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Swarovski 8x32 EL & Nikon 8x32 SE what a combo! (2 Viewers)

I have mentioned before that I thought that this "focus problem" is designed into the binoculars focusing mechanism. It takes a little more effort to push the focuser with your forefinger, if you are right handed, than it does to pull it back. At least that's what it does on my 7 x 42 SLC. I have no problem with it. It seems that complaints about it don't come from all the users and I don't think the Austrian technicians are incompetent or sloppy in this particular aspect of the binoculars they design and build.

It made sense to me as soon as I got used to it after using my Nikon LXL's and my EDG which are extra smooth and extra fast in both directions and sometimes result in over shooting the object to be viewed.

Apparently Swarovski will rework the focusers if the owners don't like them. It must be an easy adjustment.

Bob
Bob, you make a good point. It would make for fine focusing easier, instead of over shooting like you say. But, then why is my el 8x32 perfectly smooth and damped in both direction's unlike what my slc 7x42 b was? I could have lived with the way it was but, now i feel it is smooth and precise and just a touch heavier than the el. Bryce...
 
Bob, you make a good point. It would make for fine focusing easier, instead of over shooting like you say. But, then why is my el 8x32 perfectly smooth and damped in both direction's unlike what my slc 7x42 b was? I could have lived with the way it was but, now i feel it is smooth and precise and just a touch heavier than the el. Bryce...

I don't know why. I don't have much experience with Swarovski. In addition to the 7 x 42B SLC I also have an 8 x 30 SLC which one focuses with one's ring finger and I don't think that anybody can focus too fast or overshoot that way!

I've never heard this specific complaint about the 32mm EL's but it has cropped up about the 42mm versions if my memory is correct.

Bob
 
I have mentioned before that I thought that this "focus problem" is designed into the binoculars focusing mechanism. It takes a little more effort to push the focuser with your forefinger, if you are right handed, than it does to pull it back. At least that's what it does on my 7 x 42 SLC. I have no problem with it. It seems that complaints about it don't come from all the users and I don't think the Austrian technicians are incompetent or sloppy in this particular aspect of the binoculars they design and build.

It made sense to me as soon as I got used to it after using my Nikon LXL's and my EDG which are extra smooth and extra fast in both directions and sometimes result in over shooting the object to be viewed.

Apparently Swarovski will rework the focusers if the owners don't like them. It must be an easy adjustment.

Bob

Bob,

I don't think the problem with the LXL's and EDG's focusers are that they are too "smooth," but that they are too "fast". I think those two characteristics need to be separated rather than taken together.

My SE focuses smoothly but not fast. The wheel turns evenly and precisely in both directions, and I have yet to overshoot my target. OTOH, the 8x32 LXL goes from cf to ∞ in less than 1/2 turn. That's faaaaaaaast!

As far your theory about why Swaro made the focuser turn harder in one direction than the other, I'm sure left handed people would be upset about another "righty world" favoritism. :)

l‘;;’l
 
Bob,

I don't think the problem with the LXL's and EDG's focusers are that they are too "smooth," but that they are too "fast". I think those two characteristics need to be separated rather than taken together.

My SE focuses smoothly but not fast. The wheel turns evenly and precisely in both directions, and I have yet to overshoot my target. OTOH, the 8x32 LXL goes from cf to ∞ in less than 1/2 turn. That's faaaaaaaast!

As far your theory about why Swaro made the focuser turn harder in one direction than the other, I'm sure left handed people would be upset about another "righty world" favoritism. :)

l‘;;’l

I said "extra" smooth, which I meant as a compliment. The SLC's focus wheel is also smooth but it does require slightly more effort to push it than pull it back. But I will admit that in the matter of focusing speed, going directly from an LXL to an SE and vice versa makes you wonder if the binoculars were really made by the same company.

As far as that sinister conspiracy the world has against left handed people; my only suggestion is "Make the best of it!" Like Babe Ruth did. Or even my barber who learned how to cut hair with right handed scissors and is unable to use scissors made for left handed people.

Bob
 
Swaro will fix the crunchy harder to turn in one direction problem on the SV? I may send it back then, after migration of course. :t:

My regular el focus is fine. Same tension in both directions. Has a tad bit of slack, but fine. IMO nikon is king of the focus.

Indeed, it is a "bummer" that Swaro has not fully addressed this problem. I'm still hearing complaints about this from some SV ELs owners!

But it is reassuring to hear that the "crunchy focuser" (newfie's term) can be fixed. When EDG I's develop a focuser problem, Nikon just sends you an EDG II.

Still a mystery why some Swaro samples have to be sent to SONA to get their focusers tweaked. Is it spotty QC? Some flaw inherent in the focuser design?

Whatever it is, it's something Swaro has not been able to solve completely even with its newly designed bins.

I can only imagine that it is an inherent flaw that if removed would jeopardize some important feature (such as waterproofing) such that they have just come to live with the risk to gain the benefits.

B.
 
...
IMO nikon is king of the focus.

Long Live the King!

Of course, with the EDG I, Nikon was more like the Emperor's New Clothes. I hope that rush to market never happens again with any of their products.

The 8x32 LXL (and 10x32 LXL) turns smoothly all right, but the focusers turn too faaaast, IMO (< 1/2 turn cf to ∞).

The EDG I tried could have used a bit more tension, and my first 8x32 LX was a real "loosey goosey".

So Nikon might be the "king" but it's not a perfect king. I'd like to see their top roof focusers have a bit wider turning radius (1 1/2 turns) and a bit more tension in them.

My latest 8x32 SE has the fastest and smoothest focuser of any SE I've tried. If it weren't for the small and narrow focus wheel, it would be up there with the best of them.

B.
 
Long Live the King!

....................

The 8x32 LXL (and 10x32 LXL) turns smoothly all right, but the focusers turn too faaaast, IMO (< 1/2 turn cf to ∞).

The EDG I tried could have used a bit more tension, .........

So Nikon might be the "king" but it's not a perfect king. I'd like to see their top roof focusers have a bit wider turning radius (1 1/2 turns) and a bit more tension in them.
.............

B.

I think you may find some changes with the Nikon EDG II that are closer to your liking. I am basing that on a small sampling of my 8X32 EDG II, my brother's 10X42 EDG II and an EDG I demo.

Travel: Travel of the 8X32 EDG II from close focus to infinity (when wearing my eye glasses) is approximately 3/4 of a turn. Not the 1 1/2 turn you wanted, but better than < 1/2 turn. I have no problem with overshooting the focus adjustment. Full travel is about a turn and 1/8th and rotation from close focus to infinity is clockwise.

Tension: I have only handled one EDG I, a 10X32 demo. I also thought the tension was on the light side. The tension on the two EDG II units are noticeably stiffer than the EDG I demo. Actually, they could be just a touch lighter. I can tell no difference in the tension and feel of the two EDG II units.

Have you had a chance to handle an EDG II yet? If so, did you notice the same things I did? My sample size is small, so my observations may not be the same overall for the product line. However, I am thinking the EDG II is the new improved King when it comes to the focus mechanism.
 
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crunchy... too fast...bit of slack...inconsistent tension...

You guys pay EXTRA for alphas?!

;-)

Not as smooth in one direction. See my review in the swaro forum. If you only bought one SV and had no others you probably wouldn't notice. Hopefully whistle blower posts like these will call swaro out and fix it. The focus is too slow as well.
Other than that it is probably the best glass out there.

If people had to look through the focus, it would be a problem. Fortunately the views are very impressive. But I agree the prices are insane.
 
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crunchy... too fast...bit of slack...inconsistent tension...

You guys pay EXTRA for alphas?!

;-)
You're hearing complaints from folks that would bemoan the color of ink on a billion dollar lottery check. The Swarovision focus works as well as any other alpha (including Nikons), the view from 15' to infinity is half a turn and the view is...stunning.

PS
The close focus image is the best I've seen due to razor sharp edges.
 
I agree Brock. My EDG I is so easy to turn it is deceiving. Feels like it is not locked down, but it is. No diopter drift though.

Long Live the King!

Of course, with the EDG I, Nikon was more like the Emperor's New Clothes. I hope that rush to market never happens again with any of their products.

The 8x32 LXL (and 10x32 LXL) turns smoothly all right, but the focusers turn too faaaast, IMO (< 1/2 turn cf to ∞).

The EDG I tried could have used a bit more tension, and my first 8x32 LX was a real "loosey goosey".

So Nikon might be the "king" but it's not a perfect king. I'd like to see their top roof focusers have a bit wider turning radius (1 1/2 turns) and a bit more tension in them.

My latest 8x32 SE has the fastest and smoothest focuser of any SE I've tried. If it weren't for the small and narrow focus wheel, it would be up there with the best of them.

B.
 
crunchy... too fast...bit of slack...inconsistent tension...

You guys pay EXTRA for alphas?!

;-)

I'am still not convinced of the notion of bad foccuser's on Swaro's! When i mean bad it's freeplay, slack, gritty or ratchety these are deal breakers! A little hard to turn oneway? If it's precise with good dampening enough said! I would rather have a lttle heavy dampening then not enough! Does that still make Nikon king? I mean i like Nikon's top glass but, come on man! :) Bryce...
 
I'am still not convinced of the notion of bad foccuser's on Swaro's! When i mean bad it's freeplay, slack, gritty or ratchety these are deal breakers! A little hard to turn oneway? If it's precise with good dampening enough said! I would rather have a lttle heavy dampening then not enough! Does that still make Nikon king? I mean i like Nikon's top glass but, come on man! :) Bryce...

Bryce,

Join the club, the Swaro Deniers Club, that is. :)

If I received $10 every time Nikon has been touted on BF as having the best focusers in the biz over the past two years, I would have enough money to pay retail price for an EDG II!

You've been on BF since 2008, you must have read at least some of those comments. I can't remember any posts touting Swaro as having the best focusers in the industry.

On the contrary, since the SV EL came out, I've read a number of complaints about how slow the focuser is at close distance. So add that to the list.

At least you admit that your focuser turns harder in one direction. Some won't even admit to that who have bins with that issue. But for you, it's just not a problem.

You're are not alone in that, others find it's not an issue for them either, however, you are the first person that said the focuser turning harder in one direction is actually advantageous for right handed birders. I'm going to need to create a new category in my poll! :)

I think one's degree of tolerance to this characteristic (which, mind you, is not found in all Swaro samples) might not only depend on one's sensitivity to it, but also on one's birding style.

I do a lot of close-in birding, so I need a focuser that turns smoothly and not at a pokey pace (though not too fast either).

Pulling or pushing hard on the focuser makes close-in birding a lot more laborious. For longer distances, where less focusing is required, it's not as bothersome.

However, it's not just that harder to turn in one direction characteristic that is a problem with Swaro focusers, there are also reports of " freeplay, slack, gritty or ratchety" focusers too. Fortunately, those reports seem to be less common.

I think the overall point that I made and others have made still stands. At this price point, alpha focusers should be more consistent and should turn equally smooth in both directions.

If Nikon can do it and Zeiss can do it, the Wizards of Absam could certainly do it. Why the don't is the question. Maybe lefties are rare in Austria. :)

Brock
 
Brock, i think it was Bob that said it works for righty's! : ) I will have to go back and look! It's not denial what i said was my 7x42 was when i bought it harder to turn ccw. I could have lived with it, no problem! Instead i sent it to Sona. Now it is perfect and precise and the same dampness in both directions still a little heavier than my el but, no quibbles! :) Speaking of the el, it's focus is butter, perfect i might add! My slc 8x30 was in all respects indentical to my se in dampness both ways and was this way when it got cold! These are my experiences mind you and yes i have read a many of post on the subject! I acctually had posted some time ago on a thread started by Dennis! It was something to the fact that it is unfortunate when somebody pays for a higher end bino and it isn't to there satisfaction (focusser)! That said sona can and will take care of it! It's not a deal breaker! Do i think it's acceptable, no but i also think if your going to invest that kind of caching you better go to a reputable dealer and try it out! If not you take a chance on getting something subpar be it s,l,z,n whatever! Maybe i'm lucky?!!! 1 outta 3 isn't bad and like i said they smoothed the focus right out on the 7x! And yes i did handle the 7x to so i knew about it being a little harder to turn ccw. What i have been getting at has been missed and i think alot of people get miss information when they read posts regarding these issues. When infact they might choose something else not knowing any better and miss out on fine optics! : ) I mean we are a curious breed here are we not? So where does that leave us? I'll admit you don't have the nay sayers in the Nikon, Zeiss camps! But, my Swaro's have excellent foccusers and there is nothing you can do about it! Besides when all is said and done, it's all about the VIEW!!! Bryce... Swaro pro focusser's!
 
Bryce,

Your post was encouraging. I've seen some good deal on Swaros (SLCs) but passed because I thought I might get stuck with a harder to turn in one direction focuser or a coarse one or whatever. I figured SONA could fix the bad problems, but I wasn't sure if the harder to turn one way was an issue that some people were just unaware of even when their bin had it (just like some people don't see RB) and that it would be something I had to live with or if it too was an issue that SONA could be resolved.

Now that I see it is, I'm more likely to buy a Swaro in the future, if I can afford one! The prices just keep getting higher and higher. I'll have to buy a "pre-owned" one for sure.

Same deal with pre-owned Leicas before the Goodwill Service, and even now that I heard that Ron is getting billed for a defect in his BN. When they put in an elastic clause that they reserve the right to not service any bin, that's too capricious for me. With Nikon I'm guaranteed that new or used, if I have a problem, any problem, it will be addressed with a repair or replacement. So I don't see me ever buying a Leica even if I tried a used sample I leiced.

Swaro and Nikon have reliable warranty policies. I wasn't sure about Swaro after they announced they changed their repair policy, but I wrote them and got a response that was posted in the sticky warranty thread that assured me that I would be taken care of if I bought a used Swaro, and it was defective or developed a defect later.

Despite my griping about the focusers, I'm on board with Swaro. In fact, I wouldn't gripe if I didn't care.
 
Bryce,

Your post was encouraging. I've seen some good deal on Swaros (SLCs) but passed because I thought I might get stuck with a harder to turn in one direction focuser or a coarse one or whatever. I figured SONA could fix the bad problems, but I wasn't sure if the harder to turn one way was an issue that some people were just unaware of even when their bin had it (just like some people don't see RB) and that it would be something I had to live with or if it too was an issue that SONA could be resolved.

Now that I see it is, I'm more likely to buy a Swaro in the future, if I can afford one! The prices just keep getting higher and higher. I'll have to buy a "pre-owned" one for sure.

Same deal with pre-owned Leicas before the Goodwill Service, and even now that I heard that Ron is getting billed for a defect in his BN. When they put in an elastic clause that they reserve the right to not service any bin, that's too capricious for me. With Nikon I'm guaranteed that new or used, if I have a problem, any problem, it will be addressed with a repair or replacement. So I don't see me ever buying a Leica even if I tried a used sample I leiced.

Swaro and Nikon have reliable warranty policies. I wasn't sure about Swaro after they announced they changed their repair policy, but I wrote them and got a response that was posted in the sticky warranty thread that assured me that I would be taken care of if I bought a used Swaro, and it was defective or developed a defect later.

Despite my griping about the focusers, I'm on board with Swaro. In fact, I wouldn't gripe if I didn't care.
:t:
 
Brock, I see you as the bird forum historian, you do a great job of maintaining coherence and tallies.

I agree the review should be honest, not personal and more critical as the price goes into the stratosphere. Don't get me wrong I love swaro and own two. But I will be honest and don't take it personal when someone attacks something I own. There is no perfect glass every one I own or have used has a drawback.

That being said I love optics of all prices and I respect members reviews, opinions and joys. Like Brock said in another post, it is fine to disagree respectfully. Best test of glass, the holistic test, try it, feel it don't analyze it, then enjoy it. 8-P

Bryce,

Join the club, the Swaro Deniers Club, that is. :)

If I received $10 every time Nikon has been touted on BF as having the best focusers in the biz over the past two years, I would have enough money to pay retail price for an EDG II!

You've been on BF since 2008, you must have read at least some of those comments. I can't remember any posts touting Swaro as having the best focusers in the industry.

On the contrary, since the SV EL came out, I've read a number of complaints about how slow the focuser is at close distance. So add that to the list.

At least you admit that your focuser turns harder in one direction. Some won't even admit to that who have bins with that issue. But for you, it's just not a problem.

You're are not alone in that, others find it's not an issue for them either, however, you are the first person that said the focuser turning harder in one direction is actually advantageous for right handed birders. I'm going to need to create a new category in my poll! :)

I think one's degree of tolerance to this characteristic (which, mind you, is not found in all Swaro samples) might not only depend on one's sensitivity to it, but also on one's birding style.

I do a lot of close-in birding, so I need a focuser that turns smoothly and not at a pokey pace (though not too fast either).

Pulling or pushing hard on the focuser makes close-in birding a lot more laborious. For longer distances, where less focusing is required, it's not as bothersome.

However, it's not just that harder to turn in one direction characteristic that is a problem with Swaro focusers, there are also reports of " freeplay, slack, gritty or ratchety" focusers too. Fortunately, those reports seem to be less common.

I think the overall point that I made and others have made still stands. At this price point, alpha focusers should be more consistent and should turn equally smooth in both directions.

If Nikon can do it and Zeiss can do it, the Wizards of Absam could certainly do it. Why the don't is the question. Maybe lefties are rare in Austria. :)

Brock
 
I know i read this somewhere on another thread about using the 8x32 se and a doubler. So i have been using my 8x32 el with a doubler! I have always read that using doublers with bino's brings the image quality down to almost unuseable?! That said i had a chance a little over a yr ago to try a demo with my 7x42 slc of the swaro doubler. I was so impressed at the quality of image i bought one at a closeout price! :) I have been using it with bino on tripod and really liked the setup but, only used it on occasions and really couldn't get along hand held. It gave a nice 14x view that gave me that little added reach when needed and i didn't have to tote the scope just carried a light carbon tripod! Now rewind or fast forward to using the little el and doubler combo! I can hand hold this setup and make it work, now i have to have a rest of some sort. The image is stunning, bright, highly resolved color correct! It's acctually made me question the use of a scope?!!! Setup is a little cubersome, it's like changing an ep on a scope but, very easy to hand hold and at 16x gives alot of mag for indentifying things. Now before i'm beheaded for the remark about the scope just here me out a little. If i'm hiking around i only have to tote the little el, doubler and maybe my hiking stick(monopod) which is optional. The doubler fit's in my vest that's it! Alot more portable less weight and plenty of mag for indentification purposes! Now for my, shorebird and whale watching there is no question i will use a scope, then again setup is never far from the vehicle! Swarovski designed there doubler to be used with there binoculars, don't think they can be used with other brands! It screws in place of one eyecup and has the same twistup style as the eyecups on the binoculars
 
I know i read this somewhere on another thread about using the 8x32 se and a doubler. So i have been using my 8x32 el with a doubler! I have always read that using doublers with bino's brings the image quality down to almost unuseable?! That said i had a chance a little over a yr ago to try a demo with my 7x42 slc of the swaro doubler. I was so impressed at the quality of image i bought one at a closeout price! :) I have been using it with bino on tripod and really liked the setup but, only used it on occasions and really couldn't get along hand held. It gave a nice 14x view that gave me that little added reach when needed and i didn't have to tote the scope just carried a light carbon tripod! Now rewind or fast forward to using the little el and doubler combo! I can hand hold this setup and make it work, now i have to have a rest of some sort. The image is stunning, bright, highly resolved color correct! It's acctually made me question the use of a scope?!!! Setup is a little cubersome, it's like changing an ep on a scope but, very easy to hand hold and at 16x gives alot of mag for indentifying things. Now before i'm beheaded for the remark about the scope just here me out a little. If i'm hiking around i only have to tote the little el, doubler and maybe my hiking stick(monopod) which is optional. The doubler fit's in my vest that's it! Alot more portable less weight and plenty of mag for indentification purposes! Now for my, shorebird and whale watching there is no question i will use a scope, then again setup is never far from the vehicle! Swarovski designed there doubler to be used with there binoculars, don't think they can be used with other brands! It screws in place of one eyecup and has the same twistup style as the eyecups on the binoculars
Personally it gives me the best of both worlds and every thing is better than what i had hoped for when i purchased the baby el! I like the idea of it screwing on not pushing over the eyecup and as rar as i can tell? No degrading of image! I'am now a pro-doubler user and i'm loving it! Bryce...
 
Personally it gives me the best of both worlds and every thing is better than what i had hoped for when i purchased the baby el! I like the idea of it screwing on not pushing over the eyecup and as rar as i can tell? No degrading of image! I'am now a pro-doubler user and i'm loving it! Bryce...

Ok, there is a little degradation of the image as far as brightness compared to the 42 in dim lighting! To be expected for such a small aperature! No biggy i still like the combo and will use it alot!
 
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