Digic 3 procesor from Canon

[nigelblake]

http://www.canon.co.jp/Imaging/becommon/camera/digic3-e.html

First news of the new Digic 3 processor in the Powershot G7,

Fuel to the speculation that there is a 1Ds Mk3 due up as Digic 3 has been mentioned in relation to that too, I bet this will be in the 40D when that comes out as well.

[UlfL]

[url]Fuel to the speculation that there is a 1Ds Mk3 due up as Digic 3 has been mentioned in relation to that too, I bet this will be in the 40D when that comes out as well.
And in the 5d II too, surely. Next generation of Canon image processing, this sounds as there is surely something coming on Photokina!
Regards,
Ulf

[tjsimonsen]

And in the 5d II too, surely. Next generation of Canon image processing, this sounds as there is surely something coming on Photokina!
Regards,
Ulf
Well, it does sound interesting, but wouldn't you shoot RAW with a 5D or 1D anyways?

/Thomas

[Steve G]

Well, it does sound interesting, but wouldn't you shoot RAW with a 5D or 1D anyways?

/Thomas
Even in RAW the output from the CMOS still requires processing whilst any ISO setting other than native requires signal boosting (which creates noise) -hence the importance of these processors. It is the presumptive high signal amplification:low noise ratio of this new processor which will be attractive though it will probably also help improve AF & perhaps even allow AF at apertures >5.6 in the anticipated 40D...... come on Canon you know it makes sense! ;)

[macshark]

Even in RAW the output from the CMOS still requires processing whilst any ISO setting other than native requires signal boosting (which creates noise) -hence the importance of these processors. It is the presumptive high signal amplification:low noise ratio of this new processor which will be attractive though it will probably also help improve AF & perhaps even allow AF at apertures >5.6 in the anticipated 40D...... come on Canon you know it makes sense! ;)

Isn't the ampflication function associated with high ISO boosting done on the sensor itself?

AF at apertures >5.6 is also a function of the AF sensor, not the DIGIC processor.

Most of the horsepower in the DIGIC II/III is used for RAW to JPEG conversion AFAIK.

[yossi]

Canon got to do something different with the Digic III in their new DSLRs.
At the pictures they have published of the new G7, the noise at iso 80 is unacceptable IMHO:
http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=SampleImagesAct&fcategoryid=144&modelid=14321

[Steve G]

Isn't the ampflication function associated with high ISO boosting done on the sensor itself?

AF at apertures >5.6 is also a function of the AF sensor, not the DIGIC processor.

Most of the horsepower in the DIGIC II/III is used for RAW to JPEG conversion AFAIK.
One of the many attractive features of these processors is the low power consumption -horsepower don't come into it Mac.

Autofocus is indeed one of the functions of DIGIC processors -the beauty of these processors is that they combine all the functions previously undertaken by multiple 'chips' into a single processor increasing processing speed & reducing power consumption.

Image signal boosting at high ISO can't be done by the sensor (though some sensors are more sensitive in low light than others). It is effectively the processor which 'boosts' the ISO:-
here is a direct quote from Canon (see Nigel's link above) re the DIGIC III processor: 'Also, its “noise reduction signal processing” at ISO 1600 enables the image quality to be adequae with not conspicuous noise'.

[macshark]

Image signal boosting at high ISO can't be done by the sensor (though some sensors are more sensitive in low light than others). It is effectively the processor which 'boosts' the ISO:-
here is a direct quote from Canon (see Nigel's link above) re the DIGIC III processor: 'Also, its “noise reduction signal processing” at ISO 1600 enables the image quality to be adequae with not conspicuous noise'.

Noise reduction is different from signal boosting. One of Canon's strong arguments for the CMOS sensor was the fact that amplifiers and other signal pre-processing logic could be integrated on the same die as the sensor itself. Here is a quote from the original Canon CMOS sensor press-release (http://www.dpreview.com/news/0005/00051902canoncmos_eetimes.asp):
Canon engineers developed three new technologies for their CMOS sensor: on-chip noise reduction; electronic charge transfer; and on-chip programmable gain amplification. All were key breakthroughs, said Shigeyuki Matsumoto, senior general manager at Canon's device development center.

[macshark]

Canon got to do something different with the Digic III in their new DSLRs.
At the pictures they have published of the new G7, the noise at iso 80 is unacceptable IMHO:
http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=SampleImagesAct&fcategoryid=144&modelid=14321

I think that kind of noise is quite acceptable for a 10MP P&S digicam.

[nigelblake]

Seems SteveG has made the same comments here as I would, but the exciting thing about this processor is the speedier throughput of data which will enable higher shooting rates (frames per second) or more RAW frames before buffer lockout.
Seen in perspective the 10.1 Mp sensor size of the 400D is the thing that I am most interested in, if the pixel pitch the APS size sensor of the 400D is calculated out to fit a full frame sensor then 26.25Mp is possible, so the faster processing of the Digic 3 points towards the EOS 1Ds Mk3 when it is announced being a 25Mp+ camera that will likely have a 5 FPS capability.
I also like the idea of being able to shoot at higher ISO's with less noise, if 800 ISO had the same smoothness that 400 ISO has on the 1Ds MkII it would open up the possibility of some very exciting advances in what sort of action images can be shot with available light.

[Robert L Jarvis]

The Digic 3 and 10mp sensor has also been put in the Ixus 900 which has just been announced by canon.

[peteh]

Dont know if anyone has posted these rumours up but the latest are
* 35D/40D 12MP, Digic III, 5 FPS, 1.6x, new AF, $1300
* 3D 16MP, better AF with poss Eye control, 5 FPS, 6400 ISO with 12800 mode, more expensive than current 5D
* 5D Mk2 12MP, 5 FPS, Dustproof, slightly cheaper than current 5D
* Come January........EOS 1 SP (for sport) 17MP 1.25x crop, improved (lighter and longer lasting) battery, better high ISO noise than 1D2 (however still restricted to 3200), slightly less agressive AA filter for sharper images without PP, 45 point focus system but with two additional cross sensors at the extreme ends of the AF elipse, 8.5 fps with 25 raw buffer, Digic 3, 2 user configurable buttons, in-camera WiFi (limited range, WiFi unit still required for long range transmission), dust reduction system. Camera is 14cm high, same width, and slightly lighter. No change to flash system.
EOS 1 ST (Studio) FF version released two months later at PMA. No details on MP yet."

[Keith Reeder]

I did post up some scurrilous 40D/5D rumours earlier, but they seem to have vanished without trace - presumably because I attributed them to another forum, warranting(?) the removal of the posting by a mod...

[eastwood]

I would dream of a 40D with: Digic III Processor, 12+ MP something like 18-21 point AF, and 5 FPS. If that comes true, I will consider buying one.

[UlfL]

* 3D 16MP, better AF with poss Eye control, 5 FPS, 6400 ISO with 12800 mode, more expensive than current 5D
* 5D Mk2 12MP, 5 FPS, Dustproof, slightly cheaper than current 5D
* Come January........EOS 1 SP (for sport) 17MP 1.25x crop,
Don't think we will see a 3D and a new 5D. From Canons point of view, there are probably enough models on the market, no need to introduce a new product line.
The 1DMkIIN is currently dropping in price, indicating that there might be something going on. But I'm quite sure that not even Canon will be able to more than double the amount of MP in the new 1D. 10 or 12 MP are more likely.

Regards,
Ulf

[Andy Bright]

I did post up some scurrilous 40D/5D rumours earlier, but they seem to have vanished without trace - presumably because I attributed them to another forum, warranting(?) the removal of the posting by a mod...Don't think so Keith, there's one you deleted yourself at 00:39 ? I can reinstate it if you wish.
Did you post this 'missing' post in this thread or somewhere else. We don't have a problem with links to articles or relevant threads on other dedicated photography sites (Dpr et all)

[peteh]

Don't think we will see a 3D and a new 5D. From Canons point of view, there are probably enough models on the market, no need to introduce a new product line.
The 1DMkIIN is currently dropping in price, indicating that there might be something going on. But I'm quite sure that not even Canon will be able to more than double the amount of MP in the new 1D. 10 or 12 MP are more likely.

Regards,
Ulf

I disagree i cant see there flagship professional models coming out with the same mp as their entry level dslr. Doesnt the 1ds mkII have 16mp now?

Its going to be an interesting year tho.. Deciding which camera to upgrade too. the 40d, 3d or 1d sp.

[Keith Reeder]

Hi Andy,

no problem - what I had in mind was pretty much what Peteh said anyway.

[peteh]

I would dream of a 40D with: Digic III Processor, 12+ MP something like 18-21 point AF, and 5 FPS. If that comes true, I will consider buying one.

I love camera rumours. Today there was a leak on the Canon HK website with a page for the 40d which has been taken down now, there were no details but the latest spec rumour on the 40d is
* Anti-dust
* 5D like AF
* 10.2mp 4 channel sensor (though they were testing a 12 mp one)
* Still 1.6 crop for those EF-S lenses
* DIGIC III and sensor changes to give better high ISO and lower noise (especially at 1600 and 3200 ISO)
* Very similar appearance to 30D


The question is when is it going to be announced. The PMA is in march. But will Canon announce the new 1d's or the 40d or both.....

[gmax]

I love camera rumours.

I hate camera rumours! A 40D, sigh sigh ... my poor bank balance :gn:

[John N]

I am waiting hopefully for the arrival of the 40D. hope my wife doesn't read this or she will be hiding my Barclay card!

[peteh]

Well the latest is.
the "face of Canon" will be the one being announced at the PMA in march with no others announced this half of the year.
So this means either the 1dmk3 or the 1dsmk3.

I love hearing all this stuff and then seeing how much is actually correct when stuff comes out.

The other thing that is interesting is a beta tester was spotted and all the name bits were taped up but it had a 3 inch screen on the back of it.... he quickly put it away and went back to shooting with his 1dmk2n. hmmm
could that be the new 1dmk3...
oooo exciting hahahaha
im praying its not going to be more than 3k.

[peteh]

just to update the rumours

new 1d and 1ds to be announced soon.
1d - full frame, 10fps, upto iso6400. but $4500! eek
and all it said on the 1ds was upto 22mp.

oh and theres supposed to be dealers being told on the 23rd of feb ...

im depressed now .. even if the currency was converted as thats stands your talking £2400. So rip off britain means more like £3000 to £3500. bum

[Keith Reeder]

Any scuttlebutt on new lenses, Pete?

[macshark]

just to update the rumours

new 1d and 1ds to be announced soon.
1d - full frame, 10fps, upto iso6400. but $4500! eek
and all it said on the 1ds was upto 22mp.

oh and theres supposed to be dealers being told on the 23rd of feb ...

im depressed now .. even if the currency was converted as thats stands your talking £2400. So rip off britain means more like £3000 to £3500. bum

If this is true, Canon's message to birders is clear: get the 40D!

[Keith Reeder]

Naaah, I'm sticking with my 30D...

[postcardcv]

new 1d and 1ds to be announced soon.
1d - full frame, 10fps, upto iso6400.

I wonder how many people felt that 8.5fps was just too slow... surely not too many. For shots of flyers the AF will need to be amazing to adjust between shots...

[peteh]

Any scuttlebutt on new lenses, Pete?

Well theres the rumour of a 100-400L f4 thats been going round for a bit but alot of people seem to be scoffing that one saying its not going to happen it would be to expensive etc.

so nothing on lenses that would be useful to us birdy people.

oh i forgot to mention the new 1d will be in the body of the 1v .... its Canons pro film body. so no grip. Looks like a 5d to me.
Rumours flying around that there will be all sorts of grip accessories to be bought like wifi, gps, etc etc.

Ah I found the info . so here it is

snip.

Canon high end strategy goes for 35mm format
New Canon high-end cameras announced: D1 and D1S models with 35mm format sensor area.

The new D1 packs the sensor of the 5D in a really robust body, the film-loading 1V (end to that era?). The capture speed is very high and there is that mysterious comment that the 1D has no memory buffer, presumably wring directly to the flash card. The new 1Ds shares the same body and brings the pixel count to 22 million on a 24x36mm area. The most intriguing remark is Canons statement that from now on there will be no more 1.3 crop sensors. The strategy then is clear: the amateur market will be served by APS-C with 1.5/1.6 crop factor and a new range of lenses. The professional high-end market will be exclusively served by full-format sensors allowing all Canon lenses to operate at the true computed focal length and viewing angle. Canon seems to be quite confident that the problems with the 35mm format can be addressed and overcome. There is now also an ISO 6400 value available. The new cameras will be formidable instruments, the 1D attacking the professional market for mobile photography and the 1Ds (with 22 M pixels) attacking the medium format stationary (studio) photography. There is a risk here: many professional reportage photographers do not want nor need that huge amount of pixels. Is Nikon smarter in this respect and listening more closely to the market?

Nikon continues to state that they will not embark on that route and stay faithful to the APS format derivatives. For how long we may ask?

The 1D will retail for 4500 dollars and will be cheaper than the Leica M8. This is not a clash of civilisations, but a minor clash of belief. The M8 couples a mechanical film-loading body to a solid state sensor and retains as much of the classical values as can be done within the technological constraints.

snip.

[GYRob]

i sure hope any new camera will have a quiet shutter ,the 1dmk2 is so loud it scare's birds away . my 400d is far better in this respect.
Rob.

[eastwood]

I enjoy hearing rumours.....but only before looking at my bank account.....