global warming good for birds!!

[Tyke]

Well this is very interesting:-

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/article1968880.ece

Colin

[ColinD]

Well this is very interesting:-

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/article1968880.ece

Colin

Good, so that's Global warming sorted. No more worries there.

[Ilya Maclean]

Read the relevant section of the IPCC report on climate change and krill fisheries before placing too much credence on the Times article:

http://www.grida.no/climate/ipcc/regional/053.htm

[Steve G]

Whilst such findings shouldn't in any way halt our attempts to limit greenhouse gases it is very clear that we still have a lot to learn about global climate, potential climate change buffers & their effects on the natural world.

[ColinD]

Whilst such findings shouldn't in any way halt our attempts to limit greenhouse gases it is very clear that we still have a lot to learn about global climate, potential climate change buffers & their effects on the natural world.

But surely that's the main concern about Global Warming. Things are happening so fast, too fast for most species to adapt, and we just don't know what the future holds.

[Mabel]

I normally don't like getting involved with the whole climate debate, but isn't it simply a matter of who adapts best? I mean, global warming may be good for some birds, such as the Little Egret, which is expanding it's range, perhaps helped by warmer climate.
But it may be bad for others, for example the Little Tern, whose nest sites may be in danger of flooding.

[Mabel]

But surely that's the main concern about Global Warming. Things are happening so fast, too fast for most species to adapt, and we just don't know what the future holds.

I meant to highlight this in my quote, but in my opinion, that is indeed the main concern.

[ColinD]

Here are a few possible effects of Global Warming on the UK:

1) We get Mediterranean type summers, lots of sunshine and good tans.

2) Britain gets warmer, but only thanks to lots more cloud cover and rain in both summer and winter. We get less cold winters but also see less sunshine in summer. This has a bad effect on our insect populations, reducing insect eating birds.

3) The arctic ice cap melts, sea levels rise flooding our pathetic (and impossible) attempts at sea defences. Lots of the UK is flooded. More worryingly, the melting ice cap diverts the Gulf stream, and Britain gets the same winters as Hudson Bay and Moscow, and is generally much colder than it is now.

I'm sure there are also lots of other possibilities. Each one has a dramatically different effect on our birdlife. Who can say which will happen? Who can say which species will benefit and which will lose? In my opinion, we all lose.

[Tyke]

Whilst such findings shouldn't in any way halt our attempts to limit greenhouse gases it is very clear that we still have a lot to learn about global climate, potential climate change buffers & their effects on the natural world.

Yes I very much agree with you.
Colin

[Tim Allwood]

Whilst such findings shouldn't in any way halt our attempts to limit greenhouse gases it is very clear that we still have a lot to learn about global climate, potential climate change buffers & their effects on the natural world.

Yes Steve

and we are learing it daily. It should get a little easier now that we have stopped arguing about whether it is actually happening though. Pity it took so long. Even on a birding forum. Onwards and upwards though...

A friend of mine is investigating the effects of climate change on tropical birds... don't expect it too be much of a good thing. Birds on mountains don't have much room to move to when the climate changes. Coupled with inability to extract / or lack of, suitable food resources in their 'new' and forced habitat (if it's even possible for them to eek out an existence), places like Peru, Ecuador, Colombia etc where there is such an altitude / habitat gradient might be in for big trouble.

Even here many birds are nesting much earlier on average already. This can result in them being out of sync with their insect food which may emerge much later etc...

[Steve G]

There is a lot of research ongoing -including observational studies such as that quoted in The Times.
Some research (like this) will undoubtedly yield findings which SEEM to contradict the (recently acquired!!!) classical wisdoms/prophesies of climate change; however just because it doesn't fit current theory/prediction doesn't make the data any less valid.

My point is that the potential threats man-made climate change poses to the Natural World could be catastrophic -as much through the rate of change as the amount of change; however our current climate models are too crude to make accurate predictions as there are undoubtedly 'natural' buffers which may slow the rate of change (the converse also applies -eg permafrost release of methane).

Surely all aspects need to be studied & findings which seem to buck the predicted trends especially so as these may offer windows of opportunity which allow us to manipulate & enhance natural buffers which might palliate the final outcome.

Science is science. In the scientific process surely validated evidence should define the theory & not the converse. Currently researchers who come up with data which doesn't easily fit the climate change models are attracting inappropriate criticism. There are no heretics in science there's just good research & bad research .......... so lets not shoot the messenger!!

[Jos Stratford]

A friend of mine is investigating the effects of climate change on tropical birds... don't expect it too be much of a good thing. Coupled with inability to extract / or lack of, suitable food resources in their 'new' and forced habitat, places like Peru, Ecuador, Colombia etc where there is such an altitude / habitat gradient might be in for big trouble.


Columbia is planning a doubling of area under biofuels in the next five years (I think it was that timeframe), with expected further increases in the future. Not only has this led to forest destruction already, but it is reportedly the case that subsistence farmers are routinely being pushed off their land, killed in some cases if they chose to object. Much the same in Indonesia and Malaysia.

I kind'a think that, were I to be a forest bird or bug, I'd like to take risks of a warmer environment over a nice barren patch of clearfell or monoculture. Were I to be a subsistence farmer, I think I'd prefer a bit more sun to a bullet in the back of my head.

[Tim Allwood]

I kind'a think that, were I to be a forest bird or bug, I'd like to take risks of a warmer environment over a nice barren patch of clearfell or monoculture. Were I to be a subsistence farmer, I think I'd prefer a bit more sun to a bullet in the back of my head.

me too of course... everyone wants to improve their life

those Washington bullets get everywhere

Tim

[Jos Stratford]

those Washington bullets get everywhere

Tim

Well agreed on one thing ;)

PS Tim, nice and warm out here, heaps and heaps of darn good dragonflies. Almost as good weather as when we sunbathed on mounds waiting for Cranes to arrive en masse

[Tyke]

Science is science. In the scientific process surely validated evidence should define the theory & not the converse.

Absolutely!
I,m sure Nature has a whole lot more surprises for us yet.
Colin

[Karl J]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/article1968880.ece



I reckon the Clarksons of this world and the 'Up Yours, I'll Fly Where I Like' brigade probably cant believe their luck that a national newspaper has come up with that

[Tyke]

I reckon the Clarksons of this world and the 'Up Yours, I'll Fly Where I Like' brigade probably cant believe their luck that a national newspaper has come up with that

If The Times doesn't meet your rigorous criteria for factual information-perhaps Science might meet with your approval?;-

http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/abstract/1142834v1

Can't see Clarkson reading this myself-but anyone who craves facts about global warming effects (good as well as bad ) rather than politically correct models & forecasts should find it interesting:-

http://www.mbari.org/news/news_releases/2007/icebergs.html

Colin