[FIELDBIRD]

Minox porros are amazing for 370 dollars. I compared them to 500 to 700 (Minox, Pentax, Vortex, Bushnell) dollars roof bins and have found nothing that comes close. The new Minox roof 8.5 x43 HG is nothing wonderful, trust me. I have heard of the Nikon SE 8x32 REPUTATION, has anyone compared them optically to the MINOX. I know the SE has an amazing reputation but not waterproof and rubber eyecups. The minox focus knob is slow but very smooth and wonderful. Minox close focus is 13 feet, eye relief and field of view are limited, but I wear glasses and have no trouble. I have not had a chance to compare the two but may be tempted to save buy an SE and compare. The view of a porro prism is austounding in comparison to roof prisms. I can't believe bins can look this good for such a price has any one had a chance to look at the SWift porro ED? The field of view and eye relief sound great!

Any one have info on more porro wonders?

[Pinewood]

Originally Posted by FIELDBIRD

Any one have info on more porro wonders?

Dear Fieldbird,

Indeed, try to find the now discontinued Nikon 8x30 EII. 8.8º field of view, altough not sharp to the edges. Myself and a few others prefer it to the SE. You may not like its rubber surface, which sometimes peels, its rubber eyecups, its less than generous eye relief or its small size. All standard design Porro binoculars are harder to focus than binoculars with internal focussing.

Of the SE, I have been very critical. Now that I sold mine, I will simply write that not everyone finds it suitable. However, most users do not suffer from blackouts or they accomodate themselves to the Se, which is why it has such a reputation.

The Swift 8.5x44 is optically superb but it has bridge which can flex, making it difficult for both tubes to stay in focus without frequent adjustments of the dioptre setting.

You simply have to try them yourself. What works for you may not work for me.

Happy bird watching,
Arthur

[mayoayo]

Originally Posted by FIELDBIRD

Minox porros are amazing for 370 dollars. I compared them to 500 to 700 (Minox, Pentax, Vortex, Bushnell) dollars roof bins and have found nothing that comes close. The new Minox roof 8.5 x43 HG is nothing wonderful, trust me. I have heard of the Nikon SE 8x32 REPUTATION, has anyone compared them optically to the MINOX. I know the SE has an amazing reputation but not waterproof and rubber eyecups. The minox focus knob is slow but very smooth and wonderful. Minox close focus is 13 feet, eye relief and field of view are limited, but I wear glasses and have no trouble. I have not had a chance to compare the two but may be tempted to save buy an SE and compare. The view of a porro prism is austounding in comparison to roof prisms. I can't believe bins can look this good for such a price has any one had a chance to look at the SWift porro ED? The field of view and eye relief sound great!

Any one have info on more porro wonders?

Hi there.....i have compared ED and non ED versions of the SWIFT audubons,#804 and #820....very good glasses both,not very expensive and achieving real good optic quality........mechanichs are not the best in the #820 ...not faulty,but that have design flaws here and there,
(you can also accept this fact and be really satisfied ,they are not expensive anyway)their BIG point is the 8.5˚ FOV and SHARP ,CLEAR ,EASE view

[ceasar]

As long as we are giving praise to porro prism binoculars we would be derelict in out duty not to put in a word or two about what is IMHO (and admittedly limited experience) optically the finest binocular ever made! I am writing here, of course, about what will inevitably become the legendary Nikon 10 x 42 SE! Meanwhile, let us hope that Nikon continues to make them for a while before retiring them to the binocular Hall of Fame! I am not going to review them here, there are already too many reviews on record raving about them. Suffice it to say that they can only be described in superlatives! Their best review is in www.betterviewdesired.com where they are given the rating of Reference Standard for high power birding binoculars. This review is a masterpiece of understatement and is highly recommended reading. If you get a chance to try them out, take them outside for a period of time, relax and enjoy the view! You will find it hard to believe that they only have a 6 degree FOV. Their brightness and sharpness is simply stunning. I have seen the term "jawdropping" used in describing their view. It is quite apt.

Cordially,
Bob

[Sailcat]

I am fortunate enough to own the Nikon 8x30 EII and 10x42SE. Both are excellent binoculars, although neither is perfect. Still, I enjoy using them often despite blackouts in the SE or the odd way in which the EII dangles on its neckstrap. There are indeed other fine porros available in this roof prism crazy world, and it appears Fieldbird has discovered another keeper.

[Tero]

There are quite a lot of decent porros out there. I was initially turned off porrs by Bushnell 10x and 16x I saw at Wal Mart. I had the 16x for a while, thinking I could get away with no scope. It took me a year or two to get back to porros. But I still have not found the ideal 10x porro in my price class, and with a good less than 20ft close focus. But I am happy with my 10x roof prisms. Some day I may find a 9x porro I like, I am now using 9x Travelite, but FOV is too small.

[FIELDBIRD]

Originally Posted by Pinewood

Dear Fieldbird,

Indeed, try to find the now discontinued Nikon 8x30 EII. 8.8º field of view, altough not sharp to the edges. Myself and a few others prefer it to the SE. You may not like its rubber surface, which sometimes peels, its rubber eyecups, its less than generous eye relief or its small size. All standard design Porro binoculars are harder to focus than binoculars with internal focussing.

Of the SE, I have been very critical. Now that I sold mine, I will simply write that not everyone finds it suitable. However, most users do not suffer from blackouts or they accomodate themselves to the Se, which is why it has such a reputation.

The Swift 8.5x44 is optically superb but it has bridge which can flex, making it difficult for both tubes to stay in focus without frequent adjustments of the dioptre setting.

You simply have to try them yourself. What works for you may not work for me.

Happy bird watching,
Arthur

I found a pair of old Nikon E 8x30s at a photo store they want 214 dollars for them. Is this a good deal? They told me they retailed for 500 or 600 dollars their view is quite wonderful but they are not waterproof and what will happen when they need repair since they are so old and discontinued? I have not compared the Minox to Nikon E but will. Sounds like the Swifts may give me trouble but I have fallen in love with Porro views.

Thanks for the info.

[imac]

Do you not like the Swift 8.5x44 they are quite good especially in woodland and such. I would not go back to 10x again but this is of course a totaly different set of eyes and we all have our own preferences..

[chartwell99]

Originally Posted by FIELDBIRD

I found a pair of old Nikon E 8x30s at a photo store they want 214 dollars for them. Is this a good deal? They told me they retailed for 500 or 600 dollars their view is quite wonderful but they are not waterproof and what will happen when they need repair since they are so old and discontinued? I have not compared the Minox to Nikon E but will. Sounds like the Swifts may give me trouble but I have fallen in love with Porro views.

Thanks for the info.

There is actually very little difference optically between the 8 x 30 E and the 8 x 30 EII. Both are based on the 1954 Carl Zeiss 8 x 30, and offer wonderfully bright and contrasty wide field views. If the 8 x 30s you found are new old stock, the price is very fair and Nikon's warranty will protect the binocular for the next 25 years. If used, I think you can find a newer used EII for less money.

[FIELDBIRD]

Originally Posted by imac

Do you not like the Swift 8.5x44 they are quite good especially in woodland and such. I would not go back to 10x again but this is of course a totaly different set of eyes and we all have our own preferences..

I have not used the Swifts. They just sounded like the diopeter adjustment may be a problem. Has Swift remedied their problem? I would think with ED glass and porro prism Swift would have an amazing view.

[ceasar]

Originally Posted by FIELDBIRD

I have not used the Swifts. They just sounded like the diopeter adjustment may be a problem. Has Swift remedied their problem? I would think with ED glass and porro prism Swift would have an amazing view.

I also have a 1998 version of the Swift 8.5 x 44. (The current model is more streamlined.) Optically it is outstanding. It has a huge, bright FOV, almost as big as the FOV of my Nikon 8 x 30 EII. I had no problem with it's diopter adjustment. My complaints concern it's short eye relief and general ergonomics. It doesn't have the same comfort in my hands as do the Nikon 10 x 42 SE's. The focus wheel is harder to reach and operate and I'm always fiddling with the IPD. However, there is a difference of about $550.00 in their respective costs, so I imagine that one could easily come to a satisfactory compromise with the Swift's ergonomics on that basis alone.

Bob

[henry link]

Originally Posted by chartwell99

There is actually very little difference optically between the 8 x 30 E and the 8 x 30 EII. Both are based on the 1954 Carl Zeiss 8 x 30, and offer wonderfully bright and contrasty wide field views. If the 8 x 30s you found are new old stock, the price is very fair and Nikon's warranty will protect the binocular for the next 25 years. If used, I think you can find a newer used EII for less money.

I agree with Chartwell that $200 is too much for a used 8x30 E. If the condition is good I might pay $75-$100 for an older one (1978-1990) with single layer coatings (purple reflections from the lenses) and maybe $125-150 for a newer multicoated pair (1990-1998?, green reflections). I paid $199 for a "refurbished" EII about a year ago.

I'll have to disaggree with Chartwell a bit about how closely the Nikons resemble each other and the Zeiss 8x30. The objective lenses appear to be the same in the two Nikons but, IMO, the EII eyepiece is considerably better. It has a wider field with less astigmatism and pincushion distortion. Externally the 8x30E resembles the Zeiss Oberkochen 8x30, but the optics are quite different. The Nikon uses a conventional cemented objective and 5 element, 3 group eyepiece similar to many other binoculars. The Zeiss 8x30 used an air spaced objective and an unusually complex 6 element, 4 group eyepiece.

[chartwell99]

Originally Posted by henry link

I'll have to disaggree with Chartwell a bit about how closely the Nikons resemble each other and the Zeiss 8x30. The objective lenses appear to be the same in the two Nikons but, IMO, the EII eyepiece is considerably better. It has a wider field with less astigmatism and pincushion distortion. Externally the 8x30E resembles the Zeiss Oberkochen 8x30, but the optics are quite different. The Nikon uses a conventional cemented objective and 5 element, 3 group eyepiece similar to many other binoculars. The Zeiss 8x30 used an air spaced objective and an unusually complex 6 element, 4 group eyepiece.

Henry is right, of course, on all counts although I did not know the differences between the Zeiss and the Nikons were that striking. I have owned two examples of the Zeiss 8 x 30 over the years and both were afflicted with yellow images which were caused (I am told) by the deteriorating Canada Balsam used as optical cement. I have a feeling that the Zeiss Oberkochen 8 x 30 with modern coatings and image neutral optical cement would still be an awesome binocular.

[henry link]

Chartwell,

Yes, my old Zeiss 8x30B shows the same yellow tint. The only cemented elements in the 8x30 or the 8x30B are two doublets in the eyepiece, which a good binocular tech ought to be able to re-cement. If Zeiss brought back the old porros (particularly the 60 degree AFOV 8x30B) unchanged except for T* coating I'd have my credit card out in a nanosecond.

Henry

[FIELDBIRD]

Hi Henry,

I was wondering is 200 dollars too much for a New but old in stock Nikon E8x30 they said the stock is from the 90's and the bins are fully multi coated. Which bins do you bird with the most?

Thanks

[henry link]

Fieldbird,

I would try to find an 8x30 EII first, which I think has better optics and much closer focus and shouldn't cost much more than that. The old E has rather long close focus, about 18-19' for me. I use a Zeiss 8x42 FL the most for birding, but there are a number of other binoculars that would do about as well.

Henry

[FIELDBIRD]

Originally Posted by henry link

Fieldbird,

I would try to find an 8x30 EII first, which I think has better optics and much closer focus and shouldn't cost much more than that. The old E has rather long close focus, about 18-19' for me. I use a Zeiss 8x42 FL the most for birding, but there are a number of other binoculars that would do about as well.

Henry

Hi Henry,

Thanks for the info. Went down to the photo store and brought the Minox porro 8x44 with me and compared it to the 8x30E. I found aside from the field of view. Minox is a better bin comfort wise, focus is smoother, waterproof, eyecups twist up and optically it might have a slightly sharper and just slightly brighter image. I would recommend the Minox bins for your master review but for someone on a budget my amateur eye seems to think it is a great bin and will compete and will beat several above their price range and reputation.

Thanks again.