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Canon 100-400 mm IS lens focusing range (plus 40D question) (1 Viewer)

Craig Thayer

Well-known member
(1)What guidelines should one use when trying to decide whether to use 1.8 m versus 6.5 m focusing range on the Canon 100-400mm lens?

(2) When photographing stationary birds(with Canon 40D) is it alway best to use "One Shot" autofocus mode ? In other words is that mode better than Al focus or Al Servo in that situation??

THANKS

Craig Thayer
 
I would imagine that you would set the 6.5m focussing range for birds in flight ? But even then you may get a bird flying closer than that so possibly I would keep it on 1.8m. I have never used the 100-400mm so I probably don`t know what I am talking about but is the focussing range the same at 100 as it is at 400 ?
 
My biggest weakness when using the 100-400 with stationary birds up fairly close (hand held and no support) is that I do not use al-servo when really I should. It may be the case that the bird is still but when you take the photograph your body may not be, so that when you take the shot, you end up a few millimetres away from the point of critical focus. Using Al-focus will keep you on the bird. When using a shallow depth of field the problem with out of focus subjects will be more evident. It is not such a problem to use 'one shot' where the bird is a good distance away in an environmental shot and where you need to recompose 'in camera' IMHO.
 
I always have mine set to 1,8 m as it doesn't make too much difference in focus speed,i use one shot for still birds most of the time but use AI servo sometimes like when a bird is still but the branch its on is waving in the wind but always when they are flying.Don't forget when panning use mode 2 IS i also have my shutter set to multi shot so i can take one shot or just keep it pressed and get a few off.Hope this helps Phill.
 
My biggest weakness when using the 100-400 with stationary birds up fairly close (hand held and no support) is that I do not use al-servo when really I should. It may be the case that the bird is still but when you take the photograph your body may not be, so that when you take the shot, you end up a few millimetres away from the point of critical focus. Using Al-focus will keep you on the bird. When using a shallow depth of field the problem with out of focus subjects will be more evident. It is not such a problem to use 'one shot' where the bird is a good distance away in an environmental shot and where you need to recompose 'in camera' IMHO.

I'm going to have to disagree with Adrian on this one. I've found that when photographing birds close-up I'm better off with one shot. The reason behind this is that if a bird is so close that it fills much of the frame then care must be taken to keep the head in focus whilst not chopping off bits of it's anatomy, so to speak. ;) Even a 5.6 lens can have an extremely shallow depth of field when working so close and at 400mm, a shot can be ruined IMO if the shoulder of the bird is in focus but the head is not.

In other words using One Shot I'd focus on the head and keep my shutter half depressed to retain focus lock whilst I recompose the shot so that I'm not chopping bits off (and hoping the little bugger does't move in the meantime!). AI Servo does not allow this as it continually focusses whilst the shutter button is half depressed so I'd lose focus on the head if I moved my focus point.
You'll have to try each way first though Craig before deciding what is best for you.

Just as an exagerrated illustration below is a shot of a Robin taken with a 50mm f1.8 at f2. This is a bit cropped so what I said above doesn't really apply as the Robin easily fitted in the frame and I didn't need to recompose after focussing on the head but nonetheless I had to focus on the head and not the body otherwise it'd be a poorer photo.

As for question 1, I try and avoid using my limiter because more often than not with my luck I'll forget it's on and something will pop up in front of me and do the fandango or something and I'll find I can't focus on it. By the time I realise my mistake it's too late and it's gone.

But hey, that's just dopey me!
 

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In other words using One Shot I'd focus on the head and keep my shutter half depressed to retain focus lock whilst I recompose the shot so that I'm not chopping bits off (and hoping the little bugger does't move in the meantime!). AI Servo does not allow this as it continually focusses whilst the shutter button is half depressed so I'd lose focus on the head if I moved my focus point.
I use AI servo all the time for birds but I use the AF-on button to focus and not the shutter button - that way the camera does not focus when you press the shutter button, even in AI servo mode.
If you are focusing with the shutter button (I would hate to go back to that!) then you are correct Jaff.
 
I second what Roy said. I find using One Shot with wildlife is not worth it - what if the animal or bird suddenly starts to move? You run the risk of missing a good flight or motion shot while you are fumbling with changing the AF mode.

Best to keep AF on Servo and use the * button for AF (and delink AF from the shutter button). I have an article on this here, which may be helpful:
www.photosafariindia.com/articles.html

As for the focus limiter - I find that the lens is less prone to hunting in low light or low contrast if the AF distance limiter is set to 6.5m. That's where I generally leave it, switching to 1.8m only when needed.

Vandit
 
Thanks for the advise Roy I have often swapped between AI servo and one shot and this can be a pain, I have now used custom function IV - 1 and set 2 which focuses in AI servo when AF-ON is pressed and will lock focus when released.

You have a great site Vandit for advise regarding wildlife photography, I took note of a comment you made on your site "I have one of the rear buttons programmed to switch to all AF points" and thought this sounded pretty useful. Custom function III - 3 set to 1 on my 40D allows you to choose which focusing point to use via the multi-controller (thats the little joystick button on the back) and if you press the AF point selection button all AF points are enabled.

Thanks
Nick
 
I'm with Jaff on this. If I'm close to the bird I want to focus on the eye and move the lens to recompose the picture. The less I have to crop for composition the happier I am. A shot of a bird where is eye is out of focus is a wasted shot. Where the bird is some way off, you may still want to focus on the bird and then recompose to have a 'bird in the environment' sort of shot. With a twitchy bird hopping all over the place, A1 servo is probably best in my experience.
 
Nick, thanks for the kind words about the website. With the xxD bodies, that is exactly how I use them. Makes it very easy to shoot all sorts of subjects - stationary, moving, etc.

Another thing I have done now is set one of the custom functions to low ISO & small aperture - this is my "panning" setting. If I need to pan and get a nice, blurry background, I quickly turn the dial to C1 and I'm ready to go.

Vandit
 
I'm with Jaff on this. If I'm close to the bird I want to focus on the eye and move the lens to recompose the picture. The less I have to crop for composition the happier I am. A shot of a bird where is eye is out of focus is a wasted shot. Where the bird is some way off, you may still want to focus on the bird and then recompose to have a 'bird in the environment' sort of shot. With a twitchy bird hopping all over the place, A1 servo is probably best in my experience.
The thing is Tim, that when you focus with the AF-on button (and not the shutter button) you can do precisely what you advocate, even if the AI servo mode is on. Just hit the AF-on button while the focus point is over the birds eyes then release the AF-on button and compose the shot however you want.
 
The thing is Tim, that when you focus with the AF-on button (and not the shutter button) you can do precisely what you advocate, even if the AI servo mode is on. Just hit the AF-on button while the focus point is over the birds eyes then release the AF-on button and compose the shot however you want.

Thanks for that info Roy - perhaps I should have kept out of this conversation as my experience is with the 30D. In fact, perhaps I should just buy a 40D now that the price is so low and the image quality so much better... ;)
 
Thanks for that info Roy - perhaps I should have kept out of this conversation as my experience is with the 30D. In fact, perhaps I should just buy a 40D now that the price is so low and the image quality so much better... ;)
You might even be able to do it on the 30D Tim - using the * button, not sure I have never checked.
I would not say that the IQ is that much better on the 40D to be quite honest, in fact the 350D IQ is not far behind either of them, what changes with model upgrades is other things like FPS, High ISO noise, better AF sytems and more MP's but the base IQ on a 1.6 crop camera has not changed a lot since the 350D IMO.
 
Thanks for the info Roy, never thought of dong it that way.

The main problem with my method as I frequently find out to my distaste is that in the heat of the moment, with the excitement an all, I'll just turn in point and shoot mode and still end up with some that are wrong.

Unfortunately I'm stuck in my ways with regards using the camera so I'll have to stick with the shutter button but if Craig is just starting out I'd recommend doing it Roy's way before he becomes set with his camera technique, not least because One shot is a real pain in the ass at times. I got a few grab shots of a Redwing recently but had to bin them all cos for whatever reason the whole series of shots were oof (subject was well lit and all the that!). Now with AI Servo I might have gotten at least one out the bunch.

Cheers.
Jaff
 
clarification

The thing is Tim, that when you focus with the AF-on button (and not the shutter button) you can do precisely what you advocate, even if the AI servo mode is on. Just hit the AF-on button while the focus point is over the birds eyes then release the AF-on button and compose the shot however you want.

To get in on this conversation....If I already have the AI servo mode on....the AF-on button is just holding down the shutter button half way, I will attain focus on what my AF point is on, hopefully the face/eye. When doing so, I can then line up the shot and take the pic, not having to press button again half way?

Newbie to the Canon 450...have been using the S3 for quite sometime...thanks in advance...
 
To get in on this conversation....If I already have the AI servo mode on....the AF-on button is just holding down the shutter button half way, I will attain focus on what my AF point is on, hopefully the face/eye. When doing so, I can then line up the shot and take the pic, not having to press button again half way?
.
No Inman, the AF-ON button is on the back of the Camera and completely separate from the shutter button. When you assign AF to the AF-ON button the shutter button is just for metering and taking the shot.You cannot focus at all with the shutter button when in this mode.

Note: some cameras do not have a AF-ON button but you may be able to assign AF to the * button instead (some people prefer to use the * button).
 
No Inman, the AF-ON button is on the back of the Camera and completely separate from the shutter button. When you assign AF to the AF-ON button the shutter button is just for metering and taking the shot.You cannot focus at all with the shutter button when in this mode.

Note: some cameras do not have a AF-ON button but you may be able to assign AF to the * button instead (some people prefer to use the * button).

Hi Roy,
the customized AF function on the rear * button is something I've adopted since a couple of years (I just found the setting on the used camera I bought ;) ) .. just one thing: with my 20D (and previously on the 350D) in AIServo mode, I used to AF on the subject with the shutter button, press and keep pressed the rear * button, recompose the shot and shoot, then let the button .. in this way I was able to stop the focus on the subject/part of it I wanted ...

Is this dissimilar to what you're actually using? If not, what C-Fn setting does this correspond to in your camera? C.Fn-04 1,2,3? I think my setting was #2 (AF/AF lock, no AE lock), not sure ... in any case, is it necessary to keep the buttom pressed, or just press it once, recompose and shoot?

EDIT: one more thought, please correct me if I get it wrong. If you remove completely AF from the shutter button, then you're always obliged to use your thumb to get your camera AFing ... this can be quite convenient for stationary subjects, but what about BIFs? I wouldn't want to use two fingers when the opportunity arises and I have to pan to follow a bird crossing my field of view ... in this situation, I rarely find myself in the position to recompose the shot, I'm already glad enough if I manage to keep the focus point on the subject ;) , so I prefer the shutter button to do the AF thing and shoot

Thank you,

Max
 
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Hi Roy,
the customized AF function on the rear * button is something I've adopted since a couple of years (I just found the setting on the used camera I bought ;) ) .. just one thing: with my 20D (and previously on the 350D) in AIServo mode, I used to AF on the subject with the shutter button, press and keep pressed the rear * button, recompose the shot and shoot, then let the button .. in this way I was able to stop the focus on the subject/part of it I wanted ...

Is this dissimilar to what you're actually using? If not, what C-Fn setting does this correspond to in your camera? C.Fn-04 1,2,3? I think my setting was #2 (AF/AF lock, no AE lock), not sure ... in any case, is it necessary to keep the buttom pressed, or just press it once, recompose and shoot?

EDIT: one more thought, please correct me if I get it wrong. If you remove completely AF from the shutter button, then you're always obliged to use your thumb to get your camera AFing ... this can be quite convenient for stationary subjects, but what about BIFs? I wouldn't want to use two fingers when the opportunity arises and I have to pan to follow a bird crossing my field of view ... in this situation, I rarely find myself in the position to recompose the shot, I'm already glad enough if I manage to keep the focus point on the subject ;) , so I prefer the shutter button to do the AF thing and shoot

Thank you,

Max

Hi Max, On the 40D I use the AF-ON button to do all the focusing.
The custom function is C.Fn IV-1 option 2 (Metering start/Metering + AF start). This means that the shutter button will meter when depressed but will never influence the AF. Whereas the AF-ON button will meter and start AF.

Using this method you do all your focusing with your thumb. I find this most useful for BIF when you get used to it. Just keep your thumb depressed when you are over the target and fire away – if you lose the target just release your thumb and depress again when you are back over the target. It becomes second nature after a time.

I was very skeptical when I first heard of this method but gave it a try and found I was at ease with it after just an hour or so. Now when I use my 30D which is set to focus in the traditional way I find it very strange and I automatically try to press the non existent AF-ON button.

To me using this method gives the best of all world, just set the lens to AF and the Camera to AI Servo and you have the following:

1) One Shot by depressing the button to focus on, say a perching bird’s eyes, release the button, compose how you want and shot.

2) AI Servo mode by keeping the button depressed

3) Manual focusing by not depressing the button (providing your lens has full time manual)


To be able to switch between one shot, AI servo and Manual without having to touch a single wheel or mode function button is a great benefit to me.
 
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Hi Max, On the 40D I use the AF-ON button to do all the focusing.
... Now when I use my 30D which is set to focus in the traditional way I find it very strange and I automatically try to press the non existent AF-ON button.

Ah, OK .. that's the point:smoke:If there's no AF-ON button on the 30D, I assume there's none on the 20D either ;) :-O
 
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