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ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

zeiss victory II and chromatic aberration? (1 Viewer)

Hello all, I don't post here very often but decided to add to the mix :). As for CA, I have always noticed it in every pair of binoculars I have seen. Last year I saved up and wanted a really good pair of binos and decided to look through a few. I tried the swarovski EL and some of the zeiss (don't remember which ones but they didn't have the FL) at a local shop. I looked at a flourescent sign at night (talk about contrast) and saw CA badly in all of them. It was then that I opted for a pair of 8x42 FL's sight unseen (with a 30-day return policy from the store of course) and still cannot see any CA in them. I do however get a "sense" of a slight greenish hue when I am scanning rapidly or shaking slightly. "Sense" is the best description I can come up with as the CA vanishes when I focus attention on one spot or get relatively still.

I have often wondered if the difference in spectral sensitivity between some people could be the source of some of the CA or at least exagerate it. For example, some people can see farther into the blue and red than others while everyone sees all of the green and yellow section. I have been told that some of the colors can be corrected for in an achromatic objective at the slight expense of others, so is it possible that the manufacturers would correct for the most common colors and be happy that the majority of people will be taken care of or am I full of crap :) Just my two cents.


By the way, Leif is right, if you are blessed enough to not notice CA don't go looking for it!

-joejack
 
Ca

Joejack said:
Hello all, I don't post here very often but decided to add to the mix :). As for CA, I have always noticed it in every pair of binoculars I have seen. Last year I saved up and wanted a really good pair of binos and decided to look through a few. I tried the swarovski EL and some of the zeiss (don't remember which ones but they didn't have the FL) at a local shop. I looked at a flourescent sign at night (talk about contrast) and saw CA badly in all of them. It was then that I opted for a pair of 8x42 FL's sight unseen (with a 30-day return policy from the store of course) and still cannot see any CA in them. I do however get a "sense" of a slight greenish hue when I am scanning rapidly or shaking slightly. "Sense" is the best description I can come up with as the CA vanishes when I focus attention on one spot or get relatively still.

I have often wondered if the difference in spectral sensitivity between some people could be the source of some of the CA or at least exagerate it. For example, some people can see farther into the blue and red than others while everyone sees all of the green and yellow section. I have been told that some of the colors can be corrected for in an achromatic objective at the slight expense of others, so is it possible that the manufacturers would correct for the most common colors and be happy that the majority of people will be taken care of or am I full of crap :) Just my two cents.


By the way, Leif is right, if you are blessed enough to not notice CA don't go looking for it!

-joejack
Click to expand...


Despite trying on numerous occasions with lots of diferent bins I have NEVER been able to see CA. I am very slightly red-green color blind. I wonder if this sort of individual variability has something to do with the inability of some people to detect CA?
 
hg1,

Good question. I'm curious if it is possible to test individual variation for spectral sensitivity or red-green blindness, etc. by taking a picture and have people who do and don't see CA look at the picture and see if they detect any fringing. Wouldn't it show the same thing theoretically? This assumes the camera is held so that lateral CA is eliminated.

-joejack
 
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Very old thread but ...

I'm red-green colorblind (deuteranomalous) so my green receptor is moved towards the red.

And yes I do see CA.

I didn't used to see it but now I can see it with some effort (and distinguish the types) ... it is a learning thing (so as people recommend unless you want to learn to see it don't try ;) )

A good way to see lateral CA is to view a well lit while rectangular target (say 10 to 20% of the field ... signs make good CA targets). Keep the target centered and move your eye off center from the EP. If you go one way you will see purple fringing on one side and yellow on the other. If you move your eye back across center and to the opposite the color fringes will change places.

Good EP design can help reduce this (you see some bins using LaK ... Lanthanum crown in the EP to try to reduce lateral).

Along with using ED glass in the objective.

Recently set Bushnell EX 8x36 back for terrible CA ... much worse than similar bins. I guess I'm getting more and more picky!
 
Zeiss Victory I or II?

Revisiting an old post here, I may be looking at an older 10x56 Victory that I found preowned in a shop, and am wondering about the early Victories. Is there a version 1 and 2, before the FL? Also how about you Zeiss guys, do all the Victories along with the Conquest have the Abbe Koenig prisms, and how would you rate an older Victory to the newer Conquest.

I do realize most here are not as familiar with the 56's. These must be ranked near the top with the low light choices.
 
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The Victory 56s look very much like the night owl or design series but are much lighter weight.8x56 132m/396ft field of view 1160g/40.9oz; 10x56 110/330 F V 1200g/42.3oz.They almost certainly have A-K prisms. Their specs are closer to the FLs than the new Conquests.
Ben.
 
Kevin Purcell said:
Very old thread but ...

I'm red-green colorblind (deuteranomalous) so my green receptor is moved towards the red.

And yes I do see CA.

I didn't used to see it but now I can see it with some effort (and distinguish the types) ... it is a learning thing (so as people recommend unless you want to learn to see it don't try ;) )

A good way to see lateral CA is to view a well lit while rectangular target (say 10 to 20% of the field ... signs make good CA targets). Keep the target centered and move your eye off center from the EP. If you go one way you will see purple fringing on one side and yellow on the other. If you move your eye back across center and to the opposite the color fringes will change places.

Good EP design can help reduce this (you see some bins using LaK ... Lanthanum crown in the EP to try to reduce lateral).

Along with using ED glass in the objective.

Recently set Bushnell EX 8x36 back for terrible CA ... much worse than similar bins. I guess I'm getting more and more picky!
Click to expand...

Kevin:

Back again like you were on an older post that was discussing the Zeiss, and
I thought the fact that you are color blind, makes another full discussion of this and how CA affects the view through the binoculars we seem to be interested in.


Does color blindness affect the way one may observe the attributes of any
optic?



I did refer to the original Zeiss Victory 10x56, and am trying to learn if there
was a version 1 or 2. I have read some internet posts that these are a real
flare performer, but the low light gathering here may be what is desirable.
I am not bothered by CA, and I hope I do not go on a quest to look for it.

If there is a version 1 or 2 of the Victory, I would like anyone here to comment on that. And any changes between the two would be appreciated.
Now we are talking before the FL was introduced.

Jerry
 
For all readers, after carefully looking through this thread, it seems to have a deep discussion on CA, and this is going back to 2004. So if anyone has anything to add here
to the discussion of CA, and how may a few may be affected, and so many are not.

Jerry
 
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Does color blindness affect the way one may observe the attributes of any
optic?
Click to expand...

I think it can. I'm moderately red-green colorblind. That just means I loose the ability to distinguish between the two (and especially colors inbetween) at lower light levels or at lower saturations. So I suspect it might affect some color bias estiamtes but I generally don't feel that's a big problem.

It does affect me seeing subtle (and sometimes not so subtle) rufous coloration (often in poor light). There is a bit of a standing joke between me and my birding friends about me not having ticked the Rufous Hummingbird here in the PNW despite it having made an appearance and IDed by my fellow birders I didn't see it well enough to tick.

But for CA it doesn't make any difference: I can see purple and yellow edges without any problems ;)

I'm not sure about he other question: I've never seen a definitive answer to "did the optical design change between the supposed v1 and v2 of the Victory?".

My guess based on my Victory 8x40 with the "normal" (i.e. v2) neck strap loops is probably not. It has CA (mostly lateral CA) that depends a bit on eye placement. And it is a bit glare prone even when you get the bin centered on your eyes (being high causes the "white crescents at the bottom of field).
 
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There was a I and II for the forty series but I do not think there were two 56 series.
I did get to compare a 10x56 Victory with a 10x50 BN Trinovid and I much preferred both the view and the ergonomics of the Zeiss.
Ben.
 
josika said:
There was a I and II for the forty series but I do not think there were two 56 series.
I did get to compare a 10x56 Victory with a 10x50 BN Trinovid and I much preferred both the view and the ergonomics of the Zeiss.
Ben.
Click to expand...

You are correct that there was only one version of the 56mm Victory's, but 2 versions of the 40's. The 56's were available as Night Owls and then as Victories (the Victories were considerably lighter due to thinner lens elements). The original Victory and 40mm Victory II's are all excellent, but they do show more chromatic aberration than the comparable FL's. The only Victory that produced enough CA to be bothersome (to my eyes) was the 10x40 Victory I. The samples I've seen had the highest level of CA I've ever seen in an "Alpha" binocular. The 8x40 Victory, and 56mm Night Owls and Victory's show a bit of CA, but not enough to be bothersome. Ergonomic preferences are very subjective, but I would argue that the 10x50 Trinovid is superbly balanced and has a more accessible focus wheel. The 10x56 Victory is brighter by a comfortable margin than the 10x50 Trinovid.
 
angelo225544 said:
You are correct that there was only one version of the 56mm Victory's, but 2 versions of the 40's. The 56's were available as Night Owls and then as Victories (the Victories were considerably lighter due to thinner lens elements). The original Victory and 40mm Victory II's are all excellent, but they do show more chromatic aberration than the comparable FL's. The only Victory that produced enough CA to be bothersome (to my eyes) was the 10x40 Victory I. The samples I've seen had the highest level of CA I've ever seen in an "Alpha" binocular. The 8x40 Victory, and 56mm Night Owls and Victory's show a bit of CA, but not enough to be bothersome. Ergonomic preferences are very subjective, but I would argue that the 10x50 Trinovid is superbly balanced and has a more accessible focus wheel. The 10x56 Victory is brighter by a comfortable margin than the 10x50 Trinovid.
Click to expand...

totally agree with you on the CA, on the 10x40 victory mk1. It had CA in bucket loads, and the armour wasn't clever it always attracted fluff !!, and the strap lugs are rubbish, bit of a rush job me thinks...
 
I've only had CA really jump out at me a few times. Almost all of them were when a white bird was far away with a dark background I would see a clear purple fringe on him. My Zeiss 12x45 Conquest produces a perfect purple fringe on one side of the object in this situation.
 
Unfortunately, local dealer in HK only carries ONE pc. for each model and there is no way to test variations among individual sample.

I ended up getting the 10x42FL with the latest Loutec coating...

CA was there, strongly, when viewing strong backlit object :-(

Guess this is unavoidable at present technology.
 
Reaching way back as I am researching a possible purchase - I read through this entire thread and one of the discussion points that I was interested in was how to set the interpupilary distance. I have never given that any thought as I just adjust to what feels comfortable. Is there a way to know that you have the binocular IPD set to your personal IPD?
 
ca zeiss victory

I have been using the zeiss bin together with swaro el and ultravid.
Of these 3 bins , the zeiss gives lowest amount of CA .
In my opinion it is also the sharpest! though not till edge as the new swaro is.
 
I never saw any CA in my Victory 10x42's. Then again I don't look for it and try not to read too much on it because I don't want it to come to consciousness.

I do remember seeing a seagull against blackish water with my Conquest 12x45's and he had a large purple halo on one side. But with the victories I never noticed it and my current Nikon SE's I've yet to see it either.
 
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