Siberian Chiffchaffs at Ladywalk (1 Viewer)

More Details by Alan Dean http://deanar.org.uk/tristis/casestudy2.htm


Regards, John

Updated with new information regarding the Ringed Bird. Regards, John

Ringed Chiffchaff

Looking at the Ring from photographs Midlands BTO Ringing trainer and RSPB Middleton lakes warden Stefan Bodnar, concluded from what he can see of the ring.
The ring is a BTO UK Ring and therefore the Chiffchaff must have been caught and ringed in the UK.


Regards, John

JHDraytonbassettpits said:

Looking at the Ring from photographs Midlands BTO Ringing trainer and RSPB Middleton lakes warden Stefan Bodnar, concluded from what he can see of the ring.
The ring is a BTO UK Ring and therefore the Chiffchaff must have been caught and ringed in the UK.


Regards, John

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I wonder how many Siberian Chiffchaffs have been ringed in the UK in say the last 5 years?

Siberian Chiffchaff

Phil Andrews said:

I wonder how many Siberian Chiffchaffs have been ringed in the UK in say the last 5 years?

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Hi Phil,
Stefan also mentioned that a number of Ringers unless especially interested in Eastern race Chiffchaffs, would probably log them as Common Chiffchaff.

Regards, John

BBRC 'tristis panel'

A reliable picture of the taxonomic and plumage limits of tristis will emerge only after genetic studies currently in progress are concluded. However, in the meantime, the BBRC co-opted a 'tristis panel' to examine all reports of 'Siberian Chiffchaff' in the UK during the 'sample' year of 2008. The panel examined all individuals using the currently accepted 'Svensson criteria' for classic tristis, while making allowance for individuals which are clearly very like 'classic tristis' but exhibit limited 'fulvescens' characters. As discussed above, individuals with slight 'additional' yellow and olive are fully compatible with 'fulvescens' from the West Siberian Plain and beyond the true zone of overlap with abietinus. Although there may be some slight introgression across the West Siberian Plain, the panel concurred with the suggestion by Lars Svensson (in Dean & Svensson 2005) that 'fulvescens' is best treated as a form of tristis. Conversely, individuals with more evidently intermediate plumage or anomalous calls, and 'Bonelli's-like' grey-and-white individuals (sensu Dean & Svensson 2005), were excluded by the panel's criteria, as the origins of such individuals remain equivocal. While many questions remain to be answered, a clearer picture of the status of tristis (including 'fulvescens') in the UK has emerged. Full details have been published in: Dean, A., Bradshaw, C., Martin, J., Stoddart, A. & Walbridge, G. 2010. The status in Britain of 'Siberian Chifchaff'. British Birds 103: 320-338. The panel's investigations demonstrated that the numbers of 'Siberian Chiffchaffs' currently reaching Britain are significant. For 2008, reports of 57 individuals were submitted to the panel, of which 49 (86%) were accredited. Applying this endorsement rate to all known reports in Britain during 2008 suggested that around 120 Siberian Chiffchaffs may well have occurred during the year. Thus, Siberian Chiffchaff was confirmed as a scarce rather than rare visitor.

The panel's report also examines in detail the issues of morphology, vocalisations, genetics and hybridisation; the seasonal and geographical distributions of Siberian Chiffchaffs reaching Britain; comparative data from other European countries; and the numbers of Siberian Chiffchaffs reaching Britain in comparison with those of Yellow-browed and Pallas's Leaf Warblers. Reference should be made to the panel's publication by anyone wishing to explore the topic further.

JHDraytonbassettpits said:

Although there may be some slight introgression across the West Siberian Plain, the panel concurred with the suggestion by Lars Svensson (in Dean & Svensson 2005) that 'fulvescens' is best treated as a form of tristis. Conversely, individuals with more evidently intermediate plumage or anomalous calls, and 'Bonelli's-like' grey-and-white individuals (sensu Dean & Svensson 2005), were excluded by the panel's criteria, as the origins of such individuals remain equivocal. visitor.

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I'm confused now :smoke:

I had understood that classic eastern tristis exhibited more buffy flanks and were often mis-diagnosed, but I thought "fulvescens" were Bonelli's-like grey and white type birds (well greyish-brown) - a bit like 2 of the birds at Ladywalk.

I certainly had the unringed bird I saw down as probable fulvescens (western tristis).

Siberian Chiffchaff

wolfbirder said:

I'm confused now :smoke:

I had understood that classic eastern tristis exhibited more buffy flanks and were often mis-diagnosed, but I thought "fulvescens" were Bonelli's-like grey and white type birds (well greyish-brown) - a bit like 2 of the birds at Ladywalk.

I certainly had the unringed bird I saw down as probable fulvescens (western tristis).

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Hi Nigel,
The classic far East Tristis has no traces of yellow (other than the bend of the wing) or Olive unless on rump or tertials they have a distinct call and song. Fluvescents can have traces of yellow and olive in their plumage and have the same call and Song as eastern tristis.
The true grey and white Chiffchaff remains a mystery ( could be a result of integration) Martin Garner classes these as vey rare in Britain. Details explained on Alan Deans site http://deanar.org.uk/tristis/tristis.htm with a case study. However Alan's paper are a few years old now and since genetic testing of Birds in recent Dutch and Cornish papers. Abietinus they don't know where the majority winter, some say fluvescent diagnosis needs widening. I'm afriad that it will take a few more years field work and genetic testing to sort these out. Then there may be a split with Siberian Chiffchaff as a separate species. Although Tristis and abietinus appear to hybridise, in comparison the Caspain Gull hybridises with Herring Gull and Yellow-legged Gull but has been split as a separate species.
At Ladywalk the matter to focus on, is to hear the Ringed Chiffchaff call, if it gives a Bullfinch type call this is a very good indicator.

Regards, John

JHDraytonbassettpits said:

Hi Nigel,
The classic far East Tristis has no traces of yellow (other than the bend of the wing) or Olive unless on rump or tertials they have a distinct call and song. Fluvescents can have traces of yellow and olive in their plumage and have the same call and Song as eastern tristis.
The true grey and white Chiffchaff remains a mystery ( could be a result of integration) Martin Garner classes these as vey rare in Britain. Details explained on Alan Deans site http://deanar.org.uk/tristis/tristis.htm with a case study. However Alan's paper are a few years old now and since genetic testing of Birds in recent Dutch and Cornish papers. Abietinus they don't know where the majority winter, some say fluvescent diagnosis needs widening. I'm afriad that it will take a few more years field work and genetic testing to sort these out. Then there may be a split with Siberian Chiffchaff as a separate species. Although Tristis and abietinus appear to hybridise, in comparison the Caspain Gull hybridises with Herring Gull and Yellow-legged Gull but has been split as a separate species.
At Ladywalk the matter to focus on, is to hear the Ringed Chiffchaff call, if it gives a Bullfinch type call this is a very good indicator.

Regards, John

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Ah, so the mystery birds are entirely devoid of any olive/yellow in the plumage. Thats ok, the pale grey and white bird i saw certainly had a little olive around the lores, rump and wings.