[Irish Kite]

http://wwf.panda.org/wwf_news/?204443

Will the President do the right thing and consign this bill to the skip where it belongs??

[cuckooroller]

It is rather singular that the major driving force behind clear-cutting amazonian rain forest for more than a decade is not even mentioned. Corn for ethanol on the U.S. market. I am rather perturbed that the wwf doesn't mention it. Apparently somebody has been able to censor the press release. It does not speak well to the credibility of the wwf.

[Irish Kite]

Originally Posted by cuckooroller

It is rather singular that the major driving force behind clear-cutting amazonian rain forest for more than a decade is not even mentioned. Corn for ethanol on the U.S. market. I am rather perturbed that the wwf doesn't mention it. Apparently somebody has been able to censor the press release. It does not speak well to the credibility of the wwf.

The bio-fuel scam is indeed an enormous and still growing threat to rainforest areas throughout the world - just look at the damage palm-oil plantations are doing to remaining populations of Orang-utan, Sumatran Tigers etc. in SE Asia

[cuckooroller]

Originally Posted by Irish Kite

The bio-fuel scam is indeed an enormous and still growing threat to rainforest areas throughout the world - just look at the damage palm-oil plantations are doing to remaining populations of Orang-utan, Sumatran Tigers etc. in SE Asia

...not to mention PNG, and W Papua (Kalimantan). Yes, I am well aware of it though it would seem that being closer, the Aussies are more on top of this subject. Biggest culprit, at least in this case, China.

[Imaginos]

Originally Posted by Irish Kite

The bio-fuel scam is indeed an enormous and still growing threat to rainforest areas throughout the world - just look at the damage palm-oil plantations are doing to remaining populations of Orang-utan, Sumatran Tigers etc. in SE Asia

Aren't most palm oil plantations set up for producing 'vegetable oil' for food production rather than for biofuel?

[cuckooroller]

Originally Posted by Imaginos

Aren't most palm oil plantations set up for producing 'vegetable oil' for food production rather than for biofuel?

Yes, they are, supposedly that is. Irish Kite was just slightly off the mark. The real problem with the (sic) "palm-oil plantations" is another. They are used as trojan horses to get at the real target, which is, non-replaceable old stand hardwoods. If you take a close look at the locations, the palm species being used and their habitat requirements (in particular, their altitudinal optima since most of these locations are not lowland), it is soon apparent that they are not adapt to the locations being chosen. So, what they do is clear-cut, set up palm-oil plantations that normally do not produce, rather they die off. Then, it is off to the next pristine logging location for the next clear-cut to set up another "palm-oil plantation". To a close analogy, the whole operation might be viewed as "swarms of locusts" coming in, stripping everything, and leaving a smelly non-productive pile of shït.

[Imaginos]

Originally Posted by cuckooroller

They are used as trojan horses to get at the real target, which is, non-replaceable old stand hardwoods.

Agreed, and also a scenario likely replicated with the corn-oil in the Amazon & elsewhere. In both cases there is a bait-and-switch, getting people to rail against (eg) the "biofuel scam" whilst missing the true target.

[jurek]

I guess WWF here is itself at a cross.

Few years ago WWF etc. themselves loudly promoted biofuels as a solution to global warming (together with wind turbines etc). Now biofuels already made massive habitat destruction and starvation for millions of people.

This made me sceptical of supporting WWF etc. - they have now power to change whole economic policies, but no understanding of complex results of their actions and no wish to take responsibility. This is useful organization, but why they don't stick to traditional national parks and protection of species - here they have proven expertise?

[cuckooroller]

Originally Posted by Imaginos

Agreed, and also a scenario likely replicated with the corn-oil in the Amazon & elsewhere. In both cases there is a bait-and-switch, getting people to rail against (eg) the "biofuel scam" whilst missing the true target.

Well, the corn-ethanol thing is a problem since the active intercession of several U.S. administrations, including this one, gives an added incentive for corrupt politicians in Brazil to find a way to clear-cut in areas where perhaps the rainforest would otherwise have remained undisturbed. There are about two or three years of corn production until that nutrient-intensive crop renders the already nutrient poor soil from the clear-cut totally unproductive. To speak, therefore, of the "bio-fuel scam" is appropriate in this case. It is a part of it, just not the whole part.

[BrightIdea]

Originally Posted by jurek

I guess WWF here is itself at a cross.

Few years ago WWF etc. themselves loudly promoted biofuels as a solution to global warming (together with wind turbines etc). Now biofuels already made massive habitat destruction and starvation for millions of people.

This made me sceptical of supporting WWF etc. - they have now power to change whole economic policies, but no understanding of complex results of their actions and no wish to take responsibility. This is useful organization, but why they don't stick to traditional national parks and protection of species - here they have proven expertise?

+1

re sticking to what they "know", read between the lines. Are they THAT inept? A grade school student could have forseen the Biofuel/corn eth- scam a mile away.

WWF is not about wildlife, it is about politics and control, wildlife preservation merely being a vehicle for that.

A damn shame.