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Old Saturday 24th June 2017, 16:51   #101
Troubador
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TM

Your point about different flavours of bins suiting different folks is spot on. I am sure you will find there a perfectly good or even stellar binos that you just don't bond with while others feel right in your hands and to your eyes the moment you look through them.

If they are to be your companions and long days out or even brief outings, they need to feel comfortable in the broadest possible sense of that word.

The Bird Fair is a fantastic event and well worth the trip. Some of the stands can get very busy and sometimes it can be hard to settle down with a pair of bins to really get to grips with them. But sometimes you can do this and even if its mega busy you can pick up and get a feel for so many models you can at least decide on a short list to follow up on at a dealers.

Good luck Lee
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Old Saturday 24th June 2017, 23:12   #102
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Hello again, Moog,



Butterflies! Fascinating creatures. A couple of years ago, I set out on a quest for a pair of top-flight x42 bins suitable for watching both birds and butterflies. This ended up at an optics day at Titchfield Haven in Hampshire spending some quality time with Swarovision ELs and Zeiss Victory SFs.

Both were most certainly top flight models. They showed crisp detail, both at a distance and at five feet, and natural colours; they were comfortable to use for ten minutes at a stretch. As far as my limited experience could tell, they deserved their alpha rating.

But I had no hesitation in buying the SFs; for two reasons -- field of view and balance.

Zeiss makes sure that potential customers have heard about the SF's wide field of view. And it is good: I could see what was going on around the bird on which I was concentrating. At the time, it was this factor which seemed to me to be the more important.

Two years later, I now think that the balance is the greater benefit. The centre of balance of the bins is close to resting on my thumbs, so little effort is needed to keep them horizontal. This makes them more comfortable to use for extended periods than my only other good bins, a pre-Swarovision pair of ELs.

I'm beginning to think that, if one can trust the optics to be first rate, then it is ergonomics that should be the major factor in one's choice.

Obviously, different hands and eyes will have different perceptions. In particular, two knowledgeable butterfly chasers on BirdForum have found that speed of focus is most important when viewing birds and butterflies in the same session, and needing to rack from five feet to infinity quickly; and that 8x32 bins can be the most useful.

If I understand them correctly, Lee Troubador

http://www.birdforum.net/showthread....71#post3581771

chooses the Zeiss Conquest HD 8x32, which you can easily try, for this purpose, and Alexis Powell

http://www.birdforum.net/showthread....13#post3508213

chooses the Zeiss Victory 8x32 FL. These seem to be out of production and are hard to find, but I think that CleySpy has a few left.

Later,

John
Agree. My only gripe is I don't see as many as I would like to. I trust part of that is down to my neighbourhood birds. A friendly Blackbird perches on an outside banister no more than a couple of feet from me at dusk sometimes and tilts his head as if he's showing me the fruits of his labour in his beak. More often than not there's a butterfly wing as well as worm and caterpillar.

We have a huge Buddlia behind us and are thinking of setting aside a small patch of ground and letting it go wild next season just for the butterflies and insects. Makes it sound like I'm Michael Eaves in Wiltshire but it's just a regular sized suburban garden I assure you.

Amazing little critters !

On focus gearing I guess compromises must be made in a one-size-fits-all configuration. However, who knows where this ends?

Maybe I'll be,'last seen' rooting round the jungles of Borneo and muttering to myself ten years from now. I can think of worse fates.

TM
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Old Saturday 24th June 2017, 23:43   #103
Themoog
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TM

Your point about different flavours of bins suiting different folks is spot on. I am sure you will find there a perfectly good or even stellar binos that you just don't bond with while others feel right in your hands and to your eyes the moment you look through them.

If they are to be your companions and long days out or even brief outings, they need to feel comfortable in the broadest possible sense of that word.

The Bird Fair is a fantastic event and well worth the trip. Some of the stands can get very busy and sometimes it can be hard to settle down with a pair of bins to really get to grips with them. But sometimes you can do this and even if its mega busy you can pick up and get a feel for so many models you can at least decide on a short list to follow up on at a dealers.

Good luck Lee
Thanks Troubador. Maybe the best approach is to go with no expectations and see what crops up. As long as I don't come back with a state-of-the-art digiscoping rig, a Manfrotto tripod and sign away six months of my life digging drainage ditches on a Kibutz I'm happy. A little pocket guide to common British insects, a pint of local hooch, a look through a mk.III EDG or a Trinovid HD (..... well who knows right? might be nice). Maybe even some quality porros. Also a failsafe/backstop for EDG and MHG if my endeavours come to nothing in the meantime.(trade stand tab on Birdfair website that doesn't work for me notwithstanding)

I just gotta try 'em both.

Good time of year to find more of that saturation I'm looking for too. Blame it on too many years trying to replicate National Geographic's stop-and-a-half pushed Kodak/Fuji/Agfa chrome richness.

Maybe some flora and fauna I haven't seen yet.

All the best

TM
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Old Sunday 25th June 2017, 12:55   #104
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Thanks Troubador. Maybe the best approach is to go with no expectations and see what crops up. As long as I don't come back with a state-of-the-art digiscoping rig, a Manfrotto tripod and sign away six months of my life digging drainage ditches on a Kibutz I'm happy. A little pocket guide to common British insects, a pint of local hooch, a look through a mk.III EDG or a Trinovid HD (..... well who knows right? might be nice). Maybe even some quality porros. Also a failsafe/backstop for EDG and MHG if my endeavours come to nothing in the meantime.(trade stand tab on Birdfair website that doesn't work for me notwithstanding)

I just gotta try 'em both.

Good time of year to find more of that saturation I'm looking for too. Blame it on too many years trying to replicate National Geographic's stop-and-a-half pushed Kodak/Fuji/Agfa chrome richness.

Maybe some flora and fauna I haven't seen yet.

All the best

TM
TM

Come in boots in case it rains and gets muddy. If it stays sunny there are usually at least one species of damselfly and two or three species of dragonflies around. The book shops are usually good and offer discounts too.

Lee
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Old Sunday 25th June 2017, 16:30   #105
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TM

Come in boots in case it rains and gets muddy. If it stays sunny there are usually at least one species of damselfly and two or three species of dragonflies around. The book shops are usually good and offer discounts too.

Lee
Cheers T

I'm looking forward to it already

Something nice to aim for

TM
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Old Tuesday 27th June 2017, 04:36   #106
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As always Chuck, you make good sense.

I don't know why,for example, I hadn't considered the EDG. I really like the allbinos site. A few glitches with their comparison tool, at least with my hardware, but a consistent waymark nonetheless. Love it or hate it, you have to respect it.

I guess the EDG didn't figure until now as, has been mentioned, they're showing their age a little in terms of specification and were I a stock buyer looking at the graphs I would hazard a guess that Nikon is either going to pull out of that pure alpha market or come out with something in the next 12-18 months that sets the bar so high that the big three Europeans go back to the drawing board scatching their heads.


As a snapshot though, and by your own reckoning, is the EDG a better allround $1300 bin than the MHG is a $900 bin?
IMO the EDG is still a good $2000 binocular in most aspects. Optically it's still among the best regardless of its age. It's specs are right there with an SV of the same magnification. I would for sure rather have it than the MHG. BUT...one could have an 8X AND a 10X MHG for the price of one EDG...now THAT I'd rather HAVE!
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Old Tuesday 27th June 2017, 17:18   #107
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Thanks Chuck.

I may get a shot at some ELs next week. Maybe a real close look at whats going on with the NV's focus wheel too. Maybe some MHG's thereafter. EDGs may have to wait for Birdfair.

It's a little frustrating.

No shortage of demos in the 100-400 Nikon range. Makes sense. There's always a reason.

Maybe I'm a little behind the times. Bricks and mortar is probably a very 20th C idea to many. I'm perhaps a little old fashioned. I like being a little old fashioned in this regard though.

Thanks again for taking all the pieces and throwing them in the air again Chuck.

Yes, of course EDG is up there alongside the specs of the alphas. Don't know what I was thinking. The housing no doubt divides opinion. Me? I love it. Rubber armour? Batman's glove compartment in the Batmobile. Not keen on the polished gold but that's Nikons brand ident. Its part of the deal. Matt frosted black would have been a nice touch though.

Now there's an image. Batman crouching in a collapsable hide looking for Kingfishers. Ha ha - barmy British weather. Apologies from a sleep deprived Moog. Was up at four am with just three hours under my belt. First rays of sun and I revert to Carribean time. I wouldn't mind but I haven't even had the pleasure of visiting !
Who knows?

Worth it though as the little garden critters were already going about their business in some numbers.
Anyway. No harm done and hope I raise the odd chuckle.

All the best

TM
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