Learning curve for 100-400

[chrisduval]

Any advice on picture taking - been practicing alot. Here's a Rufous Hummingbird this evening - not a lot of light. F4.5 and 1/60th. I think ISO 400... Still trying to figure out the ISO, metering, and aperture relationships. Been reading Morris' book and he says some very helpful things.... I have been using mostly evaluative metering with AV.

Also attached is a Green Heron I took from about 20 yards away...

Thanks for any advice.

Chris

[macshark]

Any advice on picture taking - been practicing alot. Here's a Rufous Hummingbird this evening - not a lot of light. F4.5 and 1/60th. I think ISO 400... Still trying to figure out the ISO, metering, and aperture relationships. Been reading Morris' book and he says some very helpful things.... I have been using mostly evaluative metering with AV.

Also attached is a Green Heron I took from about 20 yards away...

Thanks for any advice.

Chris

I am not very familiar with the 100-400 IS, but based on samples I have seen, it is a relatively good quality lens even at 400mm. Unless there is a specific problem with the copy of the 100-400L you have, the images you posted are either somewhat out of focus or do have some degree of camera shake. Even at 20 yds, I would expect the Green Heron picture to be sharper with that lens. Is this a 100% crop?

Even with IS, 1/60 may be a bit too slow of a shutter speed to use with this lens at 400mm. If the light isn't good enough, don't worry about cranking up the ISO. I am not sure which body you are using, but ISO800 is quite useable on a 350D/20D/30D and ISO1600 is acceptable.

To help with focus issues, it may be a good idea to use center focus only and reduce the aperture (f/8 maybe) to get a bit more DoF.

[Bish]

I have the same lens on my 30D & am now starting to get some good results after many poor images

I agree with macshark that your shutter speed is way too low, If you are using a camera with a 1.6x crop factor your focal length is 640mm & would suggest you use at least 1/500th if you are handholding the lens

I normally use AV with evaluate metering & use just the centre AF point, I mostly use Al SERVO with the IS set to mode 1 for static birds & mode 2 for flight shots

here are a few shots from yesterday

Regards Bish.

[rjb25073]

Any advice on picture taking - been practicing alot. Here's a Rufous Hummingbird this evening - not a lot of light. F4.5 and 1/60th. I think ISO 400... Still trying to figure out the ISO, metering, and aperture relationships. Been reading Morris' book and he says some very helpful things.... I have been using mostly evaluative metering with AV.

Also attached is a Green Heron I took from about 20 yards away...

Thanks for any advice.

Chris

Chris,
I'm no expert but it doesn't look like you have lots of camera shake as you would see a consistent 'shadow' type affect on the edges of the birds / plants. The heron should look better at 20m though. Try using AI focus, I recently moved more towards this than AI servo and it has improved my keeper rate.

try this url for affect of camera shake
http://www.photonhead.com/simcam/camerashake.php


Also do some experiments in poor light. Change the iso and try shooting at 1/15, 1/30, 1/60, 1/125, 1/250 and higher if light allows. Shoot at something of decent size at 20-30 metres, say a telegraph pole which has some detail or a sign. It will soon tell you at what point you get camera shake. i just got one of these lenses and at 400 mm 1/125 is fine and 1/60 hit and miss.

cheers,
Richard

ps when looking for feedback on issues such as these is good to past 100 % crops and let every know thats what they are. The hummer pics are ok if they are 100 % crops but pretty dodgy if they are resized full frame !

[bpw]

If you are using a camera with a 1.6x crop factor your focal length is 640mm & would suggest you use at least 1/500th if you are handholding the lens

I normally use AV with evaluate metering & use just the centre AF point, I mostly use Al SERVO with the IS set to mode 1 for static birds & mode 2 for flight shots.
I don’t think the crop factor is relevant here; the focal length is 400mm and the ‘rule of thumb’ with non-IS lenses is to pick a shutter speed equal to or greater then the focal length. With IS it’s different, and I think Canon produce stats?

Some use AI Servo for static birds, but most use One-Shot or its equivalent. With AI Servo the point of focus is always shifting as the subject and/or camera moves, so you must keep the active AF point directly over the birds eye or it won’t be in focus. This is often tricky, and will sometimes mean it's not possible to frame the shot as you might want to.

[chrisduval]

Chris,
I'm no expert but it doesn't look like you have lots of camera shake as you would see a consistent 'shadow' type affect on the edges of the birds / plants. The heron should look better at 20m though. Try using AI focus, I recently moved more towards this than AI servo and it has improved my keeper rate.

try this url for affect of camera shake
http://www.photonhead.com/simcam/camerashake.php


Also do some experiments in poor light. Change the iso and try shooting at 1/15, 1/30, 1/60, 1/125, 1/250 and higher if light allows. Shoot at something of decent size at 20-30 metres, say a telegraph pole which has some detail or a sign. It will soon tell you at what point you get camera shake. i just got one of these lenses and at 400 mm 1/125 is fine and 1/60 hit and miss.

cheers,
Richard

ps when looking for feedback on issues such as these is good to past 100 % crops and let every know thats what they are. The hummer pics are ok if they are 100 % crops but pretty dodgy if they are resized full frame !

Please forgive my ignorance, but what exactly is a 100% crop? A non-resized original version, uncropped?

[IanF]

From my use of this lens, my experience has been that it's best to increase ISO to 400 or 800 so as to enable a reduction in aperture to at least f6,3 or better and try for at least 1/400 if handholding. Even the slight reduction in aperture greatly improves performance. At f8 the lens is very sharp indeed.

I also find that 1/400 is about the minimum to aim for as anything less even with IS starts to be hit and miss. You can get away with using slower speeds but to my mind a grainy sharp photo is preferable to slightly blurred and no noise. It's so easy to reduce noise with filtration software nowadays.

I tend to use a single central focus point for the autofocus and try to get that over the eye of the bird. I almost exclusively use AIFOCUS.

[Keith Reeder]

100% crop is all or part of the image at "actual pixels" - ie not resized at all.

[chrisduval]

100% crop is all or part of the image at "actual pixels" - ie not resized at all.

Thanks for all your advice. I was a little concerned that perhaps my lens might be faulty (as I had heard alot about some lenses being soft) but I can see that the issue was mine, not the lens... Hoping, at any rate, that the issue is not the lens....

Are these a bit in the right direction? I tried to use higher shutter speeds and at F8.

The flight shot is at 1/1000 and F8
Open mouth shot is at 1/1000 and F8
Portrait shot is at 1/500 and F8

I can see that I can probably use even higher ISO numbers and get higher shutter speeds and thereby get sharper pictures.

Thanks for you advice - off to practice...

Chris

[kato1]

Any advice on picture taking - been practicing alot. Here's a Rufous Hummingbird this evening - not a lot of light. F4.5 and 1/60th. I think ISO 400... Still trying to figure out the ISO, metering, and aperture relationships. Been reading Morris' book and he says some very helpful things.... I have been using mostly evaluative metering with AV.

Also attached is a Green Heron I took from about 20 yards away...

Thanks for any advice.

Chris
Hi,
I use the Canon 100 - 400 on a 10D. I use this lens almost exclusively because my main subjects are birds (and I can't afford anything much bigger). I reckon it's a good lens and can produce great results. You can hand hold at really low shutter speeds but often the results depend on a bit of good luck, ie, birds are always moving, so unless the shutter speed is high enough you will always get some deterioration of sharpness. However, if you can catch the bird sitting still you can still achieve sharp photos at low shutter speed. Always try to get the eyes in perfect focus, sharp eyes and slightly blurred feathers always look much better than the reverse. Crank up the ISO to get faster speeds, anything above the 10D seems to cope well at high ISO and dont be afraid to experiment - thats one of the great things about digital, you can take as many pictures as you want and discard those you don't like. Lastly, don't forget lighting - early morning light is often just right, as is early evening ..........
good luck
Kato

[rjb25073]

Thanks for all your advice. I was a little concerned that perhaps my lens might be faulty (as I had heard alot about some lenses being soft) but I can see that the issue was mine, not the lens... Hoping, at any rate, that the issue is not the lens....

Are these a bit in the right direction? I tried to use higher shutter speeds and at F8.

The flight shot is at 1/1000 and F8
Open mouth shot is at 1/1000 and F8
Portrait shot is at 1/500 and F8

I can see that I can probably use even higher ISO numbers and get higher shutter speeds and thereby get sharper pictures.

Thanks for you advice - off to practice...

Chris

Hi Chris,
you don't need us to tell you that the sittings shots seem much better :-) The flight shot isn't great but they are notoriously difficult.

I also have the 400 f5.6 and thought it was dodgy when I first got it, guess what, it turned out to be me ! The step up from 300 to 400 mm shots seem to make a big difference in difficulty. Just practice, practice, practice and you will see them getting better and better.

If you are genuinely concerned about the lens do some test shots under controlled conditions. Try using a tripod, IS off, mirror lock up and shooting a dollar bill taped to a flat surface such as a window on the same level as the camera. Then do a search on DPreview (or another similar website) and you will be able to compare yours against others. Remember to sharpen the images first as the in camera sharpening varies depending upon which mode you use.

Good luck,
Richard

[Keith Reeder]

Chris,

when I first got a Sigma 80-400mm OS lens for my Nikon, I wrestled with the "is it working properly or not?" dilemma for a full three months before things just clicked and I started getting pictures I was really happy with.

Now that I'm using your lens, I've been through something of the same thing, but my past experience with the Sigma has left me much more relaxed about the odd dodgy shots I get with the Canon.

While I agree with every word written above about keeping a high shutter speed, I'd also say that it's worth developing a good hand-holding technique that doesn't rely totally on IS - then, if you get caught out by the light (I wish Canon cameras had Auto ISO!) you still have a good chance of a sharp shot at low shutter speeds, because the combination of good technique and IS is a hard one to beat unless you go back to a tripod.

I was caught out just like that yesterday and ended up taking this picture at 1/60, but it's still OK I think...

Mind you, I thinnk your hummer is great too.

I shoot RAW, incidentally, and convert with Bibble Lite.

The point being, technique and IS are a great combo!

;)

[chrisduval]

Chris,

when I first got a Sigma 80-400mm OS lens for my Nikon, I wrestled with the "is it working properly or not?" dilemma for a full three months before things just clicked and I started getting pictures I was really happy with.

Now that I'm using your lens, I've been through something of the same thing, but my past experience with the Sigma has left me much more relaxed about the odd dodgy shots I get with the Canon.

While I agree with every word written above about keeping a high shutter speed, I'd also say that it's worth developing a good hand-holding technique that doesn't rely totally on IS - then, if you get caught out by the light (I wish Canon cameras had Auto ISO!) you still have a good chance of a sharp shot at low shutter speeds, because the combination of good technique and IS is a hard one to beat unless you go back to a tripod.

I was caught out just like that yesterday and ended up taking this picture at 1/60, but it's still OK I think...

Mind you, I thinnk your hummer is great too.

I shoot RAW, incidentally, and convert with Bibble Lite.

The point being, technique and IS are a great combo!

;)

Thanks so much all - and Keith I think those Starling shots are amazing....

Chris