has anyone compared Kowa and Swaro eyepieces? (1 Viewer)

I own a Swaro ATS 80 (current model) and lately I've had the opportunity to use it several times a week at local wetlands because kids enjoy heading out there for walks and the playgrounds...

I use the Swaro with the 25-50x eyepiece.

I've always found eye placement on this combination very finicky - very prone to kidney beaning and blackouts...

Previously I've put this down to just my lack of use and inexperience in getting used to the scope. However I'm still having the same issues now after using the scope almost daily for the last 4 months..

As such, i'm mildly considering the Kowa TSN-883 as a replacement. There's a couple of reasons for this....

- Seems to have a bigger range of photography accessories which are CHEAPER than the Swaro accessories
- The 1.6x extender allows me to push beyond 50x on those rare occasions when 50x just isn't enough.
- base eyepiece itself has the additional 60x zoom (on the TE-11WZ)

The swap isn't a given, its just a thought i've been entertaining for about a month now... but I have no access to a unit in Perth and none of the members of my birding group (or affiliated groups) have a Kowa with the TE-11WZ eyepiece so i'm just wondering if someone here has had an opportunity to try this combo and what their thoughts are, particularly with respect to a comparison with the Swaro 25-50?

thanks
Jeelan

Hi,

I've had some looks through an 883 with the wide zoom and it was most impressive. I noticed kidney-beaning at one occasion but it was because the owner wore glasses and I had forgotten to twist up the eyecup.

Regarding photo - the Swaro DCB II is very nice in my opinion...

It was so far the only scope which clearly bested my old Kowa with SDLv2 but so far I've been able to suppress the urge to upgrade ;-)

Joachim

safaridreaming said:

I own a Swaro ATS 80 (current model) and lately I've had the opportunity to use it several times a week at local wetlands because kids enjoy heading out there for walks and the playgrounds...

I use the Swaro with the 25-50x eyepiece.

I've always found eye placement on this combination very finicky - very prone to kidney beaning and blackouts...

Previously I've put this down to just my lack of use and inexperience in getting used to the scope. However I'm still having the same issues now after using the scope almost daily for the last 4 months..

As such, i'm mildly considering the Kowa TSN-883 as a replacement. There's a couple of reasons for this....

- Seems to have a bigger range of photography accessories which are CHEAPER than the Swaro accessories
- The 1.6x extender allows me to push beyond 50x on those rare occasions when 50x just isn't enough.
- base eyepiece itself has the additional 60x zoom (on the TE-11WZ)

The swap isn't a given, its just a thought i've been entertaining for about a month now... but I have no access to a unit in Perth and none of the members of my birding group (or affiliated groups) have a Kowa with the TE-11WZ eyepiece so i'm just wondering if someone here has had an opportunity to try this combo and what their thoughts are, particularly with respect to a comparison with the Swaro 25-50?

thanks
Jeelan

Click to expand...

The 883/TE-11WZ (25-60) combination is wonderful. Here's my summary.
Virtually no CA at all resutling in an extremely clean view.
Image is deadly sharp across the FOV all the way to 60X.
Dual focus beats any single focus I've tried.
Eye relief is excellent.
I think it's an unbeatable scope.

PS
I have not tried the extender but I have analyzed whether or not it would be useful to me. During much of the year, I find that 50-60X is where I start to lose some clarity due solely to atmospherics. I have a very good Nikon ED82 that goes to 75X, but the high magnification is only useful on those rare occasions when conditions are optimal. Based on reports I've read, the Kowa extender is excellent.

I used the Swaro ATS 65 with the 25-50 eyepiece (which i consider superior to the 20-60, mainly due to the FoV and i suspect more brightness through most of the range) for several years before buying the 883 and 25-60 eyepiece on announcement of the Brexit vote, and the expectation (apparently correct) of a sterling crash.
I wanted the 883 because (during a trip to Hungary) the comparison of a black-necked grebe view between the two was so amazingly more precise through the 883 (of a colleague).
The 883 + 25-60 eyepiece is about as good as it gets. I recently however picked up the post-anodising specks in the eyepiece and returned it to Kowa for cleaning (took 3 weeks). The retailer lent me a 20-60 older eyepiece, which i found inferior in all ways to the 25-60 WA. Seawatching became particularly difficult, although my gratitude for the loan is undiminished.
I have the extender too, but don't use it by default. There are circumstances in which it is very useful (estuary/saltmarsh/lake in good light conditions) but the FoV is reduced and the light drops off after about 80X (with the extender - which goes up to 96x).
It is my opinion that for most purposes, clarity, brightness and FoV are fairly critical factors. Magnification not so much, as most scopes drop off in terms of light gathering (obviously!) at their extremities.
I still have the Swaro, despite promising myself to sell it when the Kowa deal came off. I still use it, and still rate it very highly, although approaching the extremes of magnification, it falls away. It remains a versatile, light-weight set-up for good long walks, and i think i'd rather sell a kidney than get rid of it.
I still think that the mag range 30-40x is the most useful for most scopes, with extreme zoom-ins used for attempts at microscopic details. It's in this range that you really see the value of good glass, and i don't believe anyone does glass better than Kowa. Just look at the Genesis bins.
The only real rival to the Kowa 883 is the ATX 95, and in my opinion, the difference is not great enough to justify the extra cost and weight.
Just my two grand's worth!

All,

thanks for the feedback - the Kowa's sound like a pretty amazing scope..

Paddy - how do you find eye placement between the Kowa and the Swaro? do you find the Swaro more critical? The kowa any easier?

I'm surprised they are still having the anodising specs on the eyepiece issue - my understanding was that this was resolved...
how did Kowa resolve it and prevent it from reoccurring?

I have 100% confidence in Swarovksi Australia from an after sales service perspective but have no idea about Kowa's level or quality of service in Australia so that's probably another consideration that I need to account for...

cheers
Jeelan

Hi
I think Kowa has noted some of the less favourable remarks about their after-sales, at least in the UK/Europe. I was expecting an 8-week wait for the cleaning job, but it was back in 3.
As the specks issue is perhaps more common than the returns would suggest (i know at least 3 that are 'living with it'), i didn't want a replacement eyepiece - i wanted my one sorted out. Apparently after a cleaning, returns a second time are rare.
As far as eye placement is concerned, i always feel with the Swaro i could do with a couple of mm more on the eye relief; however, i often use both scopes with the eyepiece down, and hover just off it. It seems a little less 'squinty' that way, particularly if settling in for a long sea-watch.
It is much, much easier to pick up vignetting with scopes in general in my opinion - the tendency to try and look around within the view is common, and bins (generally) are more forgiving here. That's why i veer towards the widest angle i can get, and try to train myself to stay within it. A very responsive fluid tripod head is often the answer - look with the handle!

I had a chance to compare an new Swaro ATS-80 HD with the 25-50 W and my Kowa TSN-883 with 25-60x wide side by side.

I felt the Swaro was more pronounced in the kidney bean. Where it really became apparent is when I switched from eye to eye. I have had cataract surgery on one eye and the the kidney been effect was much more pronounced on the Swaro when I looked through my artificial lens. I have more astigmatism in the artificial lens so it may be related to that.

David