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Help - air bubbles in eyepiece lens??? (1 Viewer)

scampo

Steve Campsall
I wonder if any of you can help. Last week, I bought an Opticron ES80 from the Infocus shop at Rutland Water. To my surprise at the time, I had to go through three scopes until I found one without a mark on the inside of its objective lens.

However, today at Rutland Water I noticed what seem to be tiny air bubbles within the lenses of the zoom eyepiece as I was birdwatching. These were especially evident when a blank sky was being looked at and look like tiny circular brighter marks with a dark perimeter within the view of the lens. There are about five altogether and they are only evident at 20x, disappearing immediately on zooming from this magnification.

As I was there, I took the scope back to Infocus but the salesman there couldn't see them yet was willing to swap the scope. But he went on to say very convincingly that all lenses have such things as it was impossible to produce a dust free perfect lens. I looked through two further Opticron scopes without eyepieces and they certainly did have a mark or two which looked like it was within the coating on the rear of the front element. Anyway, as is the way of these things, the salesman convinced me I was being over particular. But back at home the "bubbles" are indeed very clear if a lamp is looked at to give a bright plain yellow view through the scope (i.e. out of focus).

I checked my son's Swarovski and a friend's new Nikon and they are 100% clear.

Can anyone advise me on this - for instance, is the salesman generally right (he also said he had worked for Zeiss and that was the case with their lenses)? Obviously for all intents and purposes the air bubbles could be said not to matter as they are only tiny (less than 0.5mm, maybe) and can only be seen at 20x. But I am a perfectionist and feel a little let down and disappointed. Certainly in many years of photography I have never such a thing in a quality camera lens.

In every other way the Opticron is a fine scope.
 
I have an ES80 and have never had such a problem. I have never seen this on other scopes I've used either.

Personally I would say that if you are going to part with a good deal of money for something you are quite right to expect it to be in perfect condition. If I were you I'd go back to the shop and get them to exchange it for one that you are completely happy with. I woudl also recommend contacting another retailer to see what they think of this problem - you may find that they something very different.

I will PM you with other comments (that I shouldn't post on the forum).
 
Thanks Peter. What is surprising is that I went through three bodies before getting this one and two more today had a tiny mark on the inside of their objective lens (of course these might have been the same as I looked at last week). All the marks are tiny however - but there were none on the Nikon or Swarovski.

I was wondering if I was expecting too much and that you "get what you pay for"? As I say, in every other way this is a super scope and the bubbles only show at 20x against a plain colour such as the sky.
 
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Hi Scampo.

I to have the ES80 scope & so far haven`t encountered any problems like you`ve mentioned.The only time I`ve heard about air bubbles in scopes is when someone has been cleaning the objective lens with a can of compressed air at an angle & the air has got inside the scope & shown as a bubble,the worst case scenario is a shattered lens.Hope this helps.
Regards Steve.
 
I think it was fluke that I noticed them as they only show at the extreme 20x end which means they are clear at an eyepiece position that is easy to replicate.

I shall return to Infocus to see what they say a second time around.
 
You are probably looking at it with too critical an eye. I am the same as you. I would never buy a brand new car because I would be devastated at the first car-park dent or scratch.

If you use it for a couple of weeks you'll probably soon forget about the air bubbles.

Steve
 
I've never had such trouble with my ES80 either. My guess, as you had to try a few in the shop, is that they may have a faulty batch in.

If you don't get the problem looking through any other make of scope it rules out my other guess - that it could be 'floaters' in your eyes. Looking at a bright background, I can sometimes see little shapes moving around.
 
I did think about floaters as I do have those and, interestigly, so did the salesman at Infocus. I don't know what to do really - as Steve says above, I might be being too picky, but in my heart I don't think a £550-00 piece of kit should show any air bubbles, however tiny.

Thanks for your help and comments all of you - it's always helpful to hear other views. This is a great site!
 
Could be just the quality of the glass that's making your floaters show up more in the ES80 than the other scopes.

I will have a check next time I look though mine, but I can't say they've been too evident or I would have noticed them by now - I've had the scope about a year.
 
Hi Diane

An interesting idea but "floaters" move all the time as they fall through the eye, usually downwards (I think they are tiny bits of dead tissue in the eye's inner fluids). These air bubbles are stationary until the scope or eyepice is twisted. I am certain you would have seen them in your own scope if they were there although they are only visible at one focal length in mine - 20x.

I think it is a genuine fault of some kind - maybe the zoom twists back a mite to far and exposes the bubbles when it shouldn't (i.e. bubbles are a normal thing in glass but are usually invisible) or perhaps poor quality control in this batch of scopes. Certainly, I have not seen this on any other scope.

What threw me completely was that the salesman at Infocus said it was entirely normal and inescapable. He is a helpful, affable and honest sort of fella and was entirely willing to swap the scope.
 
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Hi - yes and Nick could see the bubbles too. So we took it back today and a different salesman looked through and saw them straight away - a bit like the Plough constellation in the sky at night. He said he thought they had a bad batch of scopes.

The upshot was expensive for me - they had no perfect Opticrons in stock so I eventually decided on a Nikon Fieldscope. Anyway had a great afternoon with it at Rutland Water and Eyebrook Reservoir, seeing a very handsome male smew, a pair of long-tailed ducks, ten goosanders both male and female and about a thousand golden plovers. Can't complain.
 
scampo said:
Hi - yes and Nick could see the bubbles too. So we took it back today and a different salesman looked through and saw them straight away - a bit like the Plough constellation in the sky at night. He said he thought they had a bad batch of scopes.

The upshot was expensive for me - they had no perfect Opticrons in stock so I eventually decided on a Nikon Fieldscope. Anyway had a great afternoon with it at Rutland Water and Eyebrook Reservoir, seeing a very handsome male smew, a pair of long-tailed ducks, ten goosanders both male and female and about a thousand golden plovers. Can't complain.

It happens, my scope focused itself on a very nice Ferruginous Duck
 
An autofocus scope - whatever next? I've never seen a ferruginous duck, Pete - one of those things as a kid I used to read about in my precious Observer Book of Birds and think I'd never see but hoped one day I might!
 
Hello Peter

I feel a bit cross with Opticron really (they're a family business apparently) as the ES80 is clearly very fine value when put against Nikon and other makes but there we are. Anyway, I enjoyed using it this morning - with a quite cutting cold wind but a very sunny morning at Rutland we eventually saw a lovely great northern diver tackling what looked like a large eel for its breakfast.
 
Hi Steve,
I don't have experience on Opticrons but I can confirm identical symptoms with a few Kowas, especially with their older zoom eyepieces. The round spots are indeed small air bubbles present in *some* batches of optical glass used for making lenses - and appearing only at certain phase of magnification or focus. However, even a small black spot (or several...) appearing against the sky can be extremely confusing when you eg. try to find raptors from the eternity. You just can't forget the spots and it gets more and more irritating. I think you will feel safe with Nikon.

Ilkka
 
That was very interesting Ilkka. You clearly have a lot of experience of optics. Thanks for your help. Odd that the "expert" in the shop was so dismissive but thanks to his colleague all was sorted out.

Yes, the Nikon seems spot on in every way.

It is many years since I was in Finland - what a fine country. I have been to Helsinki and Oulu (so c-o-l-d there, and I had a winter sauna but my Finnish colleagues would not let me go into the snow afterwards, thinking an Englishman was not up to it. I think they were right).

I shall never forget a story one Finnish business friend told me while I was in the sauna. I asked him what kind of things Finns do in the oh-so-cold winters. He replied, "Well... in the summer we fish and make love."

I said okay but the winter?

"We don't fish!".
 
scampo said:
is the salesman generally right (he also said he had worked for Zeiss and that was the case with their lenses)?

The answer to the above is NO, on all accounts.
Bubbles should not happen, but it might be found if;
The manufacturer used a glass type which is not available without very small bubbles or
The manufacturer has chosen a higher tolerance for bubbles because of the cheaper price.
 
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