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Old Thursday 1st January 2015, 23:54   #1
squidge
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Switching systems

Hi, I'm thinking of switching camera systems from Nikon to M43. I was wondering if anybody else has done the same and what is their experience.

I currently use a Nikon D7100 with 300 f4 and 1:4 tc. Ive been reading that Olympus are bringing out their own 300 f4 and tc.
Anybody use the Olympus EM-1, experiences?

I've sold my other Nikon lenses as they were not being used with the main issue being weight.

So I would guess that weight,quick autofocus and good IQ would be my main priorities.

Regards Gerard.
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Old Friday 2nd January 2015, 00:57   #2
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The main advantages of the m4/3 system are size and weight but the new Olympus 300mm will have to be quite sizeable as the F4 aperture will need to be 75mm in diameter and as one of their 'Pro' series lenses they won't be cutting many corners on the design and construction. So the full-on E-M1 + battery grip + 300mm + 1.4tc will not be that much smaller than some DSLR set-ups. However, any additional lenses that you may require can pull back the advantage - lenses like the 25mm and 45mm F1.8 designs are amazingly small and light for their specs.

Of course, until the 300mm is released we won't know just how heavy it will be - and how expensive! - but to make up some way for the smaller sensor size it will certainly need to perform extremely well at full aperture so as to enable the lowest ISO setting possible.

One wonders whether Panasonic may be working on a more compact F5.6ish 'Leica'-branded alternative design for those wanting to stick to the small/light m4/3rds concept...
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Old Monday 5th January 2015, 18:18   #3
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it will certainly need to perform extremely well at full aperture so as to enable the lowest ISO setting possible.
Looking at reviews of the 40-150 mm pro lens does give reason for optimism regarding the behavior of the "bigger brother"

Niels
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Old Wednesday 7th January 2015, 16:14   #4
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With Nikon just announcing a new small/lightweight 300mm F4 similar to Canon's DO lenses, Olympus will really have to look to their new lens design again before they intruduce it later this year.

Perhaps they ought to have a look back at one lens from the original OM line-up from over 40 years ago That 300mm F6.3 appeared in the first catalogues with the early OM1 cameras but never seemed to make it into full production. The optical design looks very similar to their 200mm F5 which was produced and was well-reviewed at the time
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Old Wednesday 7th January 2015, 22:10   #5
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I've put the switch on hold as I'm quite surprised at the weight loss of the new 300f4. If the IQ is as good as the current 300 then I could see myself sticking with Nikon but it will also depend on what the Olympus 300f4 is like.

If this lightweight format is the future then I'm all for it as the weight of some of nikons lenses although necessary where backbreaking.

Only problem is how do I sell my current 300f4 which is less than a year old.

Regards Gerard.
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Old Friday 9th January 2015, 13:31   #6
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if having a fast lens is not an issue for you, then i would suggest to have the Lumix 100-300mm lens with the EM-1.

its a real great lens.

the other option the Zuiko 75-300mm is also superb and a bit better in video.

but the Lumix OIS is really fabulous. and it is one stop fast than the Zuiko.

i am also waiting for the 300mm/f4 m4/3, hoping it will be reasonably priced.

BTW the OM E1 ans most of the other OM's and Lumix new bodies have internal digital TC, which makes 300 mm= 600mm on the 4/3 sensor, which is equal to 1200mm on the full frame.
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Old Tuesday 13th January 2015, 02:12   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squidge View Post
Hi, I'm thinking of switching camera systems from Nikon to M43. I was wondering if anybody else has done the same and what is their experience.

I currently use a Nikon D7100 with 300 f4 and 1:4 tc. Ive been reading that Olympus are bringing out their own 300 f4 and tc.
Anybody use the Olympus EM-1, experiences?

I've sold my other Nikon lenses as they were not being used with the main issue being weight.

So I would guess that weight,quick autofocus and good IQ would be my main priorities.

Regards Gerard.
I'm actually in the process of moving the other way. The main reason being the lack of options on the tele side i.e. 300 and above. For my GH3 I only have the Panasonic 100-300 available. The OLY with IBIS has more options if you are willing to use an adapter. So before switching make sure the lens(es) you want is(are) available. The weight advantage of M4/3 is not that great. Compact APS-C DSLR bodies are in the same weight class as some M/3 bodies. The weight/size of the shorter focal length lenses should not be a big factor. The longer lenses should not be too different either.

As for the 2x crop and 2x reach that only applies if the different size sensors have the same resolution. The 16MP resolution of the M4/3 is based on a 4:3 aspect ratio. For a 3:2 ratio it is closer to 14MP. The end result is that a 24MP APS-C sensor will give the same reach as a 16MP M4/3 sensor. That is to say, you can crop an image taken with a 300 mm lens on an APS-C sensor to be more or less the same size in pixels as one taken with an M4/3 camera.

This is not to disparage the M/3 system. They have some great cameras and lenses. I'm very happy with my GH3 and the 12-35 Pro grade lens but I just got tired of waiting for the longer reach lenses.

Paul

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Old Tuesday 13th January 2015, 14:39   #8
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The weight/size of the shorter focal length lenses should not be a big factor.
I thought I would like to see if I could check out the above statement. I therefore looked at the 12-35mm f2.8 pana lens, which is a relatively heavy m4/3 lens: 305g, 74mm long.
Nikon FX 24-85mm f/2.8-4D IF is a somewhat similar lens even though it is not constant f: 545 g, 83mm
Nikon FX 28-70mm f/2.8 ED-IF is probably a more fair comparison given that it is the constant f2.8: 935g, 122 mm long.

For DX, I could not find a single fast lens with a comparable range. I did find 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6G VR II: 195g, 66mm -- however the fair comparison for Panasonic would be something like 14-42mm F3.5-5.6 II ASPH Mega OIS: 110g, 49mm.

In conclusion, from almost 2x to 3x the weight when comparing smaller nikon lenses to comparable reach pana lenses.

Niels
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Old Tuesday 13th January 2015, 16:41   #9
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One more example: the high quality Oly M.Zuiko Digital ED 40-150mm F2.8 Pro (880 g, 160 mm) is as far as I can see most similar in reach (for DX camera) to the nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II (1540 g, 209 mm).

Niels
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Old Tuesday 13th January 2015, 17:32   #10
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Originally Posted by njlarsen View Post
I thought I would like to see if I could check out the above statement. I therefore looked at the 12-35mm f2.8 pana lens, which is a relatively heavy m4/3 lens: 305g, 74mm long.
Nikon FX 24-85mm f/2.8-4D IF is a somewhat similar lens even though it is not constant f: 545 g, 83mm
Nikon FX 28-70mm f/2.8 ED-IF is probably a more fair comparison given that it is the constant f2.8: 935g, 122 mm long.

For DX, I could not find a single fast lens with a comparable range. I did find 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6G VR II: 195g, 66mm -- however the fair comparison for Panasonic would be something like 14-42mm F3.5-5.6 II ASPH Mega OIS: 110g, 49mm.

In conclusion, from almost 2x to 3x the weight when comparing smaller nikon lenses to comparable reach pana lenses.

Niels
Hi Neils

The general point I was trying to make was that on the smaller focal lengths I can't see how 75g to 150g weight difference makes much of a difference in lens selection but I generally only carry a maximum of two lenses at a time. There are also some very heavy short focal length lenses weighing over 1000g.

There are quite a few, often heated, discussions on equivalency on Dpreview forums. The aperture has a big influence on the size and weight of the lens as does the sensor size. You are quite right that sticking to 2.8 on both results in lighter M4/3 lenses. However, I have no problem with 3.5 and those lenses are similar in weight to the 2.8 M4/3 lenses. 3.5 also seems to be the starting point for the more common DX lenses

You already mentioned the Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6G VR II weighs 195g. I have the Pany 12-35 and before that had the old 14-140 at 460g. Both were fine for me weight wise. Probably not fair to compare the 12-35 to the Nikkor as the Pany is a better build but the image quality of the original 14-140 was not great so it's a fair comparison.

At a longer focal length, the Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 18-140mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR weighs 490 g 78x97mm vs the new Pany Panasonic Lumix G Vario 14-140mm F3.5-5.6 ASPH. / Power O.I.S 265g 67x75mm results in a greater weight difference of 230g and more bulk. Interesting that the weight of the Nikkor is similar to the weight of the old Pany 14-140 at 460g.

Comparing the Pany 100-300 to a DX offering makes an interesting case,

Panasonic Lumix G Vario 100-300mm F4-5.6 OIS 520g 74x126mm
Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 18-300mm F3.5-6.3G ED VR 550g 79x99mm

Both are almost the same in weight and bulk. In the end this is where I have ended up. With no new tele zoom lenses (I don't want a prime lens) in either PANY, OLY or Sony E mount coming up anytime soon and me not wanting to wait any longer I took the plunge yesterday.

I pre-ordered the Nikon D5500 body and the 18-300 zoom. The end result; what I have now, GH3 + Pany 100-300 (550+520=1070g) to what I will be using D5500 + Nikkor 18-300 (420+550=970g). About the same in weight but with the convenience of a superzoom bridge camera. No lens changes on my trip in March. This gives me the same coverage I have now with the 12-35 and the 100-600. I expect the quality to be good enough for me but I am sorry to give up the EVF.

This doesn't work for everyone but it works for me.

Paul

Last edited by Paul Tavares : Tuesday 13th January 2015 at 17:34. Reason: typo
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Old Tuesday 13th January 2015, 17:49   #11
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One more example: the high quality Oly M.Zuiko Digital ED 40-150mm F2.8 Pro (880 g, 160 mm) is as far as I can see most similar in reach (for DX camera) to the nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II (1540 g, 209 mm).

Niels
Hi Neils

Not sure if these are a match in terms of quality but food for thought depending on a user's quality requirements. Price tag varies accordingly.

Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 18-140mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR 490g 78x97mm
Nikon AF-S DX Nikkor 55-200mm f/4-5.6G VR II 300g 71x83mm

I'm not an expert on any of these. I'm only sharing my thoughts from what I have discovered over the last two months after I decided to switch. Manufacturers seem to be making more use of composites in lens bodies to keep the weight down. Not a problem. Modern jets have bodies made from composites. They are also providing light weight small bodies for those who want a smaller form camera.

Paul

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Old Tuesday 13th January 2015, 21:00   #12
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Last year I bought the Nikon 24-70 f2.8 and the 70-200 f2.8 vrii but in the end they were far too heavy and cumbersome to be lugging around. I sold them,so if I were to switch systems it would be have to have lenses of the same quality.
Although with the release of the new 300 are Nikon going to overhall their heavier lenses into a lighter format? Maybe a roadmap for their future productions would be useful in helping me decide whether to stick or not.

Regards Gerard.
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Old Wednesday 14th January 2015, 15:34   #13
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Last year I bought the Nikon 24-70 f2.8 and the 70-200 f2.8 vrii but in the end they were far too heavy and cumbersome to be lugging around. I sold them,so if I were to switch systems it would be have to have lenses of the same quality.
Although with the release of the new 300 are Nikon going to overhall their heavier lenses into a lighter format? Maybe a roadmap for their future productions would be useful in helping me decide whether to stick or not.

Regards Gerard.
Gerard, those look like perfect matches for the two lenses in my last two posts: the pana 12-35 and the Oly 40-150.

Niels
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Old Wednesday 14th January 2015, 15:37   #14
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Paul,
I would probably not go to a superzoom lens and expect to put a TC or do large crops from it. However, for an all round lens on e.g., a dusty safari where many of the targets are relatively large mammals, there that choice would make sense for me.

Your opinion differs, and that is fine.

Niels
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Old Friday 23rd January 2015, 14:24   #15
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It looks as though Olympus will soon introduce a new OM-D series camera if this video is anything to go by:http://www.ephotozine.com/article/ol...-camera--26843

I wonder what new features it will have? A practically silent, 'problem-free' electronic shutter would be a big advantage for wildlife photography but I'm not sure how far away that is at the moment...
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Old Friday 23rd January 2015, 20:32   #16
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Plenty of info on the first couple of pages here: http://www.43rumors.com/

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Old Friday 6th February 2015, 18:05   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squidge View Post
Last year I bought the Nikon 24-70 f2.8 and the 70-200 f2.8 vrii but in the end they were far too heavy and cumbersome to be lugging around. I sold them,so if I were to switch systems it would be have to have lenses of the same quality.
Although with the release of the new 300 are Nikon going to overhall their heavier lenses into a lighter format? Maybe a roadmap for their future productions would be useful in helping me decide whether to stick or not.

Regards Gerard.
Gerard,
Wow. You bought both the Nikon 24-70 f2.8 and the 70-200 f2.8 vrii lenses and then sold them both! I have to agree with Niels: If you are truly interested in these high quality lenses but you want smaller and lighter, then the micro-4/3 equivalents *would* get you the same level of quality with less weight. I have the Olympus 12-40mm f/2.8 and it is excellent. I don't have the Olympus 40-150mm f/2.8 but I do have the Olympus 75mm f/1.8 and it too is VERY nice. Both of these are significantly smaller and lighter than the equivalent Nikon alternatives.

If you read my other posts you know that like you, I have the D7100 and I use it with 300mm f/4D with 1.4X teleconverter, and like you I'm very interested in both the new compact Nikon 300mm f/4 VR and the yet-to-be released Olympus 300mm f/4. As more reports and tests come in for the new Nikon 300mm, I may not be able to resist it. I'm sure the image quality of the Olympus 300mm will be great, and I'm guessing I would also prefer the build quality of the Olympus. In terms of size and weight, we don't know yet but the Nikon is SO compact and light that the Olympus might actually end up being heavier. With the Olympus still not available and the Nikon reports just now starting to appear, it is hard to say but I think I will prefer the new Nikon, especially for it's continuous autofocus and birds in flight... The consensus right now is that any mirrorless system still cannot match traditional Canon/Nikon DSLR's for continuous autofocus & tracking ability (the Nikon 1 system comes close, but I just don't like that "consumer-styled" system with it's tiny sensor). I hope Olympus can improve the continuous autofocus to the point where I will prefer their lens. In fact I wonder if that may be why we have been waiting SO LONG for the new Olympus 300mm. They might finally release it with a new body that improves continuous autofocus a bit more.

So I'm not switching systems... For me the solution was to use both Nikon DX and Olympus mu-4/3 systems! I just couldn't resist the Olympus system. It's really beautifully designed, well built, very customizable, with great lenses, more "cutting edge" and fun than Nikon in many ways. Olympus also actually does meaningful updates to the firmware, whereas Nikon never does anything except maybe fix a bug or add support for a new lens. The Olympus menus and controls do take some time to learn. For some people they might go too far in giving you buttons that can be customized (especially on the latest EM-5II).

Dave

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Old Friday 6th February 2015, 23:05   #18
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Hi Dave, I've put the switch on hold as I'm also looking at the new reports of the Nikon 300 which seem very positive. With the weight reduction of the new lens I think it just might be what I'm looking after. Although I'll wait a couple of months and see how the reviews pan out plus make sure there are no lens issues.
I had two issues with switching to another format. One was telephoto lens availability and the other was as you said the continuous autofocus. The lens issue looks like it could be resolved but the autofocus still needs a bit more work. I've also looked at fuji which are supposed to be bringing out a new telephoto zoom lens but their continuous autofocus is apparently worse than Olympus.
So until the autofocus is sorted I'll hold off on a purchase but I wonder what Nikon are going to do with their lens line up. Will they become shorter and lighter?

Regards Gerard.
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Old Saturday 7th February 2015, 02:29   #19
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I have no experience, but oly just announced (or was it just on the rumour site) that there is a new firmware coming for EM1 to improve continues AF.

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Old Saturday 7th February 2015, 03:13   #20
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Yes Niels,
More information here:
http://www.dpreview.com/articles/742...re-version-3-0

Olympus must know the importance of meeting this challenge... I still think they might roll out an entirely new body along with the new lens... just a guess. You can only do so much with firmware changes.

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Old Saturday 7th February 2015, 16:49   #21
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By then it probably is time for the successor of the 1 (1-II?)

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Old Friday 27th February 2015, 14:12   #22
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It looks as though Olympus will soon introduce a new OM-D series camera if this video is anything to go by:http://www.ephotozine.com/article/ol...-camera--26843

I wonder what new features it will have? A practically silent, 'problem-free' electronic shutter would be a big advantage for wildlife photography but I'm not sure how far away that is at the moment...
A lot of the reviews of the EM-5 Mk11 seem to concentrate on features like the 40Mp mode, improved IS and better button layout, but the 'silent' shutter doesn't seem to be attracting too much attention yet. It'll be interesting to see how it performs in the hands of a wildlife photographer
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