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Once you have Alpha you can never Backa? (2 Viewers)

I just compared the Zeiss 10x42 FL to the Swarovision 10x50 at Cabella's in Grand Junction Colorado and I couldn't believe how much better tha big Swarovision was. It made the Zeiss look poor and the Zeiss is a good binocular! I still prefer the Swarovision 8.5x42 for it's bigger fov though but for more magnification the Swarovski is the way to go. There was NO question it was much better.

;)Careful Dennis, don't be tempted - remember you didn't like the weight of the Canons or the 56m Zeiss! (And I'm betting that you'll keep the SV 8.5x42)
 
;)Careful Dennis, don't be tempted - remember you didn't like the weight of the Canons or the 56m Zeiss! (And I'm betting that you'll keep the SV 8.5x42)

Dennis may need serious consueling if he finds a binocular he keeps, really keeps...for a long time. He may even have to step "backa" into a "lesser" instrument from time to time. Maybe even the new Zen Ray whatever they'll call it...;)
 
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;)Careful Dennis, don't be tempted - remember you didn't like the weight of the Canons or the 56m Zeiss! (And I'm betting that you'll keep the SV 8.5x42)

No! Don't worry I still prefer the Swarovision 8.5 x42 over the Swarovision 10x50 for it's larger FOV. I haven't directly compared a Zeiss FL to a Swarovision in a while and I was amazed how much better the Swarovision 10x50 was when compared side by side with the Zeiss 10x42 FL. I know the 50mm has an aperture advantage but I didn't think there would be that much difference. The Swaro is in a whole other league now. Wow!
 
I think once you've used a binocular with a great image ("alpha" or not), it's hard to settle for something with less of an image. Sure you can be a great birder with any binoculars (in fact, I birded for about five or six years as a child without any binoculars at all and it probably made me a better birder), but once you're used to a really bright, sharp image, it's hard to go back to something with a lesser image. Same thing is true with any equipment, for any purpose, I think. You can often do great work with lesser equipment, but once you've used the good stuff, you really don't want to settle for inferior equipment if you don't have to. This doesn't mean you can't do great work with average tools, but why give up the advantages of the better tools if you don't have to?


Couldn't agree more . . .
 
Am I the only person that see's all this once-a-month model build up as the classic internet pump and dump?

Maybe I'm too cynical.......

MAYBE ...

In the last year Dennis has focused on the 8x30 Nikon Eii, Canon 10x42 IS L, 10x56 Zeiss FL, and 8.5x42 Swaro SV with the little 8x32 Zeiss FL always thrown in as a backup. All among the best of class and type. I wish I only focused on 4 in a year.

Tom
 
MAYBE ...

In the last year Dennis has focused on the 8x30 Nikon Eii, Canon 10x42 IS L, 10x56 Zeiss FL, and 8.5x42 Swaro SV with the little 8x32 Zeiss FL always thrown in as a backup. All among the best of class and type. I wish I only focused on 4 in a year.

Tom

I have had my 8.5x42 Swaro SV's for quite awhile now without selling them! I just can't find anything better. It is getting boring with the same binocular! Maybe I have found my true love. It's hard to divorce them when they are so darn good.
 
Dennis is an enthusiast not a scammer so no need to worry I don't think. He probably makes a little money here and there on his resales, but that's because he works at it. God knows I'm not that motivated.

The fact that he gets "bored" with the best bin he ever tried kind of proves he's honest about it. The fact that he championed a $60 Olympus does as well. No money in that. He may have some adult ADHD though. ;)

I'll go out on a limb here and say Dennis will be "stuck" with the SV's at least until the next generation arrives.

As for me, I'm sold for life on the SV's. I actually doubt anything will come along that gets me to switch. Even if it's marginally better, I don't think I'll chase after it, and this is something new for me because I'm a perfectionist like a lot of us. For now, I'm birding instead of buying. I love it.

Mark
 
Dennis is an enthusiast not a scammer so no need to worry I don't think. He probably makes a little money here and there on his resales, but that's because he works at it. God knows I'm not that motivated.

The fact that he gets "bored" with the best bin he ever tried kind of proves he's honest about it. The fact that he championed a $60 Olympus does as well. No money in that. He may have some adult ADHD though. ;)

I'll go out on a limb here and say Dennis will be "stuck" with the SV's at least until the next generation arrives.

As for me, I'm sold for life on the SV's. I actually doubt anything will come along that gets me to switch. Even if it's marginally better, I don't think I'll chase after it, and this is something new for me because I'm a perfectionist like a lot of us. For now, I'm birding instead of buying. I love it.

Mark

Good for you, Mark. I am trying to be the same way. I think it will be quite a while before anything is even marginally better and even then is it worth it too upgrade? Probably not. I have reached the top of the mountain and it is pretty nice up here.
 
I just compared the Zeiss 10x42 FL to the Swarovision 10x50 at Cabella's in Grand Junction Colorado and I couldn't believe how much better tha big Swarovision was. .
Hello Dennis,

How much of the difference was due to the inherent qualities of the 10x50 vs. a 10x42: more light output and larger exit pupil?

Happy bird watching,
Arthur Pinewood :hi:
 
Hello Dennis,

How much of the difference was due to the inherent qualities of the 10x50 vs. a 10x42: more light output and larger exit pupil?

Happy bird watching,
Arthur Pinewood :hi:

Possibly a little difference could be attributed to the bigger aperture of the SV. But I mean how MUCH advantage is a 4.2 mm EP versus a 5.0mm. But what really shocked me was how much better the SV was overall. The SV was brighter but it wasn't just that. It was contrast, sharpness, and the image had more 3D effect and of course it was tack sharp at the edges like all SV's. If you can try it yourself you will see what I mean. It just reinforced the fact that the Swarovision has leap frogged the competition in optical performance. I looked through the SV first and I thought really nice view then I looked through the Zeiss FL and I was like man this doesn't even compare! Take my word for it if you want a 10x or 12x get the Swarovision. They are not that much bigger either. Slightly heavier and slightly longer. They wouldn't replace my 8.5 x42 for an all-arounder but for open country and birds of prey they are the finest binocular I have looked through and of course with the extra magnification you can see more detail.
 
I think Dennis mentioned lifetime guarantees as a plus point for Swarvoski, but there is an implied extra cost in the purchase price to cover the guarantee.
Problem is do we want to use our bins for a lifetime? I purchased my Zeiss 10x40GBT's 25 years ago and proudly explained to my wife that they would last me till I was 70.
Trouble is not phased coated, waterproof etc and I have added Zeiss 7x42 (phased corrected) plus Nikon HG 8x32 (waterproof) to my collection.
I must agree however that I think the new 10x42s outperform my Zeiss 10x classic but more than happy with the 7x42.
Tell me does using old bins add to your street cred and does it have a value ?
 
I think Dennis mentioned lifetime guarantees as a plus point for Swarvoski, but there is an implied extra cost in the purchase price to cover the guarantee.
Problem is do we want to use our bins for a lifetime? I purchased my Zeiss 10x40GBT's 25 years ago and proudly explained to my wife that they would last me till I was 70.
Trouble is not phased coated, waterproof etc and I have added Zeiss 7x42 (phased corrected) plus Nikon HG 8x32 (waterproof) to my collection.
I must agree however that I think the new 10x42s outperform my Zeiss 10x classic but more than happy with the 7x42.
Tell me does using old bins add to your street cred and does it have a value ?

I am not sure about that but I think you are covered with the Zeiss 7x42. Concerning the Swarovski's I think it always pays to buy quality binoculars because they will last longer and if you do decide to trade up they will hold there value better in the long run.
 
No, I do not personally find that to be evevn remotely close to the case. While I will say the alpha is better, $2k for an alpha simply does not, in my view, justify the price. I have spent quite a bit of time with Swaro and Zeiss, and have a Razor HD, I simply don't think the difference is there. Others will undoubtedly disagree and that's fine.


I've owned 3 Swarovski's, I'm on my second pair of Leica's now, and my first Zeiss - I can see the difference when I pick up a lesser pair. I understand not everyone can afford alpha binoculars but there are bargains to be had if one does a little work (my brand new Zeiss Victory 8x42 T* FL was $1325 shipped).

I also have a pair of Leupold 8x32 Gold Rings and they are really, really nice - but they're not an alpha . . .
 
Here's my experience. I've been using Nikon SE and EDG almost exclusively in the last months. I only use the Leupold Goldring HD 8x32 when I go out with my wife and there is a prospect of rain, in which case she uses the Nikon EDG and I use the Leupold GR HD. Anyone who's looked the Leupold knows that they are no slouch. No CA, very sharp in the center, almost no astigmatism and almost flat to the edge. However, I've got so used to the flat field of the Nikons that the little more field curvature in the Leupold bothers me a lot. It feels like a big downgrade going from the Nikon EDG to the Leupold GR HD, although both are probably better than 95% of the binoculars I see other people are using in my neck of the woods.
 
I must say that I that I have followed this thread with a good deal of interest but can not say that I've really enjoyed it much. To much mutual back slapping and self congratulating for my taste. I suppose I must admit to a pinch of envious jealousy here, as if I could afford to join the Alpha club I would. Now thats a thought why don't all the Alpha owners form a club of your own and the rest of us can join the, China bins are great club!
 
I must say that I that I have followed this thread with a good deal of interest but can not say that I've really enjoyed it much. To much mutual back slapping and self congratulating for my taste. I suppose I must admit to a pinch of envious jealousy here, as if I could afford to join the Alpha club I would. Now thats a thought why don't all the Alpha owners form a club of your own and the rest of us can join the, China bins are great club!

Hiya flossiepip, joining the "alpha club" is not an expensive business. You simply order a pair of Nikon EII, or, if you prefer to wait and shop around or back-order (and for a few bob more), a pair of Nikon SE. I've owned both, and they give up very little to, for example, the SV's (which I also own). I got a pair of EII's for about 280 euro (from the supplier in Hong Kong), which is cheaper than most of the currently excellent Chinese ED binos (which are also superb, and among which I'd recommend the Zen-Rays).
It's not a question of snobbery or envy, they're all just binoculars, tubes with glass in for seeing faraway stuff. No-one is trying to pull rank, we're all just mildly obsessive lunatics indulging a fairly harmless passion. A bit like birding.;)
 
I must say that I that I have followed this thread with a good deal of interest but can not say that I've really enjoyed it much. To much mutual back slapping and self congratulating for my taste. I suppose I must admit to a pinch of envious jealousy here, as if I could afford to join the Alpha club I would. Now thats a thought why don't all the Alpha owners form a club of your own and the rest of us can join the, China bins are great club!

I don't know. I read it too and there seems to be a fair amount of face slapping and back stabbing as well. Typical, really, for Birdforum.;)

Sancho has it right: there's no need to feel left out or envious. I could happily bird for years and years with an SE or a Zen. There's no shortage of good stuff out there these days.

Mark
 
Here's my experience. I've been using Nikon SE and EDG almost exclusively in the last months. I only use the Leupold Goldring HD 8x32 when I go out with my wife and there is a prospect of rain, in which case she uses the Nikon EDG and I use the Leupold GR HD. Anyone who's looked the Leupold knows that they are no slouch. No CA, very sharp in the center, almost no astigmatism and almost flat to the edge. However, I've got so used to the flat field of the Nikons that the little more field curvature in the Leupold bothers me a lot. It feels like a big downgrade going from the Nikon EDG to the Leupold GR HD, although both are probably better than 95% of the binoculars I see other people are using in my neck of the woods.

That is exactly my point and what I am trying to say. Some people notice the little differences and it's hard to go backa.
 
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Like a broken record that just keeps playing... and playing... and playing the same old song.

Makes me wonder who really doesn't believe in their position and needs constant reinforcement.

I give up - the SVs rule. I might have to get one just to get my hands on that broken record that surely is included in every box. Please don't make me read "it's hard to go backa" again or I just might go wacka.:gn:
 
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