Bin upgrade (1 Viewer)

J Moss · Mar 6, 2008

I'm sorry Jim, I feel bad that I've dissed your bins now!

It was purely the sharpness aspect that I felt let them down, compared to the more expensive pairs. It's not just the Vipers either. I'd never thought about it when using my current Bushnell, and have never found myself thinking "these aren't very sharp! I wish they were sharper!". However, now I do, and I dont think I can go back now! I did find the difference in sharpness to be significant between the pairs, for me.

I'm sure that if I hadn't had access to the Zeiss' or the Nikons, I would have been more impressed.

Thanks for your help though. Really very much appreciated.

J. Moore said:
Well I am glad to see you answered your question. I am at something of a loss to explain your reaction, which differs from mine and several others who have posted here. Perhaps we had different expectations. I went into my experience expecting to see a significant difference, and found differences but none that I considered significant, or at least worth paying much money for. Perhaps also you are more of an optical perfectionist (I personally try to make an effort not to try to see imperfections in optics to avoid this). Hope you find something you are happy with in any event.

Cheers,
Jim

J Moss · Mar 6, 2008

Lol wish I could have!

Perry Grin said:
I admire your patience - I would have done the stupid thing and bought a pair, just so I didn't go home empty handed!

J Moss · Mar 6, 2008

Hey Pete.

Gutting that all these bins become more comfortably within my price-range when thed drop to x32! However, I would rather keep the light gathering ability of x42, and just hunt for a bargain. Maybe have to save a bit longer, but I'll stick with x42 if I can.

Jason

postcardcv said:
If you liked the HGLs then try the 8x32s, they're 'only' £599 and are probably the best value roof prisms around.

P H · Mar 6, 2008

Suprised no mention of the Minox HG within your price range and gets top reviews.

http://www.minoxuk.co.uk/HGs.htm

Perry Grin · Mar 6, 2008

When I bought the SLC's I didn't get the chance to compare with any of the units that you tried so I can't really comment.

I did compare them to the Trinovids in a variety of configurations (8x, 10x, 42, 32), some top end Opticrons (can't remember which) and the RSPB top end bins. I did want to try the Nikons as well, but these weren't in stock at the time.

The SLC's and Trinovids were easily the best of the bunch. The Trinovids had a very slight edge in terms of brightness and sharpness but I went for the SLC's in the end for purely subjective reasons, they felt more comfortable in the hand, the eye cups fitted my face better and the view seemed somewhat 'easier' (very woolly I know!). Also they were closer to my £500 budget!

After a few outings with them I did notice a slight flare around the very outer edge when looking at a bright, light background but after discussing it on this forum decided to stick with them and I don't regret it.

As for 8x against 10x, I've only ever used 10x, but when I have looked through 8x I've not really seen a difference if I'm honest. However, many on this forum find that 8x is much more comfortable to use - wider FOV, brighter, easier to keep steady. I'm sure its another personal thing, but maybe I don't look critically enough!

Anyway, good luck with your hunt, you are definitely doing the right thing trying as many as possible and taking your time.

Perry

J Moss said:
Hi Perry.

How are the SLC's, compared to the bins I've mentioned? Must say they are the most asthetically pleasing bins I've seen anywhere so far. Not on the excessively expensive side either, although I haven't seen a pair for £500 anywhere. That would be descision made already if I had! (well, wont jump the gun, as I haven't looked through a pair!)

My current bins are 8x, and I've never used 10x. Shame they dont do 8x.

Would it be easy to get used to the change? (thats directed at anyone, btw!)

Thanks

Chris Galvin · Mar 6, 2008

Did you try the Opticron Imagic SE range? These are all available for less than £400. The 8x32 has a great field of view at 8 degrees and are superb for general wildlife watching as the close focus is 1.5m so are ideal for /moth/butterfly/dragonfly watching too. When looking through these you can actually focus on your shoes...

J Moss · Mar 6, 2008

Thanks again all.

Re Opticron SE and top end Minox ranges, I must admit I didn't give them as much attention as they might deserve. I will next time though.

It hard, as everyone everywhere rants and raves about 'the big 3' and these other bins do get overlooked. Obviously the best way is to look for myself, but I'm guessing that I'll be able to pick up on the difference between these top end, 'lower' brands and the big 3. Is this going to be the case? The price difference seems to suggest so, but I wont count my chickens...

Jason

NoSpringChicken · Mar 6, 2008

Hi Jason. Like you I was highly impressed with the Nikon HG L when I tried them, especially the focusing which was just about the best I've used. I was trying the 8x32 however. A couple of people on the forum have mentioned a slight issue with the rubber on the eyecups disintegrating over time, although Nikon have repaired them without any fuss.

Having extolled the virtues of the HG Ls, I am awaiting delivery of a pair of ex-demo Leica 8x32 BN Trinovids tomorrow, so I hope they are at least as good as the Nikons. They cost £499 and I am hoping they will last me a lifetime, so fingers crossed they are all right.

The staff at Cley Spy are brilliant and there is plenty of stock to try out. Good luck with your choice, whatever it might be.

Edit. I also tried the new Kowa prominar model and was extremely impressed. It might be worth trying that too, although it's a bit heavy and might be at the top end of your budget.

Ron

Steve C · Mar 7, 2008

Binoculars used as display/demos can sometimes have had some really hard knock from clumsy customers. From what you've said, I'd bet that the Vipers you tried have something wrong with them. I'd not try and convince anyone they are at the same level as the more expensive glass you looked at, but mine are every bit as good as the Zeiss Coquest. Brightness per monetary unit is theVipers strong point. If cash does not come as fast as you think, don't give them up yet.

Steve

J Moss · Mar 7, 2008

Hey Steve

No I wont rule anything out just yet, as theres plenty of time for testing everything before I can afford to buy. I might try the Vipers again, as well as the high end Minox, Opticron etc. Will also try the Zeiss Conquests again, as that focus wheel couldn't have been quite right!

Jason

Steve C said:
Binoculars used as display/demos can sometimes have had some really hard knock from clumsy customers. From what you've said, I'd bet that the Vipers you tried have something wrong with them. I'd not try and convince anyone they are at the same level as the more expensive glass you looked at, but mine are every bit as good as the Zeiss Coquest. Brightness per monetary unit is theVipers strong point. If cash does not come as fast as you think, don't give them up yet.

Steve

vkalia · Mar 7, 2008

Interesting reading your findings.

I've compared the Vipers to Ultravids (not directly) and BLs (this one was a side by side, A/B comparison), and to my eyes, the Ultravids were a bit better optically and more comfortable to look through, but the Vipers were brighter and more neutral than the BLs.

Each to their own, however - you're going about purchasing gear the right way, by comparing and judging it for yourself.

Vandit

J Moss · Mar 7, 2008

Hi Ron

I've been keeping an eye on Trinovids. Might end up getting a pair because they go for within my price range, and they're top bins.

Also, I must get hold of a pair of x32s and try them in bad light. I'm thinking that if they're better than my current Bushnell x42s, I might go with them, as the price drop suits my wallet better, and means that I'll be able to break into the Swaro/Nikon/Leica area more comfortably.

Will see

Jason

NoSpringChicken said:
Hi Jason. Like you I was highly impressed with the Nikon HG L when I tried them, especially the focusing which was just about the best I've used. I was trying the 8x32 however. A couple of people on the forum have mentioned a slight issue with the rubber on the eyecups disintegrating over time, although Nikon have repaired them without any fuss.

Having extolled the virtues of the HG Ls, I am awaiting delivery of a pair of ex-demo Leica 8x32 BN Trinovids tomorrow, so I hope they are at least as good as the Nikons. They cost £499 and I am hoping they will last me a lifetime, so fingers crossed they are all right.

The staff at Cley Spy are brilliant and there is plenty of stock to try out. Good luck with your choice, whatever it might be.

Edit. I also tried the new Kowa prominar model and was extremely impressed. It might be worth trying that too, although it's a bit heavy and might be at the top end of your budget.

Ron

J Moss · Mar 7, 2008

Thanks Vandit.

I have'nt got an agenda against any of the bins I've used so far. I'm purely going with what I see. I'm happy to pay £500+, and haven't found anything below that price that competes. I obviously haven't tried everything yet, and I hope I do find something that is good, but so far, Nikon, Leica, Zeiss (even the Conquests) and Swaro have really impressed me.

Jason

vkalia said:
Interesting reading your findings.

I've compared the Vipers to Ultravids (not directly) and BLs (this one was a side by side, A/B comparison), and to my eyes, the Ultravids were a bit better optically and more comfortable to look through, but the Vipers were brighter and more neutral than the BLs.

Each to their own, however - you're going about purchasing gear the right way, by comparing and judging it for yourself.

Vandit

Paskman · Mar 7, 2008

Jason,

Try the 7x42 SLCs - I don't think that you will miss the drop in magnification, but you will love the view only a 7x42 can give. They are a bit heavy, but so good ergonomically that you don't really notice it. They are also extremely good value!

Paul

David Caudwell · Mar 7, 2008

If your budget is restricted I'll put a vote in for the Swaro 8x30 slc's - light, relatively compact, good FOV, built like a tank and fantastic value. The only downside for me these days is the long close-focus. I've had mine for 13 yrs & they've been EVERYWHERE and never let me down!
However, if you can wait a while longer I would save up and get your favourite bins, whatever the cost - for the sake of a few more months you'll never regret it! I think once you've had a good look through the FL's, Ultravids, and ELs you'll be prepared to hang on a few more months, cos they really are better! Maybe not several hundred pounds better but better all the same...and if you get a 2nd division pair you'll only be wishing you hadn't!
Happy hunting (in a manner of speaking

)
Dave C

NoSpringChicken · Mar 7, 2008

My Trinovids arrived safely this lunchtime and my first impressions are – wow! They seem beautifully engineered, very solid and the view is definitely much brighter and sharper than my Swift HHS roofs. They look brand new and have got all the accessories with them. including a really good rainguard, a decent strap and a quality case. At the moment they seem really good value for £499 and I am looking forward to trying them out properly this weekend, weather permitting.

Ron

J Moss · Mar 7, 2008

Lol, looks like the budget is going up and up! I really do like the look of the Swaro SCLs (why didn't I have a closer look at the 7x30s that Cleyspy had, I dont know!), and the 7x42s seem like very good value. However, the 10x42s are probably attainable, at £729 (warehouse express). I dont think I'd like to lose any mag, as I only use the scope occasionally. 10x would probably be nice, actually.

The contract I've got (5 months with the National Trust, seasonal warden on Blakeney Point) has just been shifted forward 2 weeks, so I dont have to wait so long for some money! God, I cant wait!

Jason

FrankD · Mar 8, 2008

I am sorry that I did not see this thread sooner. If I could not purchase a Zeiss, Swaro, Leica or Nikon then I would be looking at...

Vortex Razor (8x42 in particular)
Meopta Meostar (really my favorite after the FLs and possibly the Trinovids)
Minox HG (limited experience and the field of view is a bit narrow on some configurations)
Pentax ED (again, limited experience and a narrower field of view in the 8x42 configuration but quite bright and very sharp)

I would also agree with your comments on the Conquest ABKs to an extent. They do appear quite sharp and especially bright. My only "knock" on them is that they do tend to display noticeable color fringing on high contrast objects. If you are one of those folks who does not see it then you will probably love these. As for the horrible focus...I agree with the above comments. It probably was just because it was a display model. Ask them to examine a boxed unit if you are serious about purchasing it. You may be surprised.

J Moss · Mar 9, 2008

Right, I'm still struggling to make my mind up!

so far, every pair that I have tested has had SOMETHING that I see as a problem or a niggle.

I've looked at the Kowa XD44s. They are nice bins, with a great view. However, at nearly 1KG, you'd probably feel that after a days wandering. Also they cost as much as the Nikon HGLs, which are better all round, IMO.

The Swarovski SLCs are the best looking bins I've tried, and the most comfortable to handle. I also dont mind the odd focus wheel. However, I would really prefer a close focus in my new bins, and 4m is way out! Only downside on these bins though, IMO.

I tried the Zeiss Conquests again and didn't find the focus wheel as bad as I did the other day. It isn't smooth like other bins; more of a start/stop action. I would get used to it though. However, this coupled with the cheap feel and a close focus of 3m means there may be too many things that bother me with these bins.

The Nikon HGLs have very little wrong with them, to my eyes. Nice size, nice shape, great image and fairly close focus. The £749 price tag is the only stumbling block!

However, I haven't tried a pair of Leica Trinovids yet. On paper, these are my favoured bins, and not just because they can be had for £499! They look great, as well as appearing rock solid, great optics (so I hear) and low close focus. Thats pretty much everything I want in a bin! Maybe a bit on the heavy side, but I'm not bothered too much by that. The price is probably the tipping point though.

...

Still cant take my mind of the SCLs though...

AAARRRGGGHHHH!!!

Jason

JonSadler · Mar 9, 2008

Hi

I have been looking at new bins for a while now. It is such a tough call what to buy. I am amazed by these posts. Where can you get Leica trinovids for 499! I cannot find them anywhere.

Regards
Jon

Bin upgrade (1 Viewer)

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Robin stroker

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Dave C

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Similar threads

Users who are viewing this thread