Bin too heavy? Try this.

[KorHaan]

Hello everyone,

I'm always looking for ways to make my fullsized bins less cumbersome around my neck. Trouble is, I don't want to wear a bino harness because it's kind of a fuzz to put your coat on and off.
The functionality of broad neckstraps is overrated IMO; I've tried dozens and they don't work for me. My FL's still feel too heavy.

So I invented the counterweight on my neckstrap. To begin with, I hung the binocase on the neck end of the strap, with some weight in it. This worked well, but it looked like I'd grown a hump and it got in the way on my back while carrying a rucksack.

Then I came up with a buckle tied to the neck end of the strap, this was definitely an improvement as a counterweight. I used a so called karabiner, a buckle used by mountain climbers, available in every outdoors sportshop.

See the attached thumbnail: BUCKLE

Though reasonably comfortable ( the buckle of 125 grams on the neckstrap made my 740 grams FL's feel like 615 grams ) this bino carrier needed further improvement, and I came up with something else: the bino yoke.

See the attached thumbnail: BIN YOKE

I know it looks ridiculous, and one will have to face the more traditionally thinking birding mob, but guess what: it immediately worked! An old wooden coathanger and two pieces of strap attached made my bins virtually weightless; I noticed they were there, on my chest, but with my DIY yoke the weight is effectively distributed where it should be: round the shoulders.

Next weekend I will be visiting a binocular festival with Zeiss, Swaro and Leica stands, and I'm gonna wear this yoke thing. Can't think of the reactions, but I will post again after the festival and let you all know.

Greetings, Ronald

[John Butler]

Hi Ronald.

A very inventive idea and you have obviously spent a lot of time on this project and if it works for you, then great. Who knows, it could be the greatest invention since the "Finnstick" method of relieving the weight of bino´s.

On a lighter note (sic). Why not leave the hook in the coathanger. Then when you go into a birdhide, you can hang yourself on a convenient point and take the weight off your feet, as well as your shoulders.

[Tero]

Sounds good. The finer binoculars weigh too much. I think this is because people want to get something for 1000 dollars, not just plastic.

[KorHaan]

Hi Ronald.



On a lighter note (sic). Why not leave the hook in the coathanger. Then when you go into a birdhide, you can hang yourself on a convenient point and take the weight off your feet, as well as your shoulders.

LOL

Hope there will be kind people around to help me down. Must find something to unhook myself... Boy, is birding getting complicated these days!

:-) Greetings,

Ronald

[KorHaan]

Sounds good. The finer binoculars weigh too much.

Hi Tero,

You're right. Wish I had thought of this coathanger strap many years earlier, I once had a very good Russian 7x50 porro that was indestructable. After 8 years of use I sold it in the Ivory Coast where it had gloriously withstood all weather influences of the damp rain forest during 6 months.
It weighed 950 grams and I wanted something less heavy. Back in the Netherlands I bought a 7x42 Optolyth Alpin Classic, lightweight 460 grams.
It fogged up the very next day when I was out birding in the rain. Went back and got a new one on guarantee. Left it on the plane at Fiumicino Airport near Rome, foolishly, on an intermediate stop on the way to Senegal.
Ordered a 7x50 Optolyth Alpin Classic ( 620 grams ) a few days after arriving in Senegal. Wonderful bins for such a hot, dusty country. After a year I went back to Holland and the very next outing in pooring rain... they fogged up.
These lightweight porro's are just no good in wet environments.
Have had dozens of bins after, most of them good but too heavy. So now I've developed a bit of a stoop, and some back trouble.

Greetings, Ronald

[mook]

Hi Ronald,

BIN YOKE.....I like it! No reason why this device wouldn't appeal to the well heeled 'bird spotter'.....how about a Chanel coathanger for your (crystal-encrusted) Swarovskis, Hugo Boss for your Leicas, Prada for your Zeiss....??? The pose factor is limited only by ones taste (and wallet size!).

Cheers,

Mook.

[Nick-on]

Hi Ronald.

On a lighter note (sic). Why not leave the hook in the coathanger. Then when you go into a birdhide, you can hang yourself on a convenient point and take the weight off your feet, as well as your shoulders.

:clap: very droll

[Alurap]

Why not hire a "binocular caddy" to carry the, a complete assortment of optics, for you? .... 8X32 Lecia, 8X42 Zeiss FL's, 10X42 Swaro elites, 7X42 Zeiss classics, 8X32 nikon SE (gotta have a porro or two onhand) and he may as well have a scope or two (a 60MM and 80MM) with a variety of eye-pieces...at the ready.


"Oooh, scope caddy....the 10X42's pronto!"

Hi Ronald,

BIN YOKE.....I like it! No reason why this device wouldn't appeal to the well heeled 'bird spotter'.....how about a Chanel coathanger for your (crystal-encrusted) Swarovskis, Hugo Boss for your Leicas, Prada for your Zeiss....??? The pose factor is limited only by ones taste (and wallet size!).

Cheers,

Mook.

[Henry B]

Why not hire a "binocular caddy" to carry the, a complete assortment of optics, for you? .... 8X32 Lecia, 8X42 Zeiss FL's, 10X42 Swaro elites, 7X42 Zeiss classics, 8X32 nikon SE (gotta have a porro or two onhand) and he may as well have a scope or two (a 60MM and 80MM) with a variety of eye-pieces...at the ready.


"Oooh, scope caddy....the 10X42's pronto!"

Don,t forget the tri-pod.:hi:

[ThoLa]

Why not hire a "binocular caddy" to carry the, a complete assortment of optics, for you? .... 8X32 Lecia, 8X42 Zeiss FL's, 10X42 Swaro elites, 7X42 Zeiss classics, 8X32 nikon SE (gotta have a porro or two onhand) and he may as well have a scope or two (a 60MM and 80MM) with a variety of eye-pieces...at the ready.


"Oooh, scope caddy....the 10X42's pronto!"


Would a placidly frugal donkey not be less expensive in the long run,
serving basically the same purpose.

Unless one sets off for a bird-watching sea-cruise, of course.

Tom

[David Smith]

Your idea won't take off. There is a much cheaper answer already on the market in the UK. They cost £1.00 for 20 and they call them Bin' bags. I find they are a bit on the big side but I persevere.

[mook]

Oh no.....now we're starting to get Google ads for 'bins' as wells as 'Bins' - see beneath posts.

I had to read your post twice David before I comprehended.....thought you'd replied to the wrong thread!

Funny though.....

Cheers,

Mook.

PS. Those charity bags that are constantly dumped through the letter box are even cheaper....they're branded too & come in various colours!

[MacGee]

Ronald, I tried your counterweight system experimentally and it did seem to work, though I think I used too heavy and too large a weight. When I raised the bins to my eyes the weight pulled the strap too far down and I had the webbing parts scratching my stubble. There was also the certainty that I would eventually forget about the weight and concuss myself or maybe decapitate a passing child.

I met a man in a hide who had his bins on a long strap and carried them in the case on his belt. But his were a lot lighter than mine—or even yours.

I recently had a similar idea to your yoke idea, except that my yoke was a neoprene strap that stretched across the shoulders and part way down the back. Now that you've introduced the counterweight concept, I might incorporate some extra weight into the bit going down the back.

I did try your coat hanger idea, but the wood pressed on the vertebra at the base of my neck. Painful. I'd need to cut away the centre so that it formed an arch to accommodate the bony projection. But since I'll never have the courage to go out in public wearing it, it doesn't seem worth the effort.

Keep up the good work.

Michael.

[KorHaan]

Very funny, thanks all for the suggestions and remarks. :-)

Donkeys do have a habit of stopping in the middle of a walk so I'd have to hire a donkey driver as well; a camel might be a better option, high vantage point and room for a couple of crates of beer. Or an elephant ( too expensive ).

Or may be a well trained big dog ( Danish ) with saddlebags for the whole lot?
I even made a comic strip once on this.

Greetings, Ronald

PS : I just had a good idea about something completely off-topic, but interesting for binocular owners who wear spectacles. I'll produce drawings and post Little Ron explaining things. But first have to think it out a bit more.

[KorHaan]

Ronald, I tried your counterweight system experimentally and it did seem to work, though I think I used too heavy and too large a weight. When I raised the bins to my eyes the weight pulled the strap too far down and I had the webbing parts scratching my stubble. There was also the certainty that I would eventually forget about the weight and concuss myself or maybe decapitate a passing child.

I met a man in a hide who had his bins on a long strap and carried them in the case on his belt. But his were a lot lighter than mine—or even yours.

I recently had a similar idea to your yoke idea, except that my yoke was a neoprene strap that stretched across the shoulders and part way down the back. Now that you've introduced the counterweight concept, I might incorporate some extra weight into the bit going down the back.

I did try your coat hanger idea, but the wood pressed on the vertebra at the base of my neck. Painful. I'd need to cut away the centre so that it formed an arch to accommodate the bony projection. But since I'll never have the courage to go out in public wearing it, it doesn't seem worth the effort.

Keep up the good work.

Michael.

Michael,

I forgot to mention the hazardous nature of the counterweight, thanks for that. Indeed was I reminded it was there every time I bent over to pick something up.
Maybe that was the reason I started to think about a yoke.

Your neoprene strap yoke combined with a counterweight is a splendid idea, do give it a try. You never know how well this might work.

The wooden coathanger I use does press a bit on my lower neck vertebrae but thanks to my stoop I experience little discomfort. However, there's always room for improvement, so instead of cutting away a piece in the center I could apply some cushioning on the ends to elevate the center into a more ergonomic and comfortable position.
I'm sorry to hear it's painful for you, I'll start thinking of something else than a coathanger, something rigid that doesn't look too odd and also does the job.

Oh, and I went out in public today with the yoke, to my local patch, where I met three birding companions who were surprised but didn't mock me. That's a relief. Once you put forward the meaning of the structure there's little opposition, is my tentative conclusion.
Only thing that bothered me a bit was that I was wearing a rucksack that pushed up the wooden yoke a bit, putting some more pressure where it shouldn't be.
It certainly was more comfortable though than a neoprene neckstrap, since it was a hot, humid afternoon and my neck didn't get sweaty. Advantage point here!

Greetings, Ronald

[David Smith]

The counterweight idea sounded good so I tried it. It works to some extent but I did have problems. I put a 5.0 Kilo counterweight on the back but this was little too much so I added an extra 3.0 Kilos to the front. This again was a little too much so I added a further 1.0 Kilo to the back. As I say it gave me some initial problems but if I ever manage to stand up it should be OK

[ThoLa]

The counterweight idea sounded good so I tried it.


The dedicated birder never leaves the house with just one pair of binoculars anyway.
So why not knot 2 of them together on a pair of cords. 7x42 on the ventral side, 10x42 on the dorsal. If you need the other one, you just give the one on the front-side a heartily push to make it swirl to the back (like a bola). The other one will in due course be set in motion. With a little bit of training you'll be able to grasp it from midair when it comes zooming along on the belly-side.
Great show and certainly less ridiculous than wearing a coat-hanger.
T

[John Butler]

The dedicated birder never leaves the house with just one pair of binoculars anyway.
So why not knot 2 of them together on a pair of cords. 7x42 on the ventral side, 10x42 on the dorsal. If you need the other one, you just give the one on the front-side a heartily push to make it swirl to the back (like a bola). The other one will in due course be set in motion. With a little bit of training you'll be able to grasp it from midair when it comes zooming along on the belly-side.
Great show and certainly less ridiculous than wearing a coat-hanger.
T

Hi ThoLa

I have just tried the method you suggested and found a serious flaw in the system.

My 10x42´s weigh much more than my 7x42´s.

After using the 10x42,s for 2 minutes I then swung them around to my back with a flourish so that the 7x42´s would come into play. Unfortunately, the heavier weight of the 10x42´s meant that gravity took over and they slipped further down my back as they passed around my body. Instead of the other bins coming immediately to hand (as I had anticipated), this had the effect of raising the lighter 7x42´s to such an extent that I was clouted on the nose by the turned-down eye cup of the 7x42´s, resulting in a fracture of the nose and a hasty visit to the casualty department of the local hospital.

Now, with the very large bandage dressing that was applied to the injury in place, I find it very painful to use either pair of binoculars, although the lighter 7x42´s cause a little less discomfort.

Are you sure that you tested this method before giving out this advice?

[NoSpringChicken]

Hi ThoLa

I have just tried the method you suggested and found a serious flaw in the system.

My 10x42´s weigh much more than my 7x42´s.

After using the 10x42,s for 2 minutes I then swung them around to my back with a flourish so that the 7x42´s would come into play. Unfortunately, the heavier weight of the 10x42´s meant that gravity took over and they slipped further down my back as they passed around my body. Instead of the other bins coming immediately to hand (as I had anticipated), this had the effect of raising the lighter 7x42´s to such an extent that I was clouted on the nose by the turned-down eye cup of the 7x42´s, resulting in a fracture of the nose and a hasty visit to the casualty department of the local hospital.

Now, with the very large bandage dressing that was applied to the injury in place, I find it very painful to use either pair of binoculars, although the lighter 7x42´s cause a little less discomfort.

Are you sure that you tested this method before giving out this advice?

Surely by resting the binoculars on the bandage you can take some of the weight off your arms now which must be a bit of compensation.

Has anyone tried attaching their binoculars to a modified Bob Dylan style harmonica bracket? I'm thinking wire coat hangers here.

Ron

[stronzo]

The answer to all our prays.

Imagine the scene, your tired, wet and cold. Not sure if it was a Mega lifer or a piece of carrier bag caught by the wind. Miles from the car, thermos empty and scope dragging you down.

Bear bot (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/6729745.stm) is the answer:bounce:

Available by mail order soon

P.S I really like the quote from the article "A really important thing when you're dealing with casualties is trying to maintain that human touch."

[John Butler]

Surely by resting the binoculars on the bandage you can take some of the weight off your arms now which must be a bit of compensation.Ron


Just tried that, but each time I rotate the focus wheel, the bandage rucks up in front of one of my eyes.

[NoSpringChicken]

Just tried that, but each time I rotate the focus wheel, the bandage rucks up in front of one of my eyes.

Hmm, it sounds as if you might have found a flaw in ThoLa's otherwise excellent system. You could try purchasing a simple dust mask from your local DIY store. It might just do the trick.

Ron

[NoSpringChicken]

The answer to all our prays.

Imagine the scene, your tired, wet and cold. Not sure if it was a Mega lifer or a piece of carrier bag caught by the wind. Miles from the car, thermos empty and scope dragging you down.

Bear bot (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/6729745.stm) is the answer:bounce:

Available by mail order soon

P.S I really like the quote from the article "A really important thing when you're dealing with casualties is trying to maintain that human touch."

Oh, no, I've been shot. Wait a minute, I've just been rescued by a giant teddy bear. I can relax now.

[John Butler]

You could try purchasing a simple dust mask from your local DIY store. It might just do the trick. Ron

Hi Ron.

That sounded like a great idea so I went to the local "DIY" and bought a dust mask.

It fitted comfortably over the bandage with no discomfort and I thought "Ron is a genius". However, when I rotated the focus wheel, it caught in the dust mask, which slipped sideways, exerting additional stress on the elastic that held the dust mask in place. This resulted in the elastic breaking at the back of my head. This in turn caused the loose strand of elastic to whip round and hit me squarely in the right eye.

After a second visit to the casualty department, I now have a very heavy bandage on my nose and am now wearing an eye-patch.

[NoSpringChicken]

Hi Ron.

That sounded like a great idea so I went to the local "DIY" and bought a dust mask.

It fitted comfortably over the bandage with no discomfort and I thought "Ron is a genius". However, when I rotated the focus wheel, it caught in the dust mask, which slipped sideways, exerting additional stress on the elastic that held the dust mask in place. This resulted in the elastic breaking at the back of my head. This in turn caused the loose strand of elastic to whip round and hit me squarely in the right eye.

After a second visit to the casualty department, I now have a very heavy bandage on my nose and am now wearing an eye-patch.


Swop the bins for a monocular and all your problems are solved. Job's a good 'un.

Edit. If you could hire a Nelson fancy dress outfit you would have a nice little sideline opening village fetes. Or do they have them in Spain?

[John Butler]

Swop the bins for a monocular and all your problems are solved. Job's a good 'un.

If you could hire a Nelson fancy dress outfit you would have a nice little sideline opening village fetes. Or do they have them in Spain?


Ron, you are a genius. I went out and bought a hand held monocular and guess what? No shoulder strain from heavy binoculars, so you have solved the original problem that Ronald started this thread about.

PS. I don´t think that wearing a Nelson uniform will go down very well in Spain. They still haven´t forgiven him (or us) for the Battle of Trafalgar in 1805.

[mook]

Some neat ideas....but at what cost to personal wellbeing!!? Not to mention street, sorry, 'field' cred......maybe the answer lies in a Steadicam type device, they're not cheap, but you'll never feel the weight again and can move along through the terrain with binoculars to the eyes and a shake free image! Better not do it along piers, cliffs, canyons, etc.....

Yes, i realise that IS binoculars would stop the shakes, but until they're filled with helium, your neck's still going to take the strain.....

Little Ron's buckle seems like such an elegant solution right now....he he he

Cheers,

Mook.


PS. I am sooo going for a drink tonight!

[Sandra (Taylor)]

If you really did damage yourself, John, I'm sorry and hope you're better soon, but I'm finding this thread so amusing - I'm in danger of waking Bob up with my laughing................ do persevere.

Sandra

[ThoLa]

Hi ThoLa

I have just tried the method you suggested and found a serious flaw in the system.

My 10x42´s weigh much more than my 7x42´s.

Are you sure that you tested this method before giving out this advice?


Hell! Of course I did not test this method. Would I make a fool out of myself by wearing a pair of binoculars on my back?
I would have to leave town between 2 and 3 am. And rightly so.
You did not take me seriously, did you?

I mean, this whole discussion is not serious ... or is it?

Bewildered,
Tom

[jc001]

well I thought it was serious ...I thought i was at the cutting edge of birdwatching fashion as i visited all the local reserves,using the stylish 'back pair' + 'bin yoke' technique's :( I almost perfected the 'back pair' swing swap ...wondered why i kept getting the hides all to myself

[NoSpringChicken]

Well, I assumed it's serious. It all sounds perfectly reasonable to me.;)

Mind you the thought of John getting attended to twice in one day at his local casualty unit is so absurd as to defy belief. Maybe after all .....:h?:

Ron

Edit. I've just realised he was using the Spanish health system so who knows?

[David Smith]

I'm starting to give up on this whole idea. I tried the " pair of binocular/swing it round the neck" and the first time I tried it they smashed against the 5 Kilo weight (should I have taken this off?)
I then tried the monocular without success-mind you I'm blind in my left eye and the only minocular they had in stock was a 'left eye' model.
I will try the dust mask and report back (if they will let me out of this ward for the day)

[NoSpringChicken]

I'm starting to give up on this whole idea. I tried the " pair of binocular/swing it round the neck" and the first time I tried it they smashed against the 5 Kilo weight (should I have taken this off?)
I then tried the monocular without success-mind you I'm blind in my left eye and the only minocular they had in stock was a 'left eye' model.
I will try the dust mask and report back (if they will let me out of this ward for the day)

Hi David. It mght be too late now but apparently it is possible to use a 'left eye' monocular with your right eye by turning it upside down when you use it. Hope this helps.

Ron

[bitterntwisted]

Edit. If you could hire a Nelson fancy dress outfit you would have a nice little sideline opening village fetes. Or do they have them in Spain?

Oh, they've got 'fetes' in Spain alright. Took my placidly frugal donkey to one and they threw it off the church tower and smashed all my optics!

[John Butler]

apparently it is possible to use a 'left eye' monocular with your right eye by turning it upside down when you use it.
Ron

Hi Ron

As it was my right eye that was injured by the wayward elastic from the dust mask, when I bought the monocular I discovered that it was a "right-eyed" model. As I now have to use my left eye because of the eye-patch, I tried turning it upside down for use with my left eye. However, all of the images also came out upside-down. This resulted in me suffering from disorientation and dizziness, culminating in me falling over and spraining my left wrist, which is now suitably strapped up, following another visit to the local casualty department.

Now I can only hold the monocular to my left eye by holding it in my right hand, which is a bit unfortunate as my wrist keeps banging against my injured nose, causing pain and discomfort. It is also hard for me to focus the monocular using just one hand. This, added to the upside-down image is hardly satisfactory. However, I have learnt from my previous experiences and now lie on the floor to use the monocular - I don´t want to fall over again.

One good thing has come out of all this and that is that the local casualty department staff are putting my name forward to the town Mayor with the idea that I be awarded a "life-long" free membership certificate of the department, which will entitle me to go to the front of all queues.

Hmm. Maybe if I keep taking advice from this particular thread a "life-time" certificate may not last very long.



To ThoLa.

Good god man. Do you mean to say that you were being light-hearted about your original suggestion? How dare you do such a thing on such a serious subject.

[NoSpringChicken]

Hi John. It's good to hear you are making real progress now. You've had one or two set backs but as my old mother used to say "At least you've got your health."

As a side note, have you spotted any good birds lately?

Ron

[Sandra (Taylor)]

[QUOTE=John Butler;911750]Hi Ron

As it was my right eye that was injured by the wayward elastic from the dust mask, when I bought the monocular I discovered that it was a "right-eyed" model. As I now have to use my left eye because of the eye-patch, I tried turning it upside down for use with my left eye. However, all of the images also came out upside-down. This resulted in me suffering from disorientation and dizziness, culminating in me falling over and spraining my left wrist, which is now suitably strapped up, following another visit to the local casualty department.

Now I can only hold the monocular to my left eye by holding it in my right hand, which is a bit unfortunate as my wrist keeps banging against my injured nose, causing pain and discomfort. It is also hard for me to focus the monocular using just one hand. This, added to the upside-down image is hardly satisfactory. However, I have learnt from my previous experiences and now lie on the floor to use the monocular - I don´t want to fall over again.

One good thing has come out of all this and that is that the local casualty department staff are putting my name forward to the town Mayor with the idea that I be awarded a "life-long" free membership certificate of the department, which will entitle me to go to the front of all queues.

Hmm. Maybe if I keep taking advice from this particular thread a "life-time" certificate may not last very long.


:'D :'D :'D :clap: 3:-) |:D| |:D|

Sandra

[David Smith]

[QUOTE=John Butler;911750]Hi Ron

This resulted in me suffering from disorientation and dizziness, culminating in me falling over and spraining my left wrist, which is now suitably strapped up, following another visit to the local casualty department.

Now I can only hold the monocular to my left eye by holding it in my right hand, which is a bit unfortunate as my wrist keeps banging against my injured nose, causing pain and discomfort.
Sandra

I forgot to mention that I also have only 1 arm. I work as a window cleaner and have an assistant who rings the cloth out for me. When I use the monacle I get my wife to hold it for me.
(I'll have to go now-the doctors coming!!)

[NoSpringChicken]

[QUOTE=Sandra (Taylor);911769]

I forgot to mention that I also have only 1 arm. I work as a window cleaner and have an assistant who rings the cloth out for me. When I use the monacle I get my wife to hold it for me.
(I'll have to go now-the doctors coming!!)

It's good to hear that someone in your position is not moping about feeling sorry for yourself. The window cleaning could be the start of something good. Regard it as the first rung on the ladder to something bigger and better.

Have you thought about getting rid of your assistant and getting your wife to wring your 'chammy'. Could save you a bob or two.

Hope you feel better soon.

Ron

[ThoLa]

I forgot to mention that I also have only 1 arm. I work as a window cleaner and have an assistant who rings the cloth out for me. When I use the monacle I get my wife to hold it for me.
(I'll have to go now-the doctors coming!!)


Please see the SCOPES section.
Contribute something to the
"Cleaning scope and bins lenses?" thread.

You have been singled out as the leading expert on the subject.
You advice is badly needed.

And scopes have only one barrel .... so one arm will be enough to clean it.

Tom

[David Smith]

I usually carry a brillo pad for my scope & camera lenses. This is a very quick and sure way to get the dust and grit off-they tend to get a bit mucky in the back of my pickup (probably all the cement dust etc). I have recently noticed a slight deteriation in the image quality for some reason.
Glad to share my knowledge with lesser mortals.

[NoSpringChicken]

[QUOTE=David Smith;911827]I usually carry a brillo pad for my scope & camera lenses. This is a very quick and sure way to get the dust and grit off-they tend to get a bit mucky in the back of my pickup (probably all the cement dust etc). I have recently noticed a slight deteriation in the image quality for some reason.QUOTE]

T-Cut is good for restoring the gloss to lenses but I can't think why this isn't approved of by ANY optics manufacturer!

Ron

[John Butler]

Hi John. As a side note, have you spotted any good birds lately? Ron

Hi Ron.

When I experienced my giddy spell and fell down spraining my wrist, I was obviously "out" for a couple of minutes, as when I "came to" and opened my eyes there were three Griffon Vultures and a small flock of Black Kites on a nearby telephone pylon looking down at me, drooling. However, what was more perturbing was that a great big dung beetle had crawled up the inside leg of my shorts. I think that the resulting frenzied dance as I tried to remove it from its warm resting place persuaded the birds that there would be no dinner for them that day.

Seriously though, myself and two clients had excellent prolonged views of a family of Spanish Iperial Eagles (2 adults and 2 very mature young) on their nest last week. We also had close-up views (less than 60 metres) of 2 Ospreys and a number of Pin-tailed Sandgrouse.

[ehrodz]

[QUOTE=David Smith;911795]

It's good to hear that someone in your position is not moping about feeling sorry for yourself. The window cleaning could be the start of something good. Regard it as the first rung on the ladder to something bigger and better.

Have you thought about getting rid of your assistant and getting your wife to wring your 'chammy'. Could save you a bob or two.

Hope you feel better soon.

Ron

I don't know about the suggestion of getting his wife to wring his "chammy" on the job. I think that In addition to his physical problems, he may find himself with some legal problems.o:D

[KorHaan]

Hello again,

Promised to write about my visit to this weekend's Binocular Festival,
just wrote a lengthy report, almost finished, pressed the wrong button and now the whole thing is gone.
I'll try again tomorrow, I'm off to bed for now.

Greetings, Ronald

[KorHaan]

So I was at this weekend's Binocular Festival with Zeiss, Swaro and Leica stands, wearing my FL's on the already infamous yoke, brought my Diascope and tripod too because I wanted to check out the 23x fixed eyepiece.
When I arrived it was already a bit crowded and taking care not to poke anyone's eye out with my yoke ends, I worked my way toward the Zeiss stand. The Zeiss representative, still busy talking to other visitors, glanced at me, turned and said with a laugh : " Now, THAT is one original way to carry your bins! ".
I started explaining the reasons for my odd-looking device and several people listened as well. When I asked the Zeiss rep to sell me a bino harness so I could take it home with me and compare it to the yoke to see which one would be more comfy, he answered : " We don't sell bino harnesses, but won't you have a look at the new wide neck-strap with air-cushioning? ".
I explained politely that any neck-strap won't take the weight from the neck, no matter what cushioning, and the Zeiss man agreed on that, remaining the charming personality he was. He then said : " Well, obviously you have found a way that works for you, but I don't think very many people are willing to follow your example! ".
I thanked him for listening to me, and he then invited me to take a look at the binoculars in the Zeiss stand. The next hour and a half I checked out Zeiss, Swaro, Leica and Bushnell bins, on which I will elaborate in another post because it would be too much off-topic here.

I'm beginning to have some doubts on this yoke carrier, not because I'm embarrassed to wear them in public, but they are starting to get annoying pressing my lower neck vertebrae more noticeable than before. That is mainly caused by the wooden piece itself, it has the wrong shape though the relief in carrying the bins obscured this issue in the beginning.
I'm afraid I will be back on square 1 if cushioning doesn't help; seems I have to come up with something else, or use one of those dreadful bino harnesses, brrr...

In the meantime I'm back on the buckle ( see attached thumbnail elsewhere in this thread ).

Greetings, Ronald

[mook]

You're a brave man Ronald!

The concept is obviously something that works (easing the load), but just not comfortably enough at the moment. It's a question now of ergonomics - the yoke method is good, the yoke's design is not - naturally, because you're using an off-the-shelf (or should that be off-the-rail?) clothes hanger!

Now you'll have to work through some prototypes that address the comfort issues....and maybe also the 'what the hell is he wearing?' issue too!!

Set Little Ron to work!!

Cheers,

Mook.

PS. I am assuming you have removed the hook from the hanger - you wouldn't want to be hoisted by your own petard!

[David Smith]

I awoke yesterday and decided to go bird watching. I also decided to try a different yoke (still not happy withyour idea-sorry if that sounds rude but there are draw-backs). I hit on the idea of using the handle bars off my racing bike-proper shape, can hang a pair of bins off each end and a counterweight at the back! Anyway I was in a bit of a rush and didn't have time to diconnect the handle bars from the bike so I put the lot on. At first I thought "this must look rediculous". However I quickly ralised that there were lots of other places to hang things such as the pedals, the seat etc. I had a great day out although it was quite heavy to carry all day. When I got back my wife asked why I had carried it-why didn't you just ride it she asked. Stupid woman' knows nothing !!

[ThoLa]

I awoke yesterday and decided to go bird watching. I also decided to try a different yoke (still not happy withyour idea-sorry if that sounds rude but there are draw-backs). I hit on the idea of using the handle bars off my racing bike-proper shape, can hang a pair of bins off each end and a counterweight at the back! Anyway I was in a bit of a rush and didn't have time to diconnect the handle bars from the bike so I put the lot on. At first I thought "this must look rediculous". However I quickly ralised that there were lots of other places to hang things such as the pedals, the seat etc. I had a great day out although it was quite heavy to carry all day. When I got back my wife asked why I had carried it-why didn't you just ride it she asked. Stupid woman' knows nothing !!

Try a motor-bike next time.
The extra weight will give an extra push,
particularly when walking downhill.

Tomgineer*

*I haven't tested this method either.

[KorHaan]

You're a brave man Ronald!

The concept is obviously something that works (easing the load), but just not comfortably enough at the moment. It's a question now of ergonomics - the yoke method is good, the yoke's design is not - naturally, because you're using an off-the-shelf (or should that be off-the-rail?) clothes hanger!

Now you'll have to work through some prototypes that address the comfort issues....and maybe also the 'what the hell is he wearing?' issue too!!

Set Little Ron to work!!

Cheers,

Mook.

PS. I am assuming you have removed the hook from the hanger - you wouldn't want to be hoisted by your own petard!

Hi Mook,

The concept is sound. Prototypes that are more comfortable AND look cool will be the next step. Need a brilliant idea, I'm going to the hardware store this week and see what they have in stock, haha!

I would have wished the Zeiss rep immediately had phoned to Germany to put the Zeiss engineers to work on a nice ergonomic leather yoke, pity him for not picking up the idea of the century, so it's all up to me again.
Maybe I could get Swarovski interested, a nice leather yoke would go great with a lederhosen!

Ofcourse I removed the hook, I may be crazy but I'm not daft.

Greetings, Ronald

[bitterntwisted]

I would have wished the Zeiss rep immediately had phoned to Germany to put the Zeiss engineers to work on a nice ergonomic leather yoke

They'll have egg on their faces when the yoke breaks through as it surely will, Ronald.

Sorry!

[KorHaan]

I awoke yesterday and decided to go bird watching. I also decided to try a different yoke (still not happy withyour idea-sorry if that sounds rude but there are draw-backs). I hit on the idea of using the handle bars off my racing bike-proper shape, can hang a pair of bins off each end and a counterweight at the back! Anyway I was in a bit of a rush and didn't have time to diconnect the handle bars from the bike so I put the lot on. At first I thought "this must look rediculous". However I quickly ralised that there were lots of other places to hang things such as the pedals, the seat etc. I had a great day out although it was quite heavy to carry all day. When I got back my wife asked why I had carried it-why didn't you just ride it she asked. Stupid woman' knows nothing !!

David,

I'm sorry to say this, but your wife is right. You should know by know that a proper yoke does not require a counterweight; anyway next time you decide to go out birding take a children's bike. That is much less heavy on your back and you won't look too ridiculous!

The pedals and the seat are not ergonomically designed to hang things from,
stuff tends to bungle so I suggest you use cycle-bags.
Enjoy your trips!

Greetings, Ronald

[KorHaan]

They'll have egg on their faces when the yoke breaks through as it surely will, Ronald.

Sorry!

LOL

I'll brood till I drop!

Greetings, Ronald

[David Smith]

David,

I'm sorry to say this, but your wife is right. You should know by know that a proper yoke does not require a counterweight; anyway next time you decide to go out birding take a children's bike. That is much less heavy on your back and you won't look too ridiculous!

The pedals and the seat are not ergonomically designed to hang things from,
stuff tends to bungle so I suggest you use cycle-bags.
Enjoy your trips!

Greetings, Ronald

This may work in Holland (where you are based) but here we have things called hills.
Anyway I tried your idea and it was so much more difficult!! My wife says I should have taken my bike off and just used the childrens but again 'what does she know about such technical things?'
When I get out of this police cell I will try something different-aren't people easily offended-just because I knocked his 3 year old child off the bike and stole it !!

[Tero]

But back to the original problem, the weight. Anything over 700g feels heavy to me. This makes them rugged and last a long time, but I think there is no reason to not develop lighter materials. The composites are plenty strong for normal use. They may not stand temperature extremes, though.

I have yet to find a 10x32 I like that is also light, so I use 10x40 Zeiss and a lighter 10x42 Monarch. My nearly 800g porros get little use.

[ThoLa]

This may work in Holland (where you are based) but here we have things called hills.
Anyway I tried your idea and it was so much more difficult!! My wife says I should have taken my bike off and just used the childrens but again 'what does she know about such technical things?'
When I get out of this police cell I will try something different-aren't people easily offended-just because I knocked his 3 year old child off the bike and stole it !!

So, while motorcycle chains worn as counter-weights on the back are seemingly falling out of favour, why not revert to some simple, time-proven, montgolfierian technology?
How about a red balloon filled with just enough Helium to provide some up-lift? It can be tied to the central hinge region of the binoculars or even to the neck part of the strap, so it will be out of sight.
It even serves as a signal for birders who got lost in unknown, swampy habitats. Locate the ballon, hope the owner is still attached to the other end.

A colour code could be decided by which bird-watchers could be assigned and grouped:
a green(horn) balloon for newbies.
a blue one for the cool boys who leave their dark sunglasses on while they peep through their ultra-bright new 7x42 FL
a pink one for the ladybird(er)s
a shocking-red one for the leader of the pack, indicating his superior standing and wisdom within his flock of disciples.

An idea worth pondering .... maybe patenting.
Tom

[KorHaan]

This may work in Holland (where you are based) but here we have things called hills.
Anyway I tried your idea and it was so much more difficult!! My wife says I should have taken my bike off and just used the childrens but again 'what does she know about such technical things?'
When I get out of this police cell I will try something different-aren't people easily offended-just because I knocked his 3 year old child off the bike and stole it !!

That's a minor offence in Holland, we just get a fine here and are allowed to keep the child's bike; I'm sorry you have to do time but look on the bright side: you can start a jail list ( birds seen from within your cell ), that is if you have a window.

Greetings, Ronald

[KorHaan]

So, while motorcycle chains worn as counter-weights on the back are seemingly falling out of favour, why not revert to some simple, time-proven, montgolfierian technology?
How about a red balloon filled with just enough Helium to provide some up-lift? It can be tied to the central hinge region of the binoculars or even to the neck part of the strap, so it will be out of sight.
It even serves as a signal for birders who got lost in unknown, swampy habitats. Locate the ballon, hope the owner is still attached to the other end.

A colour code could be decided by which bird-watchers could be assigned and grouped:
a green(horn) balloon for newbies.
a blue one for the cool boys who leave their dark sunglasses on while they peep through their ultra-bright new 7x42 FL
a pink one for the ladybird(er)s
a shocking-red one for the leader of the pack, indicating his superior standing and wisdom within his flock of disciples.

An idea worth pondering .... maybe patenting.
Tom

Tom,

That's a good idea! Nothing better to beat gravity than helium.

It immediately occurred to me we can skip the balloon stage and fill the bins themselves with helium. In order to get sufficient uplift the engineers will have to invent huge bins, of some composite material, to get enough helium compressed into them. This way you carry the bins floating in front of your eyes, in perfect balance, and you can hold them still easily so magnifications can rise to figures like 60x. With objectives of 300mm this would give an exit pupil of 5, so even after sunset they will provide great views!

Imagine helium-filled telescopes up to 300x mag! And no tripod required.

With nice colours or even with commercial slogans printed on them, some kind of sponsorship to make them affordable for even the poorest of people;
or lease-binoculars for that matter. Anything is possible!

Greetings, Ronald

[bitterntwisted]

I think I've cracked it people! Obviate the need for binoculars and the associated neck/shoulder/arm/leg/back/wallet pain altogether by simply standing eight times closer to the bird you wish to view!

Graham

[KorHaan]

I think I've cracked it people! Obviate the need for binoculars and the associated neck/shoulder/arm/leg/back/wallet pain altogether by simply standing eight times closer to the bird you wish to view!

Graham

Hm... can't beat that.

But since we're not living in the Stone Age when you could simply persuade birds to comply with your ornithological curiosity by knocking them out of the sky with pebbles, some advanced technique is needed to get a decent close-up view.

Very accurate spy satellites plus superior GPS could do the trick; a small laptop or even a palmtop and the bird half a mile away pops up on your screen.

Or bird ringers could abandon the ringing and put tiny transmitters to the birds' legs, which would influence bird brain activity and release aphrodisiac hormones so the bird would fall in love with your remote control and would come flying toward you.

It seems to me we're a long way from these developments yet, so I'll stick to my yoky bins for the time being. Besides, I wouldn't go out without bins, I'd feel.... I'd feel.... naked!!!

Greetings, Ronald

[ThoLa]

Tom,

That's a good idea! Nothing better to beat gravity than helium.

It immediately occurred to me we can skip the balloon stage and fill the bins themselves with helium. In order to get sufficient uplift the engineers will have to invent huge bins, of some composite material, to get enough helium compressed into them. This way you carry the bins floating in front of your eyes, in perfect balance, and you can hold them still easily so magnifications can rise to figures like 60x. With objectives of 300mm this would give an exit pupil of 5, so even after sunset they will provide great views!

Imagine helium-filled telescopes up to 300x mag! And no tripod required.

With nice colours or even with commercial slogans printed on them, some kind of sponsorship to make them affordable for even the poorest of people;
or lease-binoculars for that matter. Anything is possible!

Greetings, Ronald

Ronald,
a nice idea.
But too expensive!
Did you know that it was THIS idea of a floating pair of very big binoculars that ruined Minolta and drove them off the optics market?!

See here for proof: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fb/Yokoso%21_Japan.jpg

[KorHaan]

Ronald,
a nice idea.
But too expensive!
Did you know that it was THIS idea of a floating pair of very big binoculars that ruined Minolta and drove them off the optics market?!

See here for proof: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fb/Yokoso%21_Japan.jpg

WOW! Great!

I'll do a Little Ron's Guide to Floating Binoculars, just give me some time.

Greetings, Ronald

[ThoLa]

I'll do a Little Ron's Guide to Floating Binoculars, just give me some time.
Greetings, Ronald


But don't get carried away while working on it ....


Tom

[MacGee]

Since my RSPB HG 7x42s (840g) are too heavy, I bore that in mind when buying my next bins—and bought Minolta Activa 10x50s, weighing in at 950g. I got them for using at hides, but they turned out to be easier to wear than the HGs. I think there are two reasons for this.

One. I'm using a shaped Niggeloh strap with them, which puts the stress along the back at the base of the neck instead of on the neck itself as happens with non-shaped straps.

Two. The way the big wide porros lie against my chest spreads the weight a bit better. The HGs, especially with my narrow IPD (60mm), lie against my chest with the same general effect as having an iron bar hanging round my neck.

Despite this, I still feel the simplest, most elegant solution is just to use lighter binoculars.

Michael.

[KorHaan]

WOW! Great!

I'll do a Little Ron's Guide to Floating Binoculars, just give me some time.

Greetings, Ronald

Just for fun...

[KorHaan]

Just for fun...

Lost at sea....

[NoSpringChicken]

Excellent drawings, Ronald. I'm convinced. Where do I buy a pair?

Ron

[KorHaan]

And another...

[KorHaan]

No more arguing....

[KorHaan]

Farmers still annoyed....

[KorHaan]

Try before you buy....

[NoSpringChicken]

Absolutely brilliant, Ronald. Superb drawings. Thanks for posting them.:clap:

Ron

[KorHaan]

Excellent drawings, Ronald. I'm convinced. Where do I buy a pair?

Ron

I'm negotiating with NASA. Rumour has it they wish to upgrade their Hubble Space telescope.