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Birds in Action at 15 fps, and more: Nikon 1 (1 Viewer)

Anti-aliasing filter

Just for fun: a duck feeding from the ground of a river (first photo). - I was a little disappointed that a series of Kingfisher shots didn't show a lot of feather detail. An older photo with a Canon SX50 had done better, at least in this respect. In both cases the distance to the bird was a little below 10m. The morning light gave the Canon some advantage over the Nikon V2 that struggled in harsher light. Still, I wonder whether the lack of detail isn't mainly caused by the anti-aliasing filter in the V2? That would be a reason to prefer the J5 (which lacks an AA filter) in many situations. Or I might need to get a V3. - If the bird is close enough (3rd photo), the V2 is able to deliver...

I liked how the 70-300CX kept the Red kite in focus, even when the bird sailed for several seconds over the trees. - Sometimes the Nikon J5 behaves surprisingly different from the V2, one might almost suspect that it had been developed by another department. ;) Two observations: With the V2 I can leave the battery in the camera for a few days without shooting. On the other side it seems that an inactive J5 empties the battery in a few days. - The V2 has the ability to override the distance limiter of the 70-300CX lens. It seems that the J5 is lacking the same ability, this new camera is less "intelligent" than the older device.
 

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Just for fun: a duck feeding from the ground of a river (first photo). - I was a little disappointed that a series of Kingfisher shots didn't show a lot of feather detail. An older photo with a Canon SX50 had done better, at least in this respect. In both cases the distance to the bird was a little below 10m. The morning light gave the Canon some advantage over the Nikon V2 that struggled in harsher light. Still, I wonder whether the lack of detail isn't mainly caused by the anti-aliasing filter in the V2? That would be a reason to prefer the J5 (which lacks an AA filter) in many situations. Or I might need to get a V3. - If the bird is close enough (3rd photo), the V2 is able to deliver...

I liked how the 70-300CX kept the Red kite in focus, even when the bird sailed for several seconds over the trees. - Sometimes the Nikon J5 behaves surprisingly different from the V2, one might almost suspect that it had been developed by another department. ;) Two observations: With the V2 I can leave the battery in the camera for a few days without shooting. On the other side it seems that an inactive J5 empties the battery in a few days. - The V2 has the ability to override the distance limiter of the 70-300CX lens. It seems that the J5 is lacking the same ability, this new camera is less "intelligent" than the older device.

You can see with your dove image that the detail is there. But it's also a good example of the narrow Depth-of-field that you get digiscoping. The start of the beak and forehead is in sharp focus but the eye isn't. Sometimes this is hard to see in the field so I often tweak the focus back and forth a bit to get a range of focus points. I think that's the problem with the Kingfisher shot. It looks to me if the bird is a tad out-of-focus as the little leaf at the back seems to be where the focus is. I find if I focus on the feet the head will be in the same focus plane but if I focus on the breast it may not be. Of course best to focus on the head but birds head are often moving fast so this can be difficult.
Keep having fun.
Neil.
 
Could you guys experienced with the Nikon 1 system (J5 and V3) please tell me what is the maximum (numerically high) wide open aperture using FX and DX lenses via the FT-1 adapter, that will AF, and how many points and where? Is f6.3 or f8 possible? Is it quick and usable, or prone to hunting? Also is it correct that this adapter can't be used with TC's? Many thanks.


Chosun :gh:
 
I have a V2 and FT1,i only used it with the 70-300 and 55-300 from nikon,i did use it with the Sigma 150-600 C,50-500 and 120-400.
I only got center focus point but AF and IS worked with all lenses (no AFC as far as i know) and i have to say pretty good,it surprised me that with the 150-600 i could hand hold it.
 
You can see with your dove image that the detail is there. But it's also a good example of the narrow Depth-of-field that you get digiscoping. The start of the beak and forehead is in sharp focus but the eye isn't. Sometimes this is hard to see in the field so I often tweak the focus back and forth a bit to get a range of focus points. I think that's the problem with the Kingfisher shot. It looks to me if the bird is a tad out-of-focus as the little leaf at the back seems to be where the focus is. I find if I focus on the feet the head will be in the same focus plane but if I focus on the breast it may not be. Of course best to focus on the head but birds head are often moving fast so this can be difficult.
Keep having fun.
Neil.
Many thanks for the advice, Neil. Your post reminds me of the fun that I had with my digiscoping attempts. In this case I wasn't using the scope, just the Nikon V2 + 70-300CX lens, plus extension tubes. The dove was only 1m away and was very patient. So I took dozens of shots: feet, head, with and without extension tubes. Mainly to find out how much magnification the extension tubes gave me in such a situation and with this lens. The answer was: about twice the magnification as the 70-300CX alone.

You are right, the dove's eye wasn't in focus. Here is another image from the series, no crop. Plus the feet. - I had only a few seconds with this kingfisher, maybe I focused on the long beak... Anyway, this photo may be slightly better. - The lack of feather detail also has to do with the 1/1600 sec speed at iso 1600, as I was hoping to catch the bird in BIF. Still, I think I might prefer the J5 with kingfishers in the future. The colours should be easier to handle with a better sensor.
 

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Could you guys experienced with the Nikon 1 system (J5 and V3) please tell me what is the maximum (numerically high) wide open aperture using FX and DX lenses via the FT-1 adapter, that will AF, and how many points and where? Is f6.3 or f8 possible? Is it quick and usable, or prone to hunting? Also is it correct that this adapter can't be used with TC's? Many thanks.
Chosun :gh:
Sorry, I don't have the FT-1, nor do I have any experience with Nikon FX or DX. Since nikonmike mentions the Sigma 150-600 Contemporary, you might read this practice report, although it covers the "Sport" version of the lens, not the "C". The experience sounds positive enough, and other sources seem to confirm that the "C" cooperates just as well with the FT-1.

An older article by Thomas Stirr is also worth reading. But in the meantime things have changed a little: first, there was a firmware upgrade, so that AF-C is now available with the FT-1. Second, the 70-300CX lens entered the scene, and in later articles Stirr has often expressed his preference of this lightweight alternative.
 
Thanks for the replies Nmike and Hermit :t:

I read through the links - interesting that AF compatibility is a bit variable, though it seems like given the right firmware it should work with all f6.3 lenses. I don't think the Sport makes sense, but the 150-600 Contemporary, (and new Tamron?) would be interesting propositions. In the sample pictures, I think the lack of improvement in image detail above 500mm (X2.7) is because of these lenses relative softness at the 600mm end, and the technique required at this ~1600mm eq length.

I wonder if the Nikon 1's would function with the 800mm f5.6? .... With its built in 1.25xTC that would make its 1000mm f7.1 an insane 2700mm eq f7.1 !! :eek!:

It seems strange that the 1's wouldn't work with TC's at least at up to around this f number .... maybe it's just firmware issues?

Btw, Hermit - nice results with the native CX telezoom :t:
From what I have seen poking around on review sites etc, the iq of the J5 sensor seems right up there with the Sony RX10 III.


Chosun :gh:
 
Thanks for the replies Nmike and Hermit :t:

I read through the links - interesting that AF compatibility is a bit variable, though it seems like given the right firmware it should work with all f6.3 lenses. I don't think the Sport makes sense, but the 150-600 Contemporary, (and new Tamron?) would be interesting propositions. In the sample pictures, I think the lack of improvement in image detail above 500mm (X2.7) is because of these lenses relative softness at the 600mm end, and the technique required at this ~1600mm eq length.

I wonder if the Nikon 1's would function with the 800mm f5.6? .... With its built in 1.25xTC that would make its 1000mm f7.1 an insane 2700mm eq f7.1 !! :eek!:

It seems strange that the 1's wouldn't work with TC's at least at up to around this f number .... maybe it's just firmware issues?

Btw, Hermit - nice results with the native CX telezoom :t:
From what I have seen poking around on review sites etc, the iq of the J5 sensor seems right up there with the Sony RX10 III.


Chosun :gh:

A couple of points i never got any Tamron lens to work and i dont know of any one that did,i never updated the firmware because i read some owners got screwed as it stopped working with some sigma lenses,if you check the Nikon site i think they stopped the latest 1 series working with some long lenses,
 
A couple of points i never got any Tamron lens to work and i dont know of any one that did,i never updated the firmware because i read some owners got screwed as it stopped working with some sigma lenses,if you check the Nikon site i think they stopped the latest 1 series working with some long lenses,
Mike I checked the website, and indeed the 'System Chart' lists the J5 as NOT working with the Nikkor 400/2.8 FL, and the 800/5.6 among others. No mention of compatibility with third party lenses ....

It seems strange that Nikon would deliberately hobble the performance and versatility of its "1" system by not ensuring compatibility with longer Nikkor or 3rd Party lenses and TC's (or maybe not so strange with Nikons marketing men and bean counters ensuring neat silos so as not to tread on the toes of its DSLR businesses). The potential for relatively light weight systems (using the Tammy, Siggy, Nikon PF's, etc) at lengths longer than the CX tele zoom is absolutely huge. You would think that a newish format struggling for traction would jump at the chance! :eek!: :cat:


Chosun :gh:
 
You shouldn't have any trouble with the long Sigma zooms,i had a original Tamron 150-600 and the V2 would not recognize it,Nikon have now said they have not discontinued the 1 series,in what way it will remain they have not said.
If Nikon had shown signs of taking the system further i would not have bought into m4/3 but its too late now.
 
Btw, Hermit - nice results with the native CX telezoom :t:
From what I have seen poking around on review sites etc, the iq of the J5 sensor seems right up there with the Sony RX10 III.
Chosun :gh:
Thanks!

Nikon have now said they have not discontinued the 1 series,in what way it will remain they have not said.
If Nikon had shown signs of taking the system further i would not have bought into m4/3 but its too late now.
The charm of the Nikon 1 is the stark alternative it offers to other options, DSLR and M4/3. If someone puts IQ and professional technology above all else, the choice will be the DSLR. Reduced weight and smaller size means "mirrorless". There are lots of reasons why many prefer M4/3 cameras over the Nikon 1 system, e.g. no dedicated macro lens, fewer options of a flash, no bracketing, fears about the future of the system, and generally just much more options in the ever growing M4/3 world.

On the other side, the insecure future of the Nikon 1 system has led to much reduced prices in the "used market", and if one can live with the limitations, it is a high-quality, affordable solution in particular for shooting birds in flight.
 
The charm of the Nikon 1 is the stark alternative it offers to other options, DSLR and M4/3. If someone puts IQ and professional technology above all else, the choice will be the DSLR. Reduced weight and smaller size means "mirrorless". There are lots of reasons why many prefer M4/3 cameras over the Nikon 1 system, e.g. no dedicated macro lens, fewer options of a flash, no bracketing, fears about the future of the system, and generally just much more options in the ever growing M4/3 world.

One reason to actually prefer the Nikon 1 over M4/3 is the FT1 adapter that allows you to use any Nikkor on the Nikon 1. That really makes a difference if you already have a number of Nikon lenses. And even with a cheapish AFS-Nikkor like the 70-300 VR you get fast autofocus and usable image quality up to about 250mm (=675mm equivalent on full frame).

The other big advantage of the Nikon 1 over M4/3 is that AF-C works nicely; that's a bad weakness of M4/3. Sure, that may change with the announcement of the Olympus EM1 MkII, but for the time being the Nikon 1 (with all it's weaknesses) will beat any M4/3 camera with regard to AF-C.

On the other side, the insecure future of the Nikon 1 system has led to much reduced prices in the "used market", and if one can live with the limitations, it is a high-quality, affordable solution in particular for shooting birds in flight.

You can say that again. I bought a second Nikon 1 V1 body in excellent shape with only 9,000 clicks for under € 200 used earlier this year. And that included an FT1 and two batteries. Sure, many people complain about the sensor of the Nikon 1 V1, but up to 800 ISO the results are usable without too much work in PP. 1600 ISO works in a pinch as well, provided you use RAW and make sure your PP is up to scratch.

Hermann
 
Five photos from a recent trip to Lake Constance. Photo numero three shows my first encounter with a Water Rail. :t: Clearly a "better bird" than two ducks taking off from the water surface, but shooting 20+ photos of water action in 15 fps mode remains a great feature of the N1 cameras.
 

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One reason to actually prefer the Nikon 1 over M4/3 is the FT1 adapter that allows you to use any Nikkor on the Nikon 1. That really makes a difference if you already have a number of Nikon lenses. And even with a cheapish AFS-Nikkor like the 70-300 VR you get fast autofocus and usable image quality up to about 250mm (=675mm equivalent on full frame).

The other big advantage of the Nikon 1 over M4/3 is that AF-C works nicely; that's a bad weakness of M4/3. Sure, that may change with the announcement of the Olympus EM1 MkII, but for the time being the Nikon 1 (with all it's weaknesses) will beat any M4/3 camera with regard to AF-C.



You can say that again. I bought a second Nikon 1 V1 body in excellent shape with only 9,000 clicks for under € 200 used earlier this year. And that included an FT1 and two batteries. Sure, many people complain about the sensor of the Nikon 1 V1, but up to 800 ISO the results are usable without too much work in PP. 1600 ISO works in a pinch as well, provided you use RAW and make sure your PP is up to scratch.

Hermann

This situation has changed already,i use the Panasonic GX8 with the 100-400 and AFC is very usable for BIF,still behind the top DSLRs but upto or better than the lower models.
Dont get me wrong i like the 1 series i kept my V2 and FT1 but the GX8 is way ahead of it.

A few images from the GX8
 

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This situation has changed already,i use the Panasonic GX8 with the 100-400 and AFC is very usable for BIF,still behind the top DSLRs but upto or better than the lower models.
Dont get me wrong i like the 1 series i kept my V2 and FT1 but the GX8 is way ahead of it.

Unfortunately, top DSLRs are expensive. |;|
Actually it is hard to know how much better top DSLRs really are. I've seen remarks from users of top DSLRs who say that series of AF-C shots can still include blurry images. Sounds very much like what I experience with the Nikon V2! People who own both systems, top DSLRs and mirrorless, say that the top DSLR's autofocus is more accurate. But I love the Nikon1 system for what it does for a fraction of the price.

Photographing birds in flight is dependable from so many factors - a slight change of your position, and suddenly you don't have the bird against a messy background without contrast, but against the sky or water surface, and the camera shines.

Birds that fly in a right angle to the observer are not as difficult as birds that come towards the camera, or fly away with accelerating speed. If I remember correctly, Olympus has advertised the latest model as having the fastest AF in the world. Even if this were true - I've heard it before ;) -, it could refer to the time that the camera needs to acquire focus on the bird. It would be good to know more: is the AF so fast only for objects that are clearly visible or can it be confused by a nasty background? How reliable is the tracking, how many shots are blurry? I hope eventually someone will do the serious comparison tests, BIF fans all over the world would be grateful.

Recent photos below.
 

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Birds that fly in a right angle to the observer are not as difficult as birds that come towards the camera, or fly away with accelerating speed.
I had planned to illustrate my observation above with sample photos, but never found the time for it. Maybe 2017. ;) Lately I saw the following remark in a Canon thread:

Big problems arise when taking pictures of a bird flying towards you.
During two seasons of using 5DSR I wasn’t able to take a single picture of a bird flying towards me. At the same time I did manage to take pretty good photos using the same 500/4+x1.7 at Canon 7D mark II.
So it seems even birders with top-notch cameras can have problems in these situations.

I have had lots of fun with the NikonOne in 2016. While I bought the V2 mainly for birds in flight, I soon learned to appreciate it for "water action" or macro work (using the 30-110 CX lens with extension tubes). Some examples below.

Happy New Year everybody!
 

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Three shots from an encounter with a Peregrine on Saturday. Coming towards me, I was able to get a series of 24 sharp photos in the 15fps mode with AF-C. With smaller birds flying into my direction the focus is often struggling, fortunately the Peregrine is a "slow" bird. And it is also sufficiently large to keep the focus square on the target. Only the 25th photo, when the bird was almost above me, shows the bird on the edge of the frame, so it is to be expected that it is blurry.

Can you expect a better AF performance from an old (2012) Nikon1 camera that costs a fraction of the latest M4/3 models?

Eventually, I hope, one of the leading camera companies will produce a camera with pattern recognition and speech software, so that you just have to say "raptor", and it instantly focuses on the bird. Not to forget the switch that converts the camera into a capable bat detector.
 

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Three shots from an encounter with a Peregrine on Saturday. Coming towards me, I was able to get a series of 24 sharp photos in the 15fps mode with AF-C. With smaller birds flying into my direction the focus is often struggling, fortunately the Peregrine is a "slow" bird. And it is also sufficiently large to keep the focus square on the target. Only the 25th photo, when the bird was almost above me, shows the bird on the edge of the frame, so it is to be expected that it is blurry.

Can you expect a better AF performance from an old (2012) Nikon1 camera that costs a fraction of the latest M4/3 models?

Eventually, I hope, one of the leading camera companies will produce a camera with pattern recognition and speech software, so that you just have to say "raptor", and it instantly focuses on the bird. Not to forget the switch that converts the camera into a capable bat detector.

I think it'll be a while before voice command cameras unfortunately. It would be useful for shutter release and self timers.
Nice to see someone still have fun with the V series Nikon. Looking at these three photos it seems only the first one is sharp. I am looking on a laptop though. I presume it was early on in the series. I would like to see a 100% crop of the head of one of the later in the series. I'll be photographing Peregrines myself later on this year and was thinking of the V2 and 70-200/2.8 combo. Should be fast enough.
Neil.
 
I see the second one as in focus on the breast. That to me is part of the challenge with long lenses, thin DOF

Niels
 
I think it'll be a while before voice command cameras unfortunately. It would be useful for shutter release and self timers.
Nice to see someone still have fun with the V series Nikon. Looking at these three photos it seems only the first one is sharp. I am looking on a laptop though. I presume it was early on in the series. I would like to see a 100% crop of the head of one of the later in the series. I'll be photographing Peregrines myself later on this year and was thinking of the V2 and 70-200/2.8 combo. Should be fast enough.
Neil.
Thank you for the comments, Neil (and Niels). These three photos were the 8th, 22nd and 23rd of the series. Each is (roughly) a 1600x1200 pixels segment of the original, thus the first shot is "smaller". Looking at the original of the second (= 22nd) photo, the peregrine is in the upper left corner - I was already "losing contact" with the central focus point. Here are two earlier photos, the 13th and the 19th, when I still had the focus point on the bird.

This forum has narrow limits for posting images. At dpreview files can be large and include the exif information. For gallery photos a 100% view is available. Perhaps I'll make another attempt to edit some of these more carefully (I fear I pushed the dark areas too much) and post at dpreview, linking here. Or would it be better not to edit much and just do NR in DxO?
 

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