Ivory-billed Woodpecker (formerly updates) (3 Viewers)

Snowy1 · May 31, 2005

Hi all - first time posting on here.

I have just returned from a 3 day weekend trip to Arkansas. I will be writing up another report for my website soon but here are some of the details:
I spent 2 days searching in the White River NWR and 1 day in the Dagmar WMA. Both areas were very impressive however as was pointed out earlier in this thread, the White River is the real deal. I had a GPS with me and was able to get off the ATV trails once I was far enough away from the road. There are mature trees throughout the area, many at 4 feet in diameter. I observed bark-scaling on so many trees that I began to wonder if it was Pileateds that were responsible; I will post the pictures I took as soon as I can. No Ivorybills were seen or heard in the White River in my 2 days of searching.
The Dagmar WMA is not as extensive but the trees I observed in the northern part of the area were quite old. At one point, while hearing Blue Jays and Nuthatches simultaneously, I heard some calling that I had not heard before that resembled the Ivorybill call. I could describe it as a repetitive tooting of a horn. I heard it for 3 minutes in an area with bark scaling. I am unsure what it was and could not locate it with the heavy foliage. Nevertheless, the area could (and probably is) supporting 1 or 2 pairs of IBWs.
A few other thoughts...we must thank the hunters. I used to look differently upon them but really they have saved the habitat. If it weren't for them, not even half of the NWRs would exist. We should continue to cooperate and we'll both win.
Now, someone get a report back from the crew in the Atchafalaya basin!

For those interested in more reading, I have maintained an Ivorybill site (very basic) since searching the Pearl in 2001: http://www.geocities.com/miami13_dan/Ivorybill.html

fangsheath · May 31, 2005

I saw a lot of bark scaling too, but almost invariably associated with deep excavation that looked very pileated-ish. I saw nothing that closely resembled David Luneau's photos, which still strike me as highly unusual. I strongly suspect that ivory-bills do much less bark scaling in the warm season, just as pileateds are known to switch to more fruits and less beetle larvae in the summer.

I saw remarkably few birders weekend before last, particularly in the more remote parts of White River NWR. Did you encounter many?

Snowy1 · May 31, 2005

Re:

I saw remarkably few birders weekend before last, particularly in the more remote parts of White River NWR. Did you encounter many?[/QUOTE]

I didn't see a single birder out there. Only the odd fisherman. Perhaps it was the weather being hotter and the bugs but I still expected to see more people out.
Luneau mentioned in another article that he determined some scaling he saw to be Beaver-scaling. When a tree is completely knawed down, I usually assume it's a beaver but Luneau's photo is strange.
What I saw in terms of scaling was nothing like that photo - simply the bark at been removed and some horizontal gauges were visible. I will get those pictures done soon and put them up on the website. On only one occasion did I see the scaling present with Pileated-type deep holes.

fangsheath · Jun 1, 2005

I have seen quite a lot of beaver sign, it is easily recognizable with experience. Beavers' incisors leave double-gouges, so to speak, that run at many different angles. I saw one tree up there that had beaver sign about 15 feet up.

When I came back and looked at Luneau's photos again, I really regretted not taking any measurements on scaling. I have very good photos of what are almost certainly woodpecker gouges, but no measurements. The gouges in David's photos definitely look like they were made by a woodpecker, but appear wider than anything I saw. Whatever made them came back to the very same tree within 2 weeks after the first photo was taken, and back again subsequently.

Jesse Gilsdorf · Jun 1, 2005

IBW v. Imperial

KCFoggin said:
The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service has launched a new website for
Ivory-billed woodpecker updates: http://www.fws.gov/ivorybill/

"This site will be updated regularly to include weekly updates of recovery activities and the latest recovery team information as it is developed. Inquiries should be referred to this site."

From reading some descriptions it appears that the sitings may be imperial woodpeckers as well as or instead of ibw. Imperials appear to my untrained eye to almost exactly match ibw in field markings with the exception that when resting there will be two white triangles on the back instead of one. I think that it is possible that there have been found two species that haven't been confirmed as sited since the 50's.
Jesse Gilsdorf

lazybirdwatcher · Jun 1, 2005

Jesse Gilsdorf said:
From reading some descriptions it appears that the sitings may be imperial woodpeckers as well as or instead of ibw. Imperials appear to my untrained eye to almost exactly match ibw in field markings with the exception that when resting there will be two white triangles on the back instead of one.

No white line along the side of the neck either, though, right?

Someone had mentioned the Imperial and Pale-billed woodpeckers as potential IBW look-alikes when I was asking about birds similar to the IBW. I only knew of the Pileated until that time. Looking at images I found on the 'net, it seemed obvious the Imperial must not have the neck/body stripe, or at least pictures I saw were not showing such a thing. Most notable to me were the black head of the Imperial and mostly red head of the Pale-billed, and of course the black red and white of the Pileated. But, without a good view of their heads, I could imagine a mistaken identity if the neck and wing markings were also overlooked.

I just didn't have the practice of seeing any of these birds, unfortunately, and only a meager rememberence of the Pileated kind. All my comparisons were made after the fact.

Snowy1 · Jun 1, 2005

While I wouldn't rule anything out at this point, several experienced birders have seen the IBW and have clearly identified it. The video is still unclear but the sightings have been good with some at close range from the reports I read on the net. Also, as far as I know an Imperial Woodpecker has never been recorded in the United States - correct me if I'm wrong.

fangsheath · Jun 1, 2005

An interview with Tim Gallagher can be found here:

http://girlscientist.blogspot.com/2005/05/interview-with-tim-gallagher-author-of.html

There is not a lot of new information there, but he does mention Mary Scott's sighting and his feelings about it. He also talks about hands-on vs. hands-off approaches to the ivory-bill.

humminbird · Jun 1, 2005

Snowy1 said:
While I wouldn't rule anything out at this point, several experienced birders have seen the IBW and have clearly identified it. The video is still unclear but the sightings have been good with some at close range from the reports I read on the net. Also, as far as I know an Imperial Woodpecker has never been recorded in the United States - correct me if I'm wrong.

Nor a Pale-billed Woodpecker for that matter.

gws · Jun 2, 2005

choupique1 said:
did you folks ever stop and think that there is some info not being made public?.... some details....... ..]

Yes, I've stopped and thought about it and I'm damned happy some info has not been made public. I think there is a definite need to keep certain things from Joe Q. Public.

Having said that, I predict the next confirmed sighting of IBWO will be made in the great state of Mississippi. I saw extensive scalings of the upper boles of nuttall oaks in a certain place there sometime in the past, and now that I'm more educated about IBWOs, I can't help but think that was their work. Scalings, not drillings.

All you people out there who want to get famous with an IBWO photograph, take my advice and head to Mississippi. Besides, they need your tourism dollars.

lazybirdwatcher · Jun 2, 2005

Thanks for that article, fangsheath.

I got a t-shirt

from sapsuckerwoods.com, the Cornell Lab of Ornithology with IBW on back created from Larry Chandler's painting. I'm reluctant to wear it, afraid I'll be asked about it and find myself telling of seeing one (or so I still wonder).

My mother showed me the local newspaper article about the painting after I had ordered the shirt. It looks very much like what I saw fly across the road except that it would be tilted the opposite way, as seen from below and not above, yet going in that same direction.

http://www.decaturdaily.com/decaturdaily/news/050517/stamp.shtml

Only thing I can't figure is why the wings appeared squarish, or rather rectangular, to me. Perhaps a moment during flapping when the tips bent back? I sure wish I had a minute or more to watch it fly. And I'd have loved to see it cling to a tree!

That blog article has a poor quality color picture that shows the bill appearing almost exactly as I remember it. I think it's enhanced the most in my memory, practically surreal. That photo pretty much sums up my fleeting glimpse because of the outstandingly prominent bill showing up best in that. But then there's also that whole view of it in flight I can't ever forget either. If I were more religious I'd suspect some divine intervention allowed me the chance to see one (again, if it really were one).

I sure hope whatever happens will all be good for those birds.

Katy Penland · Jun 2, 2005

For those of you planning on heading into the swamp...

gws · Jun 2, 2005

fangsheath said:
An interview with Tim Gallagher can be found here:

http://girlscientist.blogspot.com/2005/05/interview-with-tim-gallagher-author-of.html

There is not a lot of new information there, but he does mention Mary Scott's sighting and his feelings about it. He also talks about hands-on vs. hands-off approaches to the ivory-bill.

Thanks for the Gallagher link. I read it, and as far as the hands-on/hands-off issue, my vote from the peanut gallery is for hands-off! As Gallagher mentions, the best thing to do is to expand habitat, connect corridors, and stand back and let nature take it's course. To try some egg transfer plan or have a web cam pointed at a nest from some other tree would be risky. This bird does not want anything to do with the human race and for good reason, I might add.

fangsheath · Jun 2, 2005

That is actually a pretty brilliant little graphic, which I plan to mention to our reptile curator tomorrow.

Katy Penland · Jun 2, 2005

fangsheath said:
That is actually a pretty brilliant little graphic, which I plan to mention to our reptile curator tomorrow.

Great idea! :t: Don't know where it originated, someone forwarded it to me with a whole bunch of other similar "joke" signs. I just really liked the message.

Snowy1 · Jun 2, 2005

Thanks for the Gallagher interview link. Clearly there still is a lot of unknown regarding the population size and range of any existing Ivorybills. As he points out, he wouldn't have bothered with Gene Sparling's report if it had not been for Mary Scott's 2003 sighting, only because they were in that famous "corridor". Could we not assume that the corridor extends even further south to encompass today's Singer Tract and also the Atchafalaya region. In my view there must be pockets of the birds breeding in these areas because however unlikely that seems, at least 2 Ivorybills (Mary Scott's being the second) have been confirmed recently. That means the birds have secrectly sustained themselves for 60 years in some remote areas - and have succesfully bred. It is now a matter of time before a breeding area is found. Despite the Yazoo area of Mississippi being logged in the late '80s, does anyone know if there are still extensive areas of old-growth forest that could support the Ivorybill in Mississippi?

fangsheath · Jun 2, 2005

I good idea of forest coverage and the presence of corridors can be gained at:

http://www.mapmart.com/AerialPhotography/Aerial.htm

Click on "Begin Search" under aerial photography. There is a virtually unbroken, albeit narrow, corridor of forest within the Mississippi River levees. Personally, I think it is unlikely that ivory-bills use it routinely, although young birds particularly may make use of it when dispersing to new areas. Tensas NWR (former Singer Tract area) is somewhat isolated by agriculture. Based on what I know about ivory-bill natural history, I think existing populations are very isolated from one another. I doubt there is much gene exchange today.

gws · Jun 2, 2005

I hope birders will shove their egos aside about having to see an actual IBWO so they can add it to some list and instead just be content to know that the bird still carries on in the face of long odds. Don't stress any remnant population by relentlessly looking for them. Do donate money so that habitat can be acquired and protected from the greedheads. That is the way to help them.

Snowy1 · Jun 2, 2005

Re:

gws said:
I hope birders will shove their egos aside about having to see an actual IBWO so they can add it to some list and instead just be content to know that the bird still carries on in the face of long odds. Don't stress any remnant population by relentlessly looking for them. Do donate money so that habitat can be acquired and protected from the greedheads. That is the way to help them.

Other than your point about donations, I must respectfully disagree with you.

The first thing that must be done is to find any breeding populations and protect the areas from possible development. Even though the IBW has survived for 60 years it will inevitably face human pressure as land is developed. We must find the appropriate areas and preserve them before someone unknowingly affects them. I am by no means a lister; my sole concern is the safety of the IBW. If we can determine areas where the IBW is present it will only help these critically endangered birds because recovery teams will take the necessary steps for preservation.

Vultur · Jun 2, 2005

gws said:
choupique1 said:

did you folks ever stop and think that there is some info not being made public?.... some details....... ..]

Yes, I've stopped and thought about it and I'm damned happy some info has not been made public. I think there is a definite need to keep certain things from Joe Q. Public.

Having said that, I predict the next confirmed sighting of IBWO will be made in the great state of Mississippi. I saw extensive scalings of the upper boles of nuttall oaks in a certain place there sometime in the past, and now that I'm more educated about IBWOs, I can't help but think that was their work. Scalings, not drillings.

All you people out there who want to get famous with an IBWO photograph, take my advice and head to Mississippi. Besides, they need your tourism dollars.

Click to expand...

Do you mean info on how to ID an ivory-bill is being kept secret? Why???

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