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Should I feed Birds bread? (1 Viewer)

lozza_9

Active member
Hi All

Sorry for a stupid question but should i feed the birds bread. I have some bread and was thinking of putting some in a food processor and making it in to bread crums and placing on the bird table or in a feeder I have going spare.

But i don't want to harm the birds - let me know.

Thanks
Lozza
 
lozza_9 said:
Hi All

Sorry for a stupid question but should i feed the birds bread. I have some bread and was thinking of putting some in a food processor and making it in to bread crums and placing on the bird table or in a feeder I have going spare.

But i don't want to harm the birds - let me know.

Thanks
Lozza

Hi Lozza,

Never feed bread to ducklings because it can kill them but bread is fine for smaller birds. If you want to enhance bread a little then fry it or dip it in animal fats such as lard. The same is true for all carbohydrate sources (rice, pasta, cooked potatoes) because these are less useful to birds in their raw form. In addition, do not leave carbohydrate foods out for so long because they tend to go off quicker.

Ian
 
Ian Peters said:
Hi Lozza,

Never feed bread to ducklings because it can kill them but bread is fine for smaller birds. If you want to enhance bread a little then fry it or dip it in animal fats such as lard. The same is true for all carbohydrate sources (rice, pasta, cooked potatoes) because these are less useful to birds in their raw form. In addition, do not leave carbohydrate foods out for so long because they tend to go off quicker.

Ian
Ian, sorry if this is an oft-repeated question (and if it is, please PM me), but could you elaborate on why bread is bad for ducklings? I'm starting to see my duckling-feeding childhood flash before my eyes, and it's a bit scary to think something we did in innocence (and everybody still does at every city park and pond in the US) is actually lethal.

Another question, if you don't mind: I've been told that uncooked rice (or cooked rice that has again dried out) will kill adult birds if consumed in enough quantity. Is this true? If so, can cooked (and still moist) rice be consumed safely if it's coated with drippings, lard, or other oil-based edible to prevent it from drying out before the birds get to it?

Thanks muchly!
 
Katy Penland said:
Ian, sorry if this is an oft-repeated question (and if it is, please PM me), but could you elaborate on why bread is bad for ducklings? I'm starting to see my duckling-feeding childhood flash before my eyes, and it's a bit scary to think something we did in innocence (and everybody still does at every city park and pond in the US) is actually lethal.

Same here Katy - the whole family used to go down to the river to feed the ducks with our two boys when we were visiting their grandparents, and many years later we have taken our grandchildren to a local pond. I can't remember if we actually fed little ducklings too, but I think it is quite likely.
 
It is very, very common to feed whatever birds with bread. But don't (almost) all nestlings feed naturally on meat (of worms to mammals)?

Here we annually have Branta canadensis with misformed wings, not being able to fly, so they die before winter. It has been explained to be because they are, being semitame, fed with bread.
 
I'm sure there is sold theory behind Ian's feeding rules but we've broken them for decades and have not noticed a heap of dead birds under our feeders. Also as a child, feeding the ducks was normally with stale bread, and again, the ducks thrived. Duck belly ache wouldn't be obvious, I suppose - and it's not as if the dry bread wouldn't be accompanied with lots of liquid to wash it down!

Starchy carbohydrates break down into simpler sugars, so far as I know, and don't last for long enough to "go off" in my experience; any yeast in bread is long dead so fermentation is unlikely, too.
 
I was told that (stale?) bread should be soaked in water before being given to garden birds - otherwise, they may swell up inside the bird! :s
 
As a wildlife biologist, the recommendation I always give on this question is NO - REGARDLESS of what species of bird you are feeding. Bread that is made today is generally way too rich for bird digestive systems to handle. Also, most bread manufactured today has chemical preservatives used in it (in some cases derivatives of formalin believe it or not) that may be "safe" for our systems but is not safe for small animals including birds.

Mark
Bastrop, TX
 
Well... what is in "new" bread? The tiny amount of yeast is killed during baking, the alcohol from fermentation has evaporated, the vast majority of the remainder is ground wheat with a very small quantity of sugar, salt and fat.

There is no formaldehyde in any human food product, I feel pretty sure; the preservative in bread (in the UK, at least) is nothing more than ascorbic acid (Vitamin C).

As for swelling up inside birds - so do seeds. But birds have a crop that stores the food until they properly swallow it, so I suspect the swelling is not a major problem if the bird drinks sufficient water. I have certainly seen captive pigeons eat nothing but dried bread to no ill effect.
 
vinnielo said:
I was told that (stale?) bread should be soaked in water before being given to garden birds - otherwise, they may swell up inside the bird! :s
exactally what i heard/read somewhere.
 
scampo said:
There is no formaldehyde in any human food product, I feel pretty sure;...
Not directly, but there are chemicals -- aspartame, I'm told -- that turn to formaldehyde once they reach a certain temperature and are metabolized. Imagine that! Guzzle a diet soda and lose weight *and* pickle your brain all in one easy step! ;)
 
scampo said:
There is no formaldehyde in any human food product, I feel pretty sure; the preservative in bread (in the UK, at least) is nothing more than ascorbic acid (Vitamin C).

I did not state formaldehyde - I stated derivatives of formalin - and there are certainly several derivatives of formalin used as preservatives in foods considered safe for human consumption.

Mark
Bastrop, TX
 
Mallards and maybe some other species of ducks can't be fed bread, contrary to popular belief. While in Sackville Waterfowl Park, there was an information sign that including this bread information. Seems that Mallards can't digest it properly. Another thing to remember is that putting out bread during "teaching" season (the time when birdish parents teach their kids how to fly, how to find food, etc.) lessens the chance of the young'uns from finding their real food. If these birds start to rely heavily on your feedings, then chances are that when you stop feeding them, they will be unable to search for their own food, and will die of starvation.
 
Also, some birds eat rocks to squash their swallowed food so it's easier to digest. At least, I think this is the case.
 
humminbird said:
As a wildlife biologist, the recommendation I always give on this question is NO - REGARDLESS of what species of bird you are feeding. Bread that is made today is generally way too rich for bird digestive systems to handle. Also, most bread manufactured today has chemical preservatives used in it (in some cases derivatives of formalin believe it or not) that may be "safe" for our systems but is not safe for small animals including birds.

Mark
Bastrop, TX


Wow! I'm glad I found this thread! I have a tendency to give our leftover bread crumbs to the birds! Never again! :eek!:
 
humminbird said:
scampo said:
There is no formaldehyde in any human food product, I feel pretty sure; the preservative in bread (in the UK, at least) is nothing more than ascorbic acid (Vitamin C).

I did not state formaldehyde - I stated derivatives of formalin - and there are certainly several derivatives of formalin used as preservatives in foods considered safe for human consumption.

Mark
Bastrop, TX
I'm not sure what "derivative of formalin" really means if you weren't suggesting formaldehyde itself. As an analogy, hydrogen peroxide is derived from water...

Formaldehyde itself has quite specific toxicological effects, but it does not follow that other organic compounds produced "from" formaldehyde would exhibit similar effects or even necessarily be toxic.
 
scampo said:
I'm not sure what "derivative of formalin" really means if you weren't suggesting formaldehyde itself. As an analogy, hydrogen peroxide is derived from water...

Formaldehyde itself has quite specific toxicological effects, but it does not follow that other organic compounds produced "from" formaldehyde would exhibit similar effects or even necessarily be toxic.


It does not follow that other organic compounds produced from formaldehyde, nor those that will break down into formaldehyde in given conditions, will necessarily have the same effects or will necessarily be toxic, true. On the same level, the simple fact that it is approved for use in human products does not necessarily mean that it is safe for use in bird products. Aflatoxin is a great example of that - the level considered safe for human consumption will kill birds quite effectively.

I can not speak for what is used in breads outside the United States. Here, they make it quite clear that the vinegar is added as a conditioner for the dough, not as a preservative. Unfortunately, the bread I currently have in the house is a brand that makes a big deal about not adding preservatives - a shorter shelf life which we pay for but at least I am not pickling myself when I eat it. I can not even speak for current bread production - I made the stupid mistake of simply passing on what I had been told in school by my ornithology and chemistry professors. I will take the time to check some of the cheap brands of bread and report back. However, formalin or not, the ornithologist I work with has assured me that the typical bread manufactured in the US is far too rich for birds to digest effectively.

Mark
 
Should i feed birds?

Katy Penland said:
Ian, sorry if this is an oft-repeated question (and if it is, please PM me), but could you elaborate on why bread is bad for ducklings? I'm starting to see my duckling-feeding childhood flash before my eyes, and it's a bit scary to think something we did in innocence (and everybody still does at every city park and pond in the US) is actually lethal.

Another question, if you don't mind: I've been told that uncooked rice (or cooked rice that has again dried out) will kill adult birds if consumed in enough quantity. Is this true? If so, can cooked (and still moist) rice be consumed safely if it's coated with drippings, lard, or other oil-based edible to prevent it from drying out before the birds get to it?

Thanks muchly!


I hope someone will settle the question of feeding ducklings bread. We've done it, and all has been well. Vik
 
humminbird said:
It does not follow that other organic compounds produced from formaldehyde, nor those that will break down into formaldehyde in given conditions, will necessarily have the same effects or will necessarily be toxic, true. On the same level, the simple fact that it is approved for use in human products does not necessarily mean that it is safe for use in bird products. Aflatoxin is a great example of that - the level considered safe for human consumption will kill birds quite effectively.

I can not speak for what is used in breads outside the United States. Here, they make it quite clear that the vinegar is added as a conditioner for the dough, not as a preservative. Unfortunately, the bread I currently have in the house is a brand that makes a big deal about not adding preservatives - a shorter shelf life which we pay for but at least I am not pickling myself when I eat it. I can not even speak for current bread production - I made the stupid mistake of simply passing on what I had been told in school by my ornithology and chemistry professors. I will take the time to check some of the cheap brands of bread and report back. However, formalin or not, the ornithologist I work with has assured me that the typical bread manufactured in the US is far too rich for birds to digest effectively.

Mark
Hi Mark, Thanks for replying. I do see "where you're coming from", as they say, and I'm just more curious than anything. It's just that bread has been the staple way millions of folk here have fed birds (and ducks) for years.

I still can't understand the term, "rich", whatever your friend means by that. "Richness" in human terms usually means loaded with fats - and birds would love that if it were true; but bread has a tiny amount of fat in it. Even modern bread is basically the same as bread always has been being very largely based on ground wheat grains - and grains are a staple diet for many species.

As for vinegar being toxic, well, what's left after baking will be present in tiny amounts; it's also a very simple naturally occurring organic acid that would, I am guessing here, be easily metabolised in the gut of birds and man.
 
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