanks guys!
Ok, you recommend the 20d, and then the 350d. But the 20d is quite expensive, and the 350d is small........if you compare it to the EOS5. ...
Now you can buy the EOS 300d, updated with the software for the eos10d........What does that mean? Is the 10d actually better than the 300d, or why do they do this update? So the 10d is not that bad?
Sorry to nag, but i haven't got a big wallet(well, i have one, but it's empty...).
That is why i was looking for the 10d(because they seem to keep a good price, so it is a good camara?)

What is then the "wake up time" of the 10d, 20d, 350d and 300d?

Sarel

[paul goode]

Thanks guys!
Ok, you recommend the 20d, and then the 350d. But the 20d is quite expensive, and the 350d is small........if you compare it to the EOS5. ...
Now you can buy the EOS 300d, updated with the software for the eos10d........What does that mean? Is the 10d actually better than the 300d, or why do they do this update? So the 10d is not that bad?
Sorry to nag, but i haven't got a big wallet(well, i have one, but it's empty...).
That is why i was looking for the 10d(because they seem to keep a good price, so it is a good camara?)

What is then the "wake up time" of the 10d, 20d, 350d and 300d?

Sarel

Hi Sarel,

I assume that when people refer to 10d software in a 300d they mean the hacked software available of the internet. This does NOT turn it into a 10d!!
It does improve the camera because it enables some of the custom functions but crucially it does not enable A1 servo focus.
My earlier comment on favouring the 350d based on price was because a secondhand 10d appears to be about the same price as a new 350d.
If you favour a 10d then go for it - many excellent pictures have been taken with them.

Wake up time on a 300d is a couple of seconds, on a 20d virtually instant. Don't have experience of the other 2.

[Sarel]

Thanks Paul.
Ok, i was thinking of what was going on with the software change! But here in Holland they say then(on the ebay, and ebay-equivelent sites) that you do get a little booklet with it after updating of how to use the camara. They say professionally done.... |8.|

But(again nagging, sorry for it, but i would like to buy one, not to expensive, but must fit nice in my hands(and the 350d seems small, with 3 fingers the grip is filled......) like my EOS5, but then you would maybe say: buy a pfroffesional SLR, but i haven't have the money for one at the moment! So that is why i was looking for the eos10d. But maybe i must have a look at the 350 then.

And what yoy say: [If you favour a 10d then go for it - many excellent pictures have been taken with them.]
Yes, that is a reason why i was actually looking for the 10d.

Sarel

[paul goode]

Thanks Paul.
Ok, i was thinking of what was going on with the software change! But here in Holland they say then(on the ebay, and ebay-equivelent sites) that you do get a little booklet with it after updating of how to use the camara. They say professionally done.... |8.|

But(again nagging, sorry for it, but i would like to buy one, not to expensive, but must fit nice in my hands(and the 350d seems small, with 3 fingers the grip is filled......) like my EOS5, but then you would maybe say: buy a pfroffesional SLR, but i haven't have the money for one at the moment! So that is why i was looking for the eos10d. But maybe i must have a look at the 350 then.

And what yoy say: [If you favour a 10d then go for it - many excellent pictures have been taken with them.]
Yes, that is a reason why i was actually looking for the 10d.

Sarel


Hi Sarel

I agree with you about the size of the 350d. Thats one of the reasons I changed from a 300d to a 20d rather than a 350d.
With regard to the 10d I think that if I had bought one rather than the 300d I would still be very happy with it and would certainly have more money in the bank. At the time 10d's were on a waiting list from Canon (shows how popular they were), and being impatient I went for the 300d.

As I said if you can get a 10d at a price you are happy with I don't think you will be dissappointed.

[postcardcv]

Thanks guys!
Ok, you recommend the 20d, and then the 350d. But the 20d is quite expensive, and the 350d is small........if you compare it to the EOS5. ...
Now you can buy the EOS 300d, updated with the software for the eos10d........What does that mean? Is the 10d actually better than the 300d, or why do they do this update? So the 10d is not that bad?
Sorry to nag, but i haven't got a big wallet(well, i have one, but it's empty...).
That is why i was looking for the 10d(because they seem to keep a good price, so it is a good camara?)

What is then the "wake up time" of the 10d, 20d, 350d and 300d?

Sarel

The wake up time on the 350D is the same as the 20D - both listed as 0.2 seconds, certainly seems instant. As far as I know the 10D has the same slow wake up time as the 300D, an annoying 2 seconds, it was enough to cause me to miss shots when using the 300D...

I agree that the 350D is a bit small in the hand (one of my big worries when I got it), but if you add the battery grip it feels just right (well it does to me) and also make shooting portrait much easier. When I changed from the 300D to eth 350D I did a breif comparisson which may be of interest - http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=39032

[greypoint]

Having used a 10D for around 6 months before swapping to Nikon, I can only agree that the most frustrating thing about it was the slow start up and how slowly it wrote to the memory card. Lots of lost shots if you're trying to capture flying birds or something suddenly appears whilst the camera is playing catch up. On the plus side it's tough and well built with a quiet shutter action and seems very cheap in comparison with a used 300D.

[Sarel]

Thanks guys for your help so far!
I was looking on the net as well for some info, and game accros this one from Bob Atkins:
http://bobatkins.photo.net/photography/digital/eos10d-rebel.html

If I do read this, the 10d does seem to score a lot!.

Then when i read your answers, it aqtually nly is the "wake-up" time that irritates people.

If you zoom in on say a bird, and then wait for the right pose, how long does it take before it goes "seeping" (it's aqtually battery save mode, not??)???

Hope i made myself clear, and that I get the last info from you guys.
Thanks in anyway for your help so far.
Otherwise i probably go for the 10d, and if not the 350d...the 20d is to expensive at the moment!

[robski]

Yes the 10D was the 20D in it's day. What you have to consider is the improvements made with the 20D and 350D which come from feedback about what people dislike about the 10D and 300D. You have not cut corners with your lens so why cut corners on the body. The point I was making that if you can stretch to a newer body I think you will save money in the long run.

The wake up time is closer to 3 second than 2. If you turn off power saving then you run the risk of running out of battery power. The older model of Camera are much heavier on battery than the new models.

I would say my 20D battery lasts 2 to 3 times longer than my 300D.

Regards Robert

[Sarel]

Robert,
Thanks for your comments. Ok, i understand what you try to tell me about the 10d. Look, the 8MP does not do anything for me, because I just take pictures for myself. So 6pm is enough for me.
But the other improvements, ok, you are right.
I am going to have a think now!
Thanks in anyway for al the help from al you guys! Very helpfull.
Sarel

[baillieswells]

Sorry for the confusing Thread, but I am looking for a good 2nd hand camara.
And now I am comfused myself!
What is the difference between thes camaras.
I do use at the moment the EOS 5, and would like somthing more or less the same, and thought the EOS 10d was good. But what is the difference between the EOS 10d and the EOS 60d??
I don't care about pixels, if it's more than 6, i am happy(and all of them are above the 6)

So, who can help me with a quick view of the differences between:

10d vs d60
edit: (the others as well, but they are more expensive i think)

Thanks
Sarel
edit 2: I will be using the 28-135 is and 300/4L is and 1.4x EF converter on the camara

Just to add my ha'penny worth to the arguments. In my opinion the Canon 350D/RebelXT is the best value digital SLR on the market today. (Though of course new models appear from day to day. viz the new 5D). The differences between the 350 and the 20D are slight, better to spend the extra money on a decent lens. The kit 18-55mm lens is a cheapy, far better to buy the 17-85mm ImageStabilized lens, or if you can afford it, the new 24-105mm f4L IS lens. This latter being an L lens is of the top quality. In a recent visit to South Africa I used my 17-85mm lens for lansdscape, buildings and flowers. For animals a 70-200mm f4L lens with 1.4 extender, this with the 350D 1.6 image factor gave a maximum focal length of 448mm. Excellent for elephants, rhinos, giraffes and antelopes, but not enough for small birds.I am now pondering which 200-500mm lens to get.

[bill lord]

Hi Sarel,

For wildlife photography the 300D has its limitations - small buffer, slowish burst rate and no A1 servo focus, and still some high prices on Ebay.

Hope that helps.

I have my 300d set to turn off after 5 mins without use, if I need it I press the button and raise it to my eye and it is ready to use, it could be quicker but.. I don't find it a problem. Canon Outlet 300d is available on ebay most days of the week, you get a new camera with a twelve months guarrantee direct from canon for approx £350. A1 servo focus is available on the camera if you use the sports mode put the bird you want into the focus frame and keep it on the bird whilst you pan, it will remain in focus.