Zeiss Victory 8x32FL Vs Leica Trinovid 8x32BN ramblings (1 Viewer)

Hi, this is my first post here and I have really enjoyed reading this thread. I really enjoy using binoculars and am in the lucky position to have a few pairs.
Leitz 10x40 B Trinovid ( Portugal). Leica 8x40 Ultravid non HD. Zeiss 10x40 BGAT and the new FL 8x32 LT zeiss.
The new FLs are really fantastic but took a while to get used to. I wear Zeiss varifocal specs for astigmatism and initially I thought that the FL collimation was out when I viewed through the very top part of my specs. Took me ages to realize that I needed to looks through the sweet spot of my specs to get the best from the FL. and they really are astounding when this is done. Like the other contributor in this thread, I have never seemed to have this problem with the Leica or BGAT. So it does look as though the positioning of the optics relative to the pupils is quite important.

The next surprise is that the BGAT which are the T P still perform superbly and look just as bright as the FL . I am sure that technically the FL will be better, but in reality it is just so difficult to notice much difference. The Leica Ultravids are beautifully made but now feel on the heavy side and don't seem to offer much benefit over the lighter FL Zeiss. When out walking I always take the FL due to its light weight and brilliant close focus. I do not like the way the body seems to rattle if tapped with a finger. I know there is a plastic sealing ring around the central bridge that can rattle, but this is the mechanism inside the bins that appears to make the noise. They certainly dont have the tank like feel of the old BGAT but they are much lighter to use which is good.

As for the old Trinovids. Well they are jus a work of art with their Uppendahl prisms and elegant shape. They are light and still have a crisp image, but there is a faint yellowy cast compared with the others. Does it make a difference. Well in my view (sic) not very much. When perched on a Tripod it is possible to see all the same detail in twilight as with the same magnification BGAT, but not quite as bright. Main downfall is the poor by modern standards close focus.

They are all wonderful binocs and each has a place. The most used pair will undoubtedly be the new FL Zeiss. They really do deliver. As for the Lotutech ( awful name) well it seems to attract dust pretty well and appears not to work brilliantly with light drizzle, but if there is a real downpour then the water does indeed run off. Not that this helps since I cAn not see much through my specs in these conditions Anyway. I am gradually coming to the conclusion that the law of diminishing returns is working well and that since the advent of phase coating there is little to choose between al of the top manufacturers. Subtle
differences to be sure, but nothing to stop one enjoying any of these top offerings.
Regards to all
Roger

Roger,
Welcome to the forum, and thank you for your enjoyable first contribution.

It is my understanding that the Leitz was not phase coated, but there is a considerable difference of opinion on whether it makes much difference. It is a beautiful design, and I'm glad that you can still enjoy it. The latest thing is always very cool of course. But there is also a lot of enjoyment is appreciating how we got here.

Yes, Lotutech might be the worst of the three by a small margin, but Swarotop and Aquadur don't exactly roll of the tongue either!

Ron

Hi Ron,
Thanks for your comments. You are quite correct regarding the Leitz Trinovids. They did not have any phase coating. The main benefit with these Trinovids is the compact size and beautifully smooth focussing. This is an area wher I think Leica have let things slip. I have never had a problem with the original Trinovid focussin going too stiff in the cold or loose n the heat. The Dialyts do not focus quite as smoothly but they are very robust. The latest FL have perhaps the sweetest focussing action in my view and they are so quick to move from close focus to infinity.
As for magnification, well I am a bit stuck with this. If you can get a good rest or use a tripod with the 10x then they seem to bring a lot more detail to the show. However I do find them harder to hand hold really steady to look at fine detail when compared to the 8x. Hence the reason why we must all have a selection of magnifications ?
On reading within this forum I am realizing that there are some extremely knowledgable contributors and I am enjoying tapping into the combined wisdom.
The subject of contrast versus image quality does interest me and is the main area of difference between the older and newer binocs.

I have not been an avid bird watcher until fairly recently since retiring. I do however enjoy looking at life through enhanced vision especially when I am at the coast and can enjoy looking at shipping and life on the waves.
The quality of light up here in Scotland can be spectacular and the view from good binocs is a real joy.
Good to know that I might not be the only binocularaholic.

I'm trying to cut down honestly

Roger

The older style eyecups arrived today. Again great service by Zeiss!!

They appear to me to be made of the same materials as the new style and only the styling seems different. Square vs round. I prefer the style of these older cups and will use them from now on. They look neater to me.

It may be because these eyecups are brand new but to me there is a more positive 'click' both soundwise and feelwise at the different pull out stages than the newer rounded style. This gives me more confidence and I honestly feel I am getting a better view now. Even though they appear to pull out to just the same distance I feel I like the older style better somehow. The rainguard fits the old just as well as the new and works just as well.

This morning I have been watching adult Carrion Crows and Jackdaws feeding their fledgelings on a wild cherry tree outside my window about 30ft away. I have to say again that the view through these Zeiss 8x32 T* FL bins is truly astonishing. You could look through them all day long.

Here are a few pics for your information: I have fitted the the old stlye eyecup to the left barrel and the pics show fully in and fully out. The 1st 2 photos show the eyecups side by side on table in the open and closed positions (pic1 old style on right open and pic 2 on left closed, new stlye open in both).

a few more eyecup pics. No 1 shows both old style from different sides in fully closed position. No 2 shows old syle on right new style on left from rear (this one shows how the older style seem to have a greater width of flatter rubber across the rear section maybe this is what gives me a better view by leaving less room for light to sneek in from behind or the side? just a thought). No 3 shows bins with eyecups removed totally just for interest.

Hi Riecl welcome to the forum

Thanks for your very interesting input to this thread, makes great reading. Don't mind ronh he's a screwed up crazy stargazer Alien hunter type out there in Los Alomos New Mexico, I think he gets too much Sun sometimes! He's watched exotic Mexicans dancing round Capercaillie out there in the sand. Ha Ha Ha........only kidding ronh. No honestly ronh knows his stuff when it comes to optics and should be listened to, he has much experience.

I am beginning to see now, you have said so too, that many folks think that the Zeiss 8x32FL take a bit of getting used to. I must admit I didn't anticipate this when I bought them, I just assumed, naturally, but in hindsight, naively, that they would be clearly superior in all respects to the Leica given the massive price difference.

You said "So it does look as though the positioning of the optics relative to the pupils is quite important". You are sure right there Sir. I never imagined that two bins of so similar spec on paper from two super premium manufacturers could give a user such a different experience in practice. Just goes to show what they say is true, we should all try before we buy!! You also said about the Zeiss 'they really are astounding'. I agree 100%. Once you get used to them (I am currently in this phase) they are truly special. I am looking at getting the Nikon 8x42 EDG (will try em out first this time) when I can afford them, but these Zeiss 8x32 FL's will be keepers for life.

P.S. I see you are from Fife. My Brother has a house in Pittenweem, by Anstruther. Whenever I'm through there I have tried for Green Woodpecker and Corn Bunting but to date have had no luck, any tips on good spots in Fife for these two? I've been up to Tentsmuir Forest and Fife Ness etc and had Long Tailed Duck and loads of Grey seals on the sandbanks. (I always end up in the LarachMohr Pub down at the harbour in Pittenweem when I go through to Fife, always get gubbed at pool by the fishermen too, maybe my pupils get so small the next day that's why I can see nowt!?) Ha Ha

Cheers
Brendan

Hi Brendan, Thanks for your post. I am up in not so sunny Crudden Bay this week enjoying trying to identify as many birds as possible. Despite being a bit of a binocular addict, I confess to being fairly new to the birdwatching scene. In fact I am finding it quite difficu
T at this stage to identify many of the brown small birds since the illustrations in the books never seem to look exactly the same as what I seem to be looking at. I suspect that it would be a good idea to join some group in order to get a bit of mentoring in what to look for. I have the Collings New Generation Guide of Birds of Britain and Europe and also the Collins. Book of Scottish birds along with the Readers Digest Book of British birds. This latter book seems to be the best help so far.

What I have noticed is that the more I look the more I discover what is going on with all the wildlife around me. In fact some areas that appeawr really quiet, are actually teeming with wildlife when the time is taken to just watch.
I find that I am using the Zeiss FL more and More and they have now replaced my Ultravid as the daily binocular. I have set up my Zeiss BGAT on a tripod and they are great for seeing detail. Where I live in a small village just by Cupar, there is lots to see.

Could it be possible to spot a snow bunting on the coast up here at this time of year, cos that is what I think I have seen yesterday along with some Eider ducks and the usual seals and life up here.

Regards

Roger

Hawke cheap Chinese shocker!

Update.......Controversy!!

Today I purchased a Hawke Frontier ED MKII. 8x43. Brand new £257.50 delivered.

German Zeiss 8x32FL v cheap Chinese 8x43 EDII (£1199 (cheapest new) Vs £257.50)

Apples and Oranges of course. (8x32 vs 8x43)

Some quick ramblings re the 8x43.....if anyone is interested on this thread about cheap bins..

Eyecup mechanics and quality, rubber cladding quality, focus wheel finesse ( makes a wee grinding noise) ...general overall build quality, packaging etc....not the quality of a Zeiss or a Leica, no way, absolutely no no no not near, as you would expect given price. (But strangely not as poor as you would think, and not bad at all infact, still pretty solid and very pleasing not 'wobbly' at all.......just obviously cheaper). Magnesium Chassis and solid hinges, internal barrels look immaculate just like a Zeiss!!?? Very impressive. No cheap wobbly bit like the Zeiss 8x32. Dioptre setting works great and does not move. But in quality and design a world away from a Leica Dioptre (best in the world).

The case is crap fake leather and the magnetic catch does not work, the strap is very good & neoprene, the objective covers and occular rainguard are top notch and work a treat (this is a very important point for serious glassers, and these are good in this respect, I never expected this subtle issue to be right on a cheap Chinky but it works good). The bin is open hinge with thumb cut outs and feels great to hold, I have small hands so I would like the focus wheel further forward but,,,

The big news!!!!..............The image on these Bins is superb guys, You have to be a gimp to split hairs between these and alphas! And I mean crazy superb for low low £££, It is brighter than the FL8x32 (as it should be) it is razor sharp, the colours are real like a Leica, the contrast great, FOV 426ft ( better than Zeiss ) Although I feel the 8x32FL feels wider somehow. This is crazy quality Alpha image for real low ££.

In a nutshell....the physical material quality of these cheap Chinese bins is a world away (well half a world...really not too bad ) from the European quailty. Customer Service may not be as good (although it may be?) If you were a genuine explorer and needed a build quality to cross the Antarctic or the Sahara you would need a Zeiss Swaro Leica. I do not have confidence that these Hawkes would manage that. But I am pretty fat and only stay in the UK!! So horses for courses!

If you are in the market for the best image for your money, you simply must purchase a pair of these. I can tell you right now you are getting an Alpha bin image ( if not build quailty ) for a fraction of the cost.

It is a sad reflection upon us Europeans and most regrettable, that through greed we have sent the Optics Knowledge Heritage & knowhow to Asia for cheap gains. What we get is a Frankenstein Monster,------great image in a cheap clothes. I say to the reader buy European because you will get the best. But if your a cheap skate... buy Chinky.

I think your impressions of the Hawke mirror my, and others, sentiments of the open-bridge Chinese ED bins right after they first debuted a few years ago. I remember, with fondness, the discussions surrounding the Promaster Elite FLX ED, the first generation Hawke Frontier ED and the Zen Ray original ED. At the time they were introduced the image was the closest thing to an Alpha short of owning an Alpha. The newest versions of these still provide alpha level performance in all areas except for maybe edge sharpness and even in that area they aren't that far behind the non-field flattener alphas.

Enjoy your new bins. They do provide excellent optical performance.

Update! 2013, Autumn ( my favourite season ). The Dude has had a torrid time in the last year, job wise etc a horrible struggle for survival, pain & stress (picture a Goldcrest in a bad winter) not been able to afford any new quality binoculars, he is still running with the cheap chinese bins (which do the job very well actually) and seem as good as new. Had a marsh tit, a great skua and a sea eagle with them this year. Donations welcome for the edg 8x42! Ha! The Dude ( with the nod from the Dudes Wife) has taken to solo hammock camping this last while, you can get well off the beaten track, find real solitude and if you have the patience.....and time?.....capercaillie are still here. The Dude has discovered them. But they didn't see me. The best bird in the world! Take it easy guys and happy birdwatching.

thisdudeisgood said:

Update! 2013, Autumn ( my favourite season ). The Dude has had a torrid time in the last year, job wise etc a horrible struggle for survival, pain & stress (picture a Goldcrest in a bad winter) not been able to afford any new quality binoculars, he is still running with the cheap chinese bins (which do the job very well actually) and seem as good as new. Had a marsh tit, a great skua and a sea eagle with them this year. Donations welcome for the edg 8x42! Ha! The Dude ( with the nod from the Dudes Wife) has taken to solo hammock camping this last while, you can get well off the beaten track, find real solitude and if you have the patience.....and time?.....capercaillie are still here. The Dude has discovered them. But they didn't see me. The best bird in the world! Take it easy guys and happy birdwatching.

Click to expand...

Why do bad things happen to good dudes? Even Rabbi Kushner couldn't answer that one.

Same boat here except I have premium Japanese porros, which give up little to Tuetonic roofs. Spotted a sharp-shinned hawk two days ago in the kiddie park. It was a very nice day, perhaps the last really nice day we will have this year, so the mothers were out with their screamin' meanies in the park. Before the baby boom on my street (10, count 'em, 10 kids in the span of one year moved into the neighborhood).

I used to have the park to myself, sitting on my favorite bench, watching birds and feeding squirrels, all I need is one of those tables with a checkers board painted on top, and I'd be a contented old fart, but the sharp-shinned SCREAMS of the little girls playing in the park (why do they always scream?) not only scares away the birds, it scares me away. My hearing is still perfectly intact and I want to keep it that way.

The baby brigade finally left at 5 p.m. so I wandered over to the park, with the EIIs around my neck and a Zip Lock bag full of peanuts. I threw the first one to a squirrel, and a Blue Jay swept down and stole it from out under him, but the jay was immediately followed by another bird chasing it.

The jay starting screaming, so I went over to the tree and saw that the other bird was trying to attack it, I let out a LOUD crow call that scared it out of the park. Too bad the kids weren't there to get a taste of their own medicine.

It flew across the street and lighted down on a branch in poplar tree. I viewed the bird through my 8x30 EII and saw that it was small, no bigger than the jay it was chasing. It had a tiny head but no mistaking that it was a hawk's head. First time I saw a sharp-shinned hawk in the park. Must be migrating south.

Brock

thisdudeisgood said:

Update! 2013, Autumn ( my favourite season ). The Dude has had a torrid time in the last year, job wise etc a horrible struggle for survival, pain & stress (picture a Goldcrest in a bad winter) not been able to afford any new quality binoculars, he is still running with the cheap chinese bins (which do the job very well actually) and seem as good as new. Had a marsh tit, a great skua and a sea eagle with them this year. Donations welcome for the edg 8x42! Ha! The Dude ( with the nod from the Dudes Wife) has taken to solo hammock camping this last while, you can get well off the beaten track, find real solitude and if you have the patience.....and time?.....capercaillie are still here. The Dude has discovered them. But they didn't see me. The best bird in the world! Take it easy guys and happy birdwatching.

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Yo Bren

In a weeks time we set off for a week at Portuairk right on the tip of Ardnamurchan. No hammocks just a self catering jobbie. Stayed there 8 times already and it has a lovely island feel: no traffic because the road just..........stops LOL.

No Capers out there but we have had surprises like Turtle Dove and Waxwing. But the local Twite and Otters are good enough and there is the occasional Sea Eagle.

Bliss.

Lee

Thisdudeisgood: post more often!

That is all.

Just been given a link to this thread, one of the best, and for me most interesting, as I have both the Zeiss FL 8X32 and Leica BN 8x32, and I am far from an optics expert. An excellent comparison by the Dude, and I was interested in his note of the slight flare issue on the FL, I thought I had briefly noticed this myself a couple of times, but as it was not consistent, I began to think I imagined it.
Despite that, both great bins that I find hard to choose between.

Greetings. Same here with both the Trinovid BN and Zeiss FL. In some days, the placing of the Zeiss happens to be just perfect from the first try, and as a result, the view is exemplary--it is bright and sharp. In other days, several attempts are needed to arrive at the perfect alignment; to an extent, this detracts from the joy of using this model, not by much, just a little. Zeiss is also superb when I want to use it without glasses; they focus behind infinity and they can accommodate my myopic sight very, very, well. Because of its excellent warranty, I rarely hesitate taking it to any overly active hike.

Now, comes the the Trinovid. Perfect placement every time, from the first time--out of the case, boom, and there is the excellent view waiting to be enjoyed. Perfect independent focus and diopter setting that guarantees most accurate adjustment is also much better than that of Zeiss (and possibly of any other manufacturer). And contrary to the common critique of the Leica's short eye relief, it works perfectly for me with the prescription glasses on; but then can not use it without the glasses at all. In some days the Leica gets glued to me for many hiking days, but because it is in like new condition it tends to stay home for those hikes that may involve some rock climbing and traversing--the Zeiss comes out. I wish if Leica's warranty was transferable in the US as it is in the UK.

It is huge fun to have both. Enjoy in good health.

The Dude is Back

Been a while gents

Astonished to see 34K odd have looked at my wee review!

Good news is......as AC/DC said...I'm back in Black.

Leica Noctivids being ordered in the new year.

Can't wait

Will do a review with lots of photos.

Going for them over the Zeiss SF or Swaro EL SV due to better contrast and flare control.

As we seen from my Trinovid v Victory review the flaring on the Zeiss was a big issue for me and I sold them not being able to get used to it. I've heard the Noctivid is better at flare control than the Victory SF.

Can anyone say for sure?

Cheers and happy Christmas one and all:t:

thisdudeisgood said:

Been a while gents

Astonished to see 34K odd have looked at my wee review!

Good news is......as AC/DC said...I'm back in Black.

Leica Noctivids being ordered in the new year.

Can't wait

Will do a review with lots of photos.

Going for them over the Zeiss SF or Swaro SE due to better contrast and flare control.

As we seen from my Trinovid v Victory review the flaring on the Zeiss was a big issue for me and I sold them not being able to get used to it. I've heard the Noctivid is better at flare control than the Victory SF.

Can anyone say for sure?

Cheers and happy Christmas one and all:t:

Click to expand...

Happy Christmas Dude and welcome back. Looking forward to your Noctivid review.

Rich

Cheers Rich

Hope your well

8 or 10? probably going for the 8.

On Paper the new Victory SF seems the better option, lighter, wider field, better hand placement for focus wheel, closer focus etc but I like smaller binoculars and it looks pretty large physically.

The Noctivid is a wee bit heavier, wee bit less field and wee bit less close focus I think. But is physically smaller and shorter and I like that.

It is stray light flaring and the control of it that interests me most. My eyes seem to be very sensitive to it. I've had my best field experiences with Leica before. The Victory 32, whilst a fine binocular, didn't suit me at all but the Trinovid was always perfect. The flaring ruined the Victory for me and I sold it. I don't intend to take a chance with the SF.

Swaro EL, 8.5 power? hmm not sold on it.

Think I'm taking my chances with the Noctivid. I think in 2018 Leica are releasing the 8x32 Noctivid and if I knew for certain I would probably hold off and go for that. The new Trinovid 32 is out and I thought about it but this time around I'm looking for the top end view of the European Trio.

Getting grey now, just turned 41 and I deserve a treat. Probably shouldn't spend £2k on a binocular...especially when my car is an old banger!! but you only live once eh?

What would you go for? NV, SF, EL SV? Why?

Cheers

Hi Dude. If you can get an SE, grab it. Not just because it's a fraction of the price of the others...it's an awesome bino in its own right. Congrats on turning a mere 41. (Did they give the Dude a Beeper?)

thisdudeisgood said:

I think in 2018 Leica are releasing the 8x32 Noctivid and if I knew for certain I would probably hold off and go for that.

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I'm at the moment interested in three bins: The Noctivid 8x32, the "new" Trinovid 7x35 and the Swarovski CL 8x30. I'm after a small, lightweight pair at the moment for use on long hikes in difficult terrain, and these three seem to fit the bill nicely, assuming the Noctivid isn't to large and or heavy.

The trouble is the two Leicas haven't been released yet, and after Leica managed to delay the release of the Trinovid again and again, I may end up going for CL.

Hermann