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Why are birds SO scared of humans (UK)? (1 Viewer)

It would be interesting to do a study, disguising yourself as a herbivore and seeing how much closer you get, compared with the more traditional fieldcraft which seems to involve dressing in green, wearing a hat, and walking slowly..

Herbivore style would include: huge eyes stuck on the side of your head, or walking on all fours, eating grass, panto cow costume etc

I think I'm not the only person who would be very interested in seeing the results, but perhaps less interested in performing the experiment ;)
 
Tideliner said:
Similar behaviour can be seen with hunted waterfowl. I know ponds where the ducks are fed by people and will take bread out of your hand . The same birds sometimes fly out to a local saltmarsh where wildfowling takes place and will not allow a human within 200 yards. So these birds have learnt not only where humans are a danger , but also where they are not.
Click to expand...

They certainly do learn quickly and adapt to each situation accordingly, Non quarry species also seem to quickly learn that the threat isnt aimed at them. I spent most of yesterday surrounded by Shelduck,Eider and Brent regulary within 20-30 yards but the Wigeon, Pintail and Pinkfeet remained little more than specks in the distance through the bins.
 
My two spring visiting Mallard pair turned up in my garden for the first time this year only yesterday. Initially they flew off if I went out of the front door but by this morning all they did was look up from under the feeders and then carry on eating. If I stay about ten feet away from them it's no problem as far as they are concerned. Should I attempt to get closer they quack loudly at me as if to say "stop invading our space" but then usually carry on eating. only if I make a sudden move to them do they eventually and reluctantly fly off.

In any case they soon return and just carry on as if nothing has happened. From previous experience they will soon not bother about me at all and only vanish through the hedge if I start using my noisy motor mower on "their" lawn.

I bet if I had noisy kids or pets around then I would never even get them in the garden at any time.:cat:
 
I think they is something fundamentally different about the tameness of UK and European birds. I have visited numerous feeders in the US and Canada, most in rural areas, some in popular national parks ...in virtually all cases, chickadees, nuthatches and assorted others bounce down onto your hand as soon as you get a few sunflowers out. Pretty much the same happens with Sociable Weavers, hornbills and many others in national parks in southern Africa. Rare indeed is this in Europe though, House Sparrows in parks occasionally maybe, but why not at the feeding stations on reserves, etc.


With 'training', I can get Marsh Tits and then Great and Blue Tits to take from my hand at my feeders, but this is really the exception, rather than the rule that seems to exist pondside.
 
One thing I have noticed, with local birds: some species seem to be able to recognise specific human beings, and react accordingly, after some time of familiarisation. This is known to be true of crows, but it seems like other birds have the same knack.

For example, there is a bush outside my building, which is always full of song sparrows. I often eat lunch near this bush. The first few times I did this, the birds were noticeably nervous, and some flew away. After a couple of months of frequent lunching and photographing, the birds stopped reacting to my approach. Last week, one of them ran over my foot, while I stood next to the bush, trying to snap a different bird. However, they still freeze or fly when random people approach.

A hummingbird that visits my new feeder has just begun feeding when I am on the balcony, this week, and waited nearby while I changed the food. I have no idea how this bird would react to somebody else's presence, though. I will have to test it in future, and see if its reaction to a stranger is any different.

It seems like the default is, indeed, to view us as a threat, though.
 
Socar MYLES said:
One thing I have noticed, with local birds: some species seem to be able to recognise specific human beings, and react accordingly, after some time of familiarisation. This is known to be true of crows, but it seems like other birds have the same knack.
Click to expand...

I've noticed the same thing in my garden where the birds are quite confiding with me but if my neighbours are around they are much more nervous and often fly away. They act in a similar way to my parents but if I'm with them and put food in one of their hands then occasionally one of the birds has come to take food from them.

Eyes looking towards birds certainly are a trigger for flight response; when trying to tame the birds here I quickly found that they would settle a lot more if I was in one spot and not looking at them compared to if I looked towards them (even if I was still and just facing their way when they arrived, so was not the movement, although that would certainly intensify the response!). The sparrows now will sometimes come to pick up food from near my feet whilst I sit on the back step but are reluctant if I'm not looking elsewhere. However the tame birds pick up on my eyes too and if I'm looking at them and they want food then they become more excitable under my gaze, the blackbirds sometimes twitch and 'chip' and run towards me if they know I'm looking at them. The opposite is definitely true with wild birds out in the countryside!
 
Now that I think of it, I have noticed another odd thing, with bird behaviour and the human gaze: the crows that visit my balcony will happily dine while I sit and watch, and even sit and sun themselves in my vicinity. But they only engage in obnoxious behaviours, such as stealing the stones from my planter and dropping them over the side, or throwing dirt all over the floor, once I leave or turn my head. They don't seem to understand that I can still see what they're doing, via their reflections in the window, or plain old peripheral vision.

I'm not sure how they know they shouldn't do these things while someone is looking, but the fact remains: they never do. Maybe it's as simple as not wanting to be encumbered with a stone, while a potential threat is in the vicinity. Or maybe they've been shooed by other people in the neighbourhood, while messing with their planters. I'm not sure how one would go about figuring it out, for sure. Too bad we can't ask them.
 
Socar MYLES said:
One thing I have noticed, with local birds: some species seem to be able to recognise specific human beings, and react accordingly, after some time of familiarisation. This is known to be true of crows, but it seems like other birds have the same knack.
Click to expand...

Australian Magpies will do a very similar thing. All year long they will take note of who is in their territory (not only, or so much who, but what they're wearing). So if you've been wearing dark blue jumpers and T-shirts all year, then come nesting time you'd better stick to the same wardrobe - because if you change to a white T-shirt for example - look out! :eek!: your friendly neighbourhood "maggie" will bomb you relentlessly until you depart the territory (and if that happens to be on the way to the mailbox - tough! - looks like you either change clothes, or you're driving down the driveway to get it!).

The one exception to this rule is the local postman who will be 'waited upon' - 'ambushed' - and 'mercilessly predated' ........ I vividly recall one poor 'postie' who would be spotted approaching a shopping complex, and despite the hundreds of other people around (and him wearing the same uniform all year!), would be singled out and relentlessly bombed. It didn't matter whether he mounted the footpath and snuck under the shopping centre awning, or even if he went into the centre through one door and came out another - the "maggie" was waiting! It was 500m of personal daily hell during nesting season ..... you could even see the poor bloke shaking with trepidation as he approached :eek!:

No matter if he gathered 'steely resolve', "gunned it", 'changed course', 'disguised himself, or "stop-started" - the "maggie" would always get him ...... maybe it just didn't like those 'farty' little "postie" bikes ?! :smoke:


Chosun :gh:
 
A lot of birds of prey are not that scared of humans.

Benjamin Franklin of course, wanted the turkey to be the national bird, what is interesting is Ben Franklin has a letter, article he wrote where he criticized bald eagles and he said something like one sees them perched on a log next to the river (the letter I think talks about an eagle stealing from some animal or bird that catches a fish in the river), low and behold, I was out at a river one day and a young bald eagle (still had a brownish head so a baby or young they told me) and it was perched on a tree stump. But it didn't mind me, I watched it from about 10 feet which I thought was pretty close.

I also have been by a lake and an owl was perched on a tree and didn't fly off, there is a small owl in the USA I believe I have heard, that won't fly off from you and that you can get near.
 
Depends on the individual too, perhaps hereditary to some extent. I have 10 or so egrets on my field per day. Some flee as soon as you step on the grass, some don't budge until you are close to them, some halfway in between.

(Though often if one flies the rest will fly too.)
 
NightCap said:
A lot of birds of prey are not that scared of humans......
Click to expand...

Out here, Wedge-tailed Eagles seem to particularly avoid man and his habitation (outback roads with plenty of fresh roadkill the exception) ...... and why wouldn't they - they're (were?) one of the most persecuted raptors in the world.

Government bounties were still paid for dead 'wedgies' up until 1974, and it's estimated that one million eagles were killed during the preceding 50 years under this bounty system. 1 Million ! http://www.raptor.org.au/wte_posn.pdf

They're still not entirely safe to this day, and with NSW deciding to allow hunting in state forests and national parks, one wonders how many will fall victim to morons, and illegal trophy hunters, etc.


Chosun :gh:
 
One bird of prey species out of dozens out there. Sounds like this happened in one country, Australia or something too. So? nobody said all, they said a lot. Anybody can find an exception I suppose. Read what someone says. I'm sure those birds are harassed.
 
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We have a country line behind our house, and well yesterday I had a wonder up there with the aim of trying some bird photography.

Anyway to cut a long story short, while I was walking, there was a Robin, that decided to follow me up, jumping from hedge to hedge the entire length I walked (which was only about half a mile as im just getting over the flu). Each time he got abit in front of and started singing! Anyway by the time I started to return home he was still following me, singing each time he got about a metre in front of me while in the hedge row.

I was trying to photo the little dude, and he kept hiding, yet just as I turned for home, he say happily on a branch, which was about 8 feet away and let me take a picture! For his kindness I sprinkled a abit of bird seed (I always carry some as 'bait' to keep them occupied while I try and learn how to use this camera lol)

So I have no idea if he was telling me to sod off out his territory, or because alot of people take the kiddies up there to feed the birds and stuff, he associated a human with food? Who knows, but I did get a lovey picture of him!

Kain
 
Socar MYLES said:
Now that I think of it, I have noticed another odd thing, with bird behaviour and the human gaze: the crows that visit my balcony will happily dine while I sit and watch, and even sit and sun themselves in my vicinity. But they only engage in obnoxious behaviours, such as stealing the stones from my planter and dropping them over the side, or throwing dirt all over the floor, once I leave or turn my head. They don't seem to understand that I can still see what they're doing, via their reflections in the window, or plain old peripheral vision.

I'm not sure how they know they shouldn't do these things while someone is looking, but the fact remains: they never do. Maybe it's as simple as not wanting to be encumbered with a stone, while a potential threat is in the vicinity. Or maybe they've been shooed by other people in the neighbourhood, while messing with their planters. I'm not sure how one would go about figuring it out, for sure. Too bad we can't ask them.
Click to expand...

This is very interesting. I recently read of a study where dogs were 4x more likely to take food when they had been told not to, if the human wasn't looking at them. It even held true for when the human was in the room, but it was darkened so that the dog couldn't see the human's expression.

I know it's been mentioned a few times on the thread already, but some birds have a real unease when a human gaze is locked on to them, or feel threatened by their proximity as within the learned "attack" range. Out in the country here (farms, grazing blocks, etc.) farmers will sometimes shoot crows that are predating new-born livestock etc. It's interesting that the crows will watch the farmers drive around - stop - get out of the vehicle - walk around - pull out a rifle - load the chamber - lean over a rest - take a sight ..... and only then will they fly off before aim and fire get a look in. I know they are very intelligent - but it even seems as if they are giving a 'mocking' 'laugh' calling as they fly away!


Chosun :gh:
 
Chosun Juan said:
This is very interesting. I recently read of a study where dogs were 4x more likely to take food when they had been told not to, if the human wasn't looking at them. It even held true for when the human was in the room, but it was darkened so that the dog couldn't see the human's expression.

I know it's been mentioned a few times on the thread already, but some birds have a real unease when a human gaze is locked on to them, or feel threatened by their proximity as within the learned "attack" range. Out in the country here (farms, grazing blocks, etc.) farmers will sometimes shoot crows that are predating new-born livestock etc. It's interesting that the crows will watch the farmers drive around - stop - get out of the vehicle - walk around - pull out a rifle - load the chamber - lean over a rest - take a sight ..... and only then will they fly off before aim and fire get a look in. I know they are very intelligent - but it even seems as if they are giving a 'mocking' 'laugh' calling as they fly away!


Chosun :gh:
Click to expand...

Yes, you should respect privacy. Birds sometimes demand it.
 
What does seem odd to me is inconsistency. I can feed bread to Mallards and Goosanders at a range of a couple of feet, yet the same species can take flight before I've got within 100 yards.

A single Snow Bunting will let you get really close but a flock quickly takes flight.
 
Lawts said:
What does seem odd to me is inconsistency. I can feed bread to Mallards and Goosanders at a range of a couple of feet, yet the same species can take flight before I've got within 100 yards. A single Snow Bunting will let you get really close but a flock quickly takes flight.
Click to expand...

I've been at Rattray Head, close to the lighthouse at low tide, when we had to keep our feet still to avoid stepping on Snow Bunting flock members - about 200 birds were foraging on the sand in a 30-knot wind that was sending millions of stinging sand-grains across the strand, yet the birds ignored them (unlike us!).:eek!:
MJB
 
Adam W said:
They certainly do learn quickly and adapt to each situation accordingly, Non quarry species also seem to quickly learn that the threat isnt aimed at them. I spent most of yesterday surrounded by Shelduck,Eider and Brent regulary within 20-30 yards but the Wigeon, Pintail and Pinkfeet remained little more than specks in the distance through the bins.
Click to expand...
In early January, our pochards stayed well over the central line of Danube (opposite from the bank where people walk around) but then gradually moved closer and closer and in February I saw them feeding only about 5 meters from the bank (I guess they would go right to the bank if there was food there as well).

A wild mallard with an injured wing due to shooting was feeding in a mixed flock right next to the bank (domestic and wild mallards and one Muscovy/Mallard hybrid).

Velvet scoters remained specks in the distance (actually brown blobs that we named UDO - unidentified duck objects) throughout their stay at the deepest furthest part of Danube. Luckily we managed to observed them once when they fell asleep and floated too far down the river and then frantically flapped to get back to their hideaway spot on the river.
 
NightCap said:
I also have been by a lake and an owl was perched on a tree and didn't fly off, there is a small owl in the USA I believe I have heard, that won't fly off from you and that you can get near.
Click to expand...

Sounds like the Saw-whet Owl. They allow very close approaches, but it isn't because they aren't scared of humans - many owls rely on their camouflage and can be very stressed out when somebody gets too close to their roosting spot!

I also have experienced birds knowing when you make eye contact. I nearly walked past a barred owl the other day. The second I stopped and made eye contact, off it went.
 
Zheljko said:
In early January, our pochards stayed well over the central line of Danube (opposite from the bank where people walk around) but then gradually moved closer and closer and in February I saw them feeding only about 5 meters from the bank (I guess they would go right to the bank if there was food there as well)......
Click to expand...

In general, and thinking of places like recreational wetlands etc, I wonder if birds also associate the presence of humans with the presence of some of their (nowdays, usually) more natural predators - such as dogs (although I think cats would be rather more successful hunters of birds), particularly bankside ?

I've lost track of the number of muppets with dogs that let them run free in restricted zones (despite the plethora of signs saying no dogs off leash), blundering into the shallows, chasing birds, and generally causing all manner of panic.

I think what is emerging on this thread is a pattern of bird learning - genetic, and/or behavioural, in response to potential, or actual threats.


Chosun :gh:
 
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