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Zen ED1 or ED2 10x43 help on hunting bino (1 Viewer)

Tedster

Well-known member
Hello
this is my first post and i have been searching the net for a week or so and i almost bought a pair of pentax,and after reading all the things about the Zens
i am glad i didn't.i have had a pair of stokes broadwings and a pair of nikon monarchs and after reading here about these my concern is what most have been talking about the grey ghost effect these seem to have,i do not know hardly anything about bino's compared to most,my concern is which of these would be better for glassing whitails the 10x43 ed1's or the ed2's or would the 8x43 be better

Ted
 
Ted,
Are you going to be glassing your Whitetails in brushy country or in open country? If the former, you will need a 7 x 42 or an 8 x 42 for their depth of field view. If the latter, a 10 x 42 should work out fine. The 8 x 42 is a good all round choice if you want to settle on one binocular. Your best bet is to try several brands out if you have the opportunity and decide from there. But that means trying them out under conditions of use, not merely testing them in the store. Some dealers like Eagle Optics have a generous 30 day return policy and you can try out the binocular and then decide to buy it. www.eagleoptics.com. Of course there are certain restrictions but they are reasonable.
Bob
 
ZEN USERS WHICH ONE BETTER ED1 or ED2

i am really interested in the ZEN ED's after reading all the talk on them,my boss has a pair of leica's in the 10x42 and them are the best i have looked thru,and after reading the post on this forum i would like to try these i was just wondering which would be the best the ED1 or ED2 some of the post are a little mixed and confusing
 
Ted,

First off, welcome to BF.

The glare issue is a 7x36 phenomena, and Zen Ray has fixed that. Even without the fix it did not bother the great majority of users. The issue was never raised to any great extent by users of the 43mm ZEN ED. But keep in mind that no single binocular will please everybody.

Now as to the ED 1 vs ED2 question you posed. The ED 2 does have a little better brightness, and contrast. The difference is there, but you really need the two side by side to see what difference there is.

There are two practical field considerations. The first is that most apparent difference between the two is the ED 1 has a much slower wheel with about 2 1/2 turns of the wheel. The tension required to move the focus wheel is far less on the ED 1. The ED 2 needs about 1 1/2 turns, and the wheel tension is noticeably stiffer. It will not move from where you had it by accident, in my experience, you will have to apply a conscious effort to get it to move. Having said that, I had no problems in this regard with the ED 1.

The second practical difference is the ED 2 has both water and oil repellent coatings on the lenses. They do work in wet weather and the lenses seem a bit easier to clean in the ED 2.

Which one to get really is a matter of personal choice as regard to the type of hunting you do. I will without hesitation recommend the 7x36 to you, especailly in the closer cover assoicated with white tail deer. Any new 7x36 you will buy now will have the glare issues fixed. I have had all of the ZEN ED 1 and 2. What I kept are the 7x36 and 10x43 ED 2's.

The 7x36 will be pretty easy to hold steady and is noticeably smaller than the 43mm size, but its design prevents it from being viewed as a compact glass. I can see no difference in the amount of detail I can see at any distance between the 7x and 8x. The 8x image will look a bit bigger at the limits of the usefulness on 7-8x magnification, but the detail is to me anyway, indistinguishable. The 10x seems to me to be a more pronounced magnification difference, hence my 7x and 10x choice. The things that really motivated my 7x decision over the 8x is the 7x has an outstanding wide field of view, with a superb depth of focus. Further the precision of the focus within the depth of the field is superb. It is a binocular you will use the focus very little. You will find the optics of the ZEN ED will come far closer to the Leica than many will care to believe they do.

I am a high desert sage and juniper mule deer hunter and even for the wide open spaces, I would have no problem with the 7x as the only glass.
 
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I have 8x43 ED and 7x36 ED2 so my observation is not exactly apple to apple. The 7x36 does show slightly cooler color, with blue color popping up more than the 8x43. That's the benefit of having a dielectirc coating. Twilight brightness wise, I cannot make much difference between these two: it is probably convoluted with different glass size and different coating. I do like the handling of ED2 better, especially with its faster focus.
 
Ted,

First off, welcome to BF.

The glare issue is a 7x36 phenomena, and Zen Ray has fixed that. Even without the fix it did not bother the great majority of users. The issue was never raised to any great extent by users of the 43mm ZEN ED. But keep in mind that no single binocular will please everybody.

Now as to the ED 1 vs ED2 question you posed. The ED 2 does have a little better brightness, and contrast. The difference is there, but you really need the two side by side to see what difference there is.

There are two practical field considerations. The first is that most apparent difference between the two is the ED 1 has a much slower wheel with about 2 1/2 turns of the wheel. The tension required to move the focus wheel is far less on the ED 1. The ED 2 needs about 1 1/2 turns, and the wheel tension is noticeably stiffer. It will not move from where you had it by accident, in my experience, you will have to apply a conscious effort to get it to move. Having said that, I had no problems in this regard with the ED 1.

The second practical difference is the ED 2 has both water and oil repellent coatings on the lenses. They do work in wet weather and the lenses seem a bit easier to clean in the ED 2.

Which one to get really is a matter of personal choice as regard to the type of hunting you do. I will without hesitation recommend the 7x36 to you, especailly in the closer cover assoicated with white tail deer. Any new 7x36 you will buy now will have the glare issues fixed. I have had all of the ZEN ED 1 and 2. What I kept are the 7x36 and 10x43 ED 2's.

The 7x36 will be pretty easy to hold steady and is noticeably smaller than the 43mm size, but its design prevents it from being viewed as a compact glass. I can see no difference in the amount of detail I can see at any distance between the 7x and 8x. The 8x image will look a bit bigger at the limits of the usefulness on 7-8x magnification, but the detail is to me anyway, indistinguishable. The 10x seems to me to be a more pronounced magnification difference, hence my 7x and 10x choice. The things that really motivated my 7x decision over the 8x is the 7x has an outstanding wide field of view, with a superb depth of focus. Further the precision of the focus within the depth of the field is superb. It is a binocular you will use the focus very little. You will find the optics of the ZEN ED will come far closer to the Leica than many will care to believe they do.

I am a high desert sage and juniper mule deer hunter and even for the wide open spaces, I would have no problem with the 7x as the only glass.

i will tell you what i sure like this forum of the details that some give,one thing i don't really understand and this bino talk is stuff i really do not understand kwite yet is part of your statement the 10x seems to me to be a more pronounced magnification difference are you saying you would prefer the 7x over the 10x for hunting,the only reason i would want the 10x
would be for the distance which my eyes are not the greatest,i am sure glad i came to this site this is the best forum i have ever seen for depthness of information and help,i came close to buying the Minox HG i am glad i didn't after reading different reviews,i think my mind is already made up i will by the ZENS ED2 i just need to figure out what magnification to go with,personaly i think the 7x would be great for tree stand hunt and the 10x for fields and scouting
Thanks for the help and the welcome
Ted
 
I have the 7,8, & 10X ED2's, and the 7X gets the most use, 8X second, and 10X third. I have a fairly densely wooded lot behind my house, and the 7X couldn't be more perfect for that environment, probably similar to any area in which you might be using a tree stand. I rarely use the 10X without a monopod or tripod; they're just too fussy to hold still, and just about useless for following birds in flight, unless they're 100 yards or more away. Held steady, they're wonderful.
 
I have the 7,8, & 10X ED2's, and the 7X gets the most use, 8X second, and 10X third. I have a fairly densely wooded lot behind my house, and the 7X couldn't be more perfect for that environment, probably similar to any area in which you might be using a tree stand. I rarely use the 10X without a monopod or tripod; they're just too fussy to hold still, and just about useless for following birds in flight, unless they're 100 yards or more away. Held steady, they're wonderful.

my eyes are realy not the greatest,i know most people are saying the 7x 1st.
8x 2nd then the 10x i have had two different pairr of 10x and they were kind of ok for holding still,i will be using these 85% of the time not on my stand
but scouting the edges of the fields and grass,you think the 8x would be a better mix or do you think the 10x would be ok,remember a deer is way bigger than a bird that is why i brought it back up,i sure wish someone had the ZENS around here to try but i dont think thats gonna happen,if the 10x are that fussy like you say maybe i should get the 8x
 
my eyes are realy not the greatest,i know most people are saying the 7x 1st.
8x 2nd then the 10x i have had two different pairr of 10x and they were kind of ok for holding still,i will be using these 85% of the time not on my stand
but scouting the edges of the fields and grass,you think the 8x would be a better mix or do you think the 10x would be ok,remember a deer is way bigger than a bird that is why i brought it back up,i sure wish someone had the ZENS around here to try but i dont think thats gonna happen,if the 10x are that fussy like you say maybe i should get the 8x

If you're getting just one pair, I'd go with the 8X, which is usually a safe suggestion for almost anyone buying binoculars. Not quite the field of view of the 7X, but it's still pretty spectacular. You don't mention the brand of 10X that you have, but I'm guessing that after using the new Zens of whatever power, your present 10X will be abandoned permanently, so, in effect, you're going to own just one pair of binoculars. That suggests 8X as the universal best compromise for a one-bin user.

As I mentioned in another post, when I got my ED2's, a hunter friend went in with me and got some 8X42 Zen Summits, after amassing a collection of 10 and 12X of other brands (usually mid-level Steiners). For some reason hunters seem to think that they need more magnification than birders, which doesn't make sense to me. You make a good point that a deer is way bigger than a bird. Anyway, he's pleased as can be with 8X for all of his various uses, and kicks himself that he suffered fussing for so long with "high power" bins. He's given all the Steiners etc. away to relatives and friends that he doesn't really like too much.
 
thanks
after i wrote that post i did more searching on here and other sites,it funny how some forums you go on give you info on what they have seen on paper or reports,and some were pretty negative,then you listen to all the possitive things that users have said and after all my searching on here and other things i have read also i am gonna buy the ED2 in the 8x i think you are right most guys look at bino's like a muscle car from the 70's bigger is better,after talking and reading post on here and other places i have come to learn i am not gonna be glassing fields that are 2miles,the places i will be using them are mixed to with woods,i actualy started thinking about it why would i want the 10x i never put my zeiss scope on 10x i leave it on 3.5 when i am in the woods,so i am glad i found this forum now i have to save up to get themmhopefully they don't go up.
when i do get ready for the purchase i will get the ED2x8 its hard to believe they can make the that good opticaly for that price,there must be one heck of a right up on the top three's

Thanks Ted
 
Ted,

What I was getting at with the "...more magnification difference.." comment you references is may better explained by saying I feel that combinations of two or more binoculars offer better ultimate options than a single binocular. In this case,when the ED 1 came out, I really figured that here was the ideal affordable, excellent optically great binocular when I looked at the 8x43. However there are times when I grant that a 10x is a better option, which is why I have one. But it is used at greater distances on clear days without a lot of mirage present.

The 7x36 pretty well replaced the 8x43, and that did somewhat surprise me. I do not see enough magnification difference or detail clarity between 7x and 8x for it to matter to me which magnification it is, either are fine for general purpose. The 8x, in this case cant not match the wide fov or the deep field of focus of the 7x, which is why I went 7x and 10x. The comment I made was a clumsy sort of way to illustrate that there is a 30% difference in magnification. That is a useful thing to have when you need it.

I would contact ZR and order both 7x and 8x with the idea of keeping one and returning the other.
 
Ted,

What I was getting at with the "...more magnification difference.." comment you references is may better explained by saying I feel that combinations of two or more binoculars offer better ultimate options than a single binocular. In this case,when the ED 1 came out, I really figured that here was the ideal affordable, excellent optically great binocular when I looked at the 8x43. However there are times when I grant that a 10x is a better option, which is why I have one. But it is used at greater distances on clear days without a lot of mirage present.

The 7x36 pretty well replaced the 8x43, and that did somewhat surprise me. I do not see enough magnification difference or detail clarity between 7x and 8x for it to matter to me which magnification it is, either are fine for general purpose. The 8x, in this case cant not match the wide fov or the deep field of focus of the 7x, which is why I went 7x and 10x. The comment I made was a clumsy sort of way to illustrate that there is a 30% difference in magnification. That is a useful thing to have when you need it.

I would contact ZR and order both 7x and 8x with the idea of keeping one and returning the other.

thats a good idea but i have to wait till the oppurtunity is right to buy both,i don't have the extra money right now to buy the 7x & 8x but that is a good idea:t:
Ted
 
I just used the Zen 8x43 in the woods today hunting blacktail, and although I suspect the 7X36 would be a little better, the 8's were great. A couple of years ago we were spotting elk from about a half mile to two miles away and we were using 8X and 10X Nikon SE's. After trading back and forth, everyone prefered the 8X. You could see slightly more detail with the 10X, but the comfort of the 8X more than made up for the difference.
 
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I just used the Zen 8x43 in the woods today hunting blacktail, and although I suspect the 7X36 would be a little better, the 8's were great. A couple of years ago we were spotting elk from about a half mile to two miles away and we were using 8X and 10X Nikon SE's. After trading back and forth, everyone prefered the 8X. You could see slightly more detail with the 10X, but the comfort of the 8X more than made up for the difference.

Why aren't you still using the SE's?

Bob
 
Why aren't you still using the SE's?


The Zens are waterproof, and give me just a little more light in the dark corners. The SE's give a better 3D image, and I like the feel better, so it usually boils down to the weather.
 
I just used the Zen 8x43 in the woods today hunting blacktail, and although I suspect the 7X36 would be a little better, the 8's were great. A couple of years ago we were spotting elk from about a half mile to two miles away and we were using 8X and 10X Nikon SE's. After trading back and forth, everyone prefered the 8X. You could see slightly more detail with the 10X, but the comfort of the 8X more than made up for the difference.

i purchased the 8x43 ED2 i just need to finish paying for them
Charles at Zen Ray let me lay them away with 3 equal installments,i will pay for them before the due date i can't wait to get them and check them out,i figured with them being that flexable i might as well get the ED2 with the extra coating on them cause i will probaly have them till one of us expires

Ted
 
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