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Swarovski Focusers: facts at last. (1 Viewer)

Troubador

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Questions about the quality of Swarovski focusers have been raised from time to time and perhaps this is not surprising given that there have been not only complaints from individuals but also reports of multiple units suffering from poor focusers. One of these latter reports was from myself.

Anecdotal accounts are rarely the best basis for arriving at a conclusion so I contacted a main UK dealer who sells nearly 20 brands of binoculars including all three alpha brands to ask if they could outline what their experience has been in this regard.

The dealer, who describes his customers as 95% birders and general users, was quite clear that while the level of complaints that he receives about Swarovski focusers is not quite as good as one other alpha it is at least as good as, and perhaps a little better than the other alpha*. To put it another way I interpret this as Swaro being average amongst the alpha brands.

Significantly, my contact put a number on it. He estimated that less than 0.5% (i.e. less than 1 in 200) Swarovski binoculars sold resulted in a complaint about the focuser.

This is highly significant because in the UK our cultural practice when we receive faulty goods from a dealer is to take this up with the dealer. We don’t want our faulty unit mending by the manufacturer, we want another unit that functions as it should and we go back to our supplier to sort this out. When I asked the dealer if some of his customers might contact Swarovski directly he answered with a strong ‘no’. In any case from his estimate, Swarovski does not stand out from the other alphas as having a different level of problem.

So there we have it. Testimony directly from a long-established dealer clearly indicating that Swarovski does not have a problem with their focusers.

Lee
*The dealer did name the brands but to do so here would just be a distraction from the principal point of this post.
 
Statements like "estimated 0.5%" is never a good sign of actually knowing the actual figures.
And I don't think a swaro-dealer would have any interest in telling us the exact figures.
Stating a reasonably low figure would be the expected behavior.

What the real figure is only Swaro's QA department knows.

Some "under-cover" research in Absam would be very interesting…
how is you Austrian accent?
:)
 
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Statements like "estimated 0.5%" is never a good sign of actually knowing the actual figures.
And I don't think a swaro-dealer would have any interest in telling us the exact figures.
Stating a reasonably low figure would be the expected behavior.

What the real figure is only Swaro's QA department knows.

Some "under-cover" research in Absam would be very interesting…
how is you Austrian accent?
:)

This isn't a Swaro dealer but a dealer in Swaro, Leica, Zeiss and many more.
The word 'estimated' is mine not his.

I trust his information and in particular that Swaro is pretty much the same as the other alphas. Bear in mind that he did volunteer that one of the other alphas is a bit better than Swaro, so he was not just trying to protect Swaro.

However I would indeed like to visit the Absam factory and meet the people behind these instruments.

Perhaps Dale Forbes will read this and offer me a visit :t:

Lee
 
This isn't a Swaro dealer but a dealer in Swaro, Leica, Zeiss and many more.
The word 'estimated' is mine not his.

I trust his information and in particular that Swaro is pretty much the same as the other alphas. Bear in mind that he did volunteer that one of the other alphas is a bit better than Swaro, so he was not just trying to protect Swaro.

However I would indeed like to visit the Absam factory and meet the people behind these instruments.

Perhaps Dale Forbes will read this and offer me a visit :t:

Lee

I'm not sure about that,
depends on if the 0.5% figure is correct or not…
:-O
 
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I'm not sure about that,
depends on if the 0.5% figure is correct or not…
:-O

Well if it is better than this figure he can show me how they do it and if it is worse he can show me what they are doing to put it right.

There is no fire on the roof, as you guys say.

Lee
 
I've waited very long whether I would make this post or not, but I guess my experience with Swarovski may be heard as well.

My experience with swaro focusers is not so good.
My first SLC was returned to the store 3 days after because of a squeeky focuser.
My SV50 is very smooth and even, but developed a bit of play when changing directions. It is acceptable when it stays like this, but I think it should not happen on such an expensive bin.
My second SLC developed a squeeky focuser after a couple of weeks, but it disappeared for a while after rinsing it under tap water.
My SV32 was sent back to Absam for a very, very uneven focuser, and returned even worse than it was.
Sent it off to Absam again with a checklist which contained 4 things to check, it returned with only a focuser overhaul, and it was still as shitty as it was after the first repair. Very uneven feel and a lot of stiction. 3 remaining things were not even looked at.
Total time that I had to miss the SV32, 2 months. And still not ok. Now I'm on holiday with a bino which is impossible to fine focus.
Made a complaint, but got the answer they could do nothing more than ask me to send it to the factory i.s.o. the repair departement for a complete overhaul, and I could ask if the local importer of Swaro Belgium had a replacement bin to take with me on holiday. Which I didn't.

If I knew all of this before spending 8000€ worth of Swarovski optics over the last 1.5 years.....
Problems can and will occur with every brand, but what counts is how they solve them.
I wish I could, but I can't confirm the raving words about Swarovski service.
Or is it it just me being too critical..... ? When I pay top dollar, may I expect top customer service as well?
I've been VERY patient, but at this moment I am really disappointed in Swarovski.

B.t.w. I'm still in Sweden, so I don't have internet access all day long, and can't reply quickly.

P.s. I'm not trying to bash Swarovski with the story above, I just wanted to share my experience. (and a bit of venting from my side as well, this issue is bugging me for over a month now.) To be continued.
 
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We seem to have let the ramblings of one poster and his penchant for anecdotal "evidence" get the better of us. In spite of the honesty, the potential reality of the dealer's impressions, it is still anecdotal evidence. Fighting anecdotes with anecdotes is not a likely recipe for success. Until somebody develops a protocol for focuser testing and gets enough samples into a solid data base we will never have any real idea of what the heck is what. I have every expectation the some of the complaints are real. I also have no doubt whatsoever that many focus gripes are nothing more than OCD complaints. Until we get some DATA we will never know.

So I guess I'll throw another anecdote in the fire. All of the focusers on all of the Swarovski binoculars I have ever handled, including my SV EL 10x50 (which has as good a focuser as anything I've ever used), work just fine...there case closed ;-)

There is a site devoted to breaking down cell phones to see what is inside and how well they are put together etc. We need a site like this for binoculars.
 
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I've waited very long whether I would make this post or not, but I guess my experience with Swarovski may be heard as well.

My experience with swaro focusers is not so good.
My first SLC was returned to the store 3 days after because of a squeeky focuser.
My SV50 is very smooth and even, but developed a bit of play when changing directions. It is acceptable when it stays like this, but I think it should not happen on such an expensive bin.
My second SLC developed a squeeky focuser after a couple of weeks, but it disappeared for a while after rinsing it under tap water.
My SV32 was sent back to Absam for a very, very uneven focuser, and returned even worse than it was.
Sent it off to Absam again with a checklist which contained 4 things to check, it returned with only a focuser overhaul, and it was still as shitty as it was after the first repair. Very uneven feel and a lot of stiction. 3 remaining things were not even looked at.
Total time that I had to miss the SV32, 2 months. And still not ok. Now I'm on holiday with a bino which is impossible to fine focus.
Made a complaint, but got the answer they could do nothing more than ask me to send it to the factory i.s.o. the repair departement for a complete overhaul, and I could ask if the local importer of Swaro Belgium had a replacement bin to take with me on holiday. Which I didn't.

If I knew all of this before spending 8000€ worth of Swarovski optics over the last 1.5 years.....
Problems can and will occur with every brand, but what counts is how they solve them.
I wish I could, but I can't confirm the raving words about Swarovski service.
Or is it it just me being too critical..... ? When I pay top dollar, may I expect top customer service as well?
I've been VERY patient, but at this moment I am really disappointed in Swarovski.

B.t.w. I'm still in Sweden, so I don't have internet access all day long, and can't reply quickly.

Thats a horrible story UHU, sorry to hear about it and it won't help at all to say that stories of poor service from Swaro are quite rare.

I would look up Dale Forbes at Swarovski on this site and send him a private message asking for his help.

Lee
 
I've waited very long whether I would make this post or not, but I guess my experience with Swarovski may be heard as well.

My experience with swaro focusers is not so good.
My first SLC was returned to the store 3 days after because of a squeeky focuser.
My SV50 is very smooth and even, but developed a bit of play when changing directions. It is acceptable when it stays like this, but I think it should not happen on such an expensive bin.
My second SLC developed a squeeky focuser after a couple of weeks, but it disappeared for a while after rinsing it under tap water.
My SV32 was sent back to Absam for a very, very uneven focuser, and returned even worse than it was.
Sent it off to Absam again with a checklist which contained 4 things to check, it returned with only a focuser overhaul, and it was still as shitty as it was after the first repair. Very uneven feel and a lot of stiction. 3 remaining things were not even looked at.
Total time that I had to miss the SV32, 2 months. And still not ok. Now I'm on holiday with a bino which is impossible to fine focus.
Made a complaint, but got the answer they could do nothing more than ask me to send it to the factory i.s.o. the repair departement for a complete overhaul, and I could ask if the local importer of Swaro Belgium had a replacement bin to take with me on holiday. Which I didn't.

If I knew all of this before spending 8000€ worth of Swarovski optics over the last 1.5 years.....
Problems can and will occur with every brand, but what counts is how they solve them.
I wish I could, but I can't confirm the raving words about Swarovski service.
Or is it it just me being too critical..... ? When I pay top dollar, may I expect top customer service as well?
I've been VERY patient, but at this moment I am really disappointed in Swarovski.

B.t.w. I'm still in Sweden, so I don't have internet access all day long, and can't reply quickly.


Send this to Dennis. He wants this kind of information about Swarovski's binoculars.
 
Statements like "estimated 0.5%" is never a good sign of actually knowing the actual figures.
And I don't think a swaro-dealer would have any interest in telling us the exact figures.
Stating a reasonably low figure would be the expected behavior.

What the real figure is only Swaro's QA department knows.

Some "under-cover" research in Absam would be very interesting…
how is you Austrian accent?
:)

I agree 99.99%, Vespo. Dealers are not going to be upfront about how many returns they get due to wonky Swaro focusers (or any other problem for that matter) since it would discourage customers from buying those models/brands. Also, from reading BF, most owners who have had focuser issues with their Swaros have taken the advice of other members who assured them that the focusers would eventually wear in over time, so rather than returning them to the dealer, they keep them past the return period.

Their experience has been mixed. Some can't catch a break like Uhu74. So did the member who tired a suitcase full of samples at a optics event, and found every one had a wonky focuser. Others never seem to find focuser issues with any unit they've tried.

Or some do find a problem, but the focuser does break in, or at least improves to the point where the buyer can live with it, even if it is still a bit harder to turn in one direction or a bit stiff. Other times, you have owners such a Piergiovanni from binomania, who sent two SV ELs in because of stiff focusers, and he got them back improved, but still not as smooth as he would have liked. One BF member had the same experience as Pier, but instead of living with the stiff focuser, he chose to sell his EL and buy a Zeiss FL.

"There are eight million wonky focuser stories in the naked city; these are just a few of them." ;) (A No Prize Kewpie Doll for the first person who gets that obscure reference)

Lee's retired now and has a lot of time on his hands, so he started this new crusade to prove me wrong about Swaro focusers, because apparently hundreds of denials from The Defenders weren't good enough for him. ;)

The first thing he did was contact an insider at Zeiss to find out what percentage of Swaro owners are hunters. I was a bit puzzled by this, after all, why would someone at Zeiss know this demographic information about Swaro's sales? Then it hit me. Who at Zeiss used to work for Swaro? :h?:

He did this because I wrote that the reason Swaro focuser issues haven't been addressed was probably due to the fact that most of Swaro customers are hunters who use their bins for looking for big game at long distances where fast and/or fine focusing are not important like they are for birders, whose targets are fast moving, much smaller and at closer distances where depth of field comes into play.

So why reinvent the wheel, literally, when most of your customers won't even notice? Well, it turns out that the Zeiss insider originally wrote (or Lee thought he wrote) 1/3 of Swaro customers were hunters. Even Lee thought hunters must have at least made up 50% of the buyers. Then there was a clarification by the Zeiss insider that the percentage of Swaro buyers who are hunters was actually around 2/3. That's about what I expected. So there you have it confirmed by a secret source, about 2/3 of Swaro buyers are hunters. Did that really surprise anybody?

I told Lee what you did about getting reliable data for returns due to wonky focusers: "What the real figure is only Swaro's QA department knows." And their lips are sealed with the wax imprint of the House of Habsburg. ;)

So the only data we have is anecdotal, and Lee's crusade would be better served if instead of contacting dealers whose data would be "useless and meaningless" (using his own words), he could get the truth (with a small "t") straight from the "horse's mouth" by going into the archives and finding threads and posts where Swaro owners/testers have commented on wonky focusers and following up on how those issues were or were not resolved.

That would take a lot of digging, but what else does he have to do until Birdfair opens on Friday? :smoke:

Brock

Here they come like a pile up on the LI Expressway.....
 
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I agree 99.99%, Vespo. Dealers not going to be upfront about how many returns they get due to wonky Swaro focusers (or any other problem for that matter) since it would discourage customers from buying those models/brands. Also, from reading BF, most owners who have had focuser issues with their Swaros have taken the advice of other members who assured them that the focusers would eventually wear in over time, so rather than returning them to the dealer, they keep them past the return period.

Their experience has been mixed. Some can't catch a break like Uhu74. So did the member who tired a suitcase full of samples at a optics event, and found every one had a wonky focuser. Others never seem to find focuser issues with any unit they've tried.

Or some do find a problem, but the focuser does break in, or at least improves to the point where the buyer can live with it, even if it is still a bit harder to turn in one direction or a bit stiff. Other times, you have owners such a Piergiovanni from binomania, who sent two SV ELs in because of stiff focusers, and he got them back improved, but still not as smooth as he would have liked. One BF member had the same experience as Pier, but instead of living with the stiff focuser, he chose to sell his EL and buy a Zeiss FL.

"There are eight million wonky focuser stories in the naked city; these are just a few of them." ;) (A No Prize Kewpie Doll for the first person who gets that obscure reference)

Lee's retired now and has a lot of time on his hands, so he started this new crusade to prove me wrong about Swaro focusers, because apparently hundreds of denials from The Defenders weren't good enough for him. ;)

The first thing he did was contact an insider at Zeiss to find out what percentage of Swaro owners are hunters. I was a bit puzzled by this, after all, why would someone at Zeiss know this demographic information about Swaro's sales? Then it hit me. Who at Zeiss used to work for Swaro? :h?:

He did this because I wrote that the reason Swaro focuser issues haven't been addressed was probably due to the fact that most of Swaro customers are hunters who use their bins for looking for big game at long distances where fast and/or fine focusing are not important like they are for birders, whose targets are fast moving, much smaller and at closer distances where depth of field comes into play.

So why reinvent the wheel, literally, when most of your customers won't even notice? Well, it turns out that the Zeiss insider originally wrote (or Lee thought he wrote) 1/3 of Swaro customers were hunters. Even Lee thought hunters must have at least made up 50% of the buyers. Then there was a clarification by the Zeiss insider that the percentage of Swaro buyers who are hunters was actually around 2/3. That's about what I expected. So there you have it confirmed by a secret source, about 2/3 of Swaro buyers are hunters. Did that really surprise anybody?

I told Lee what you did about getting reliable data for returns due to wonky focusers: "What the real figure is only Swaro's QA department knows." And their lips are sealed with the wax imprint of the House of Habsburg. ;)

So the only data we have is anecdotal, and Lee's crusade would be better served if instead of contacting dealers whose data would be "useless and meaningless" (using his own words), he could get the truth (with a small "t") straight from the "horse's mouth" by going into the archives and finding threads and posts where Swaro owners/testers have commented on wonky focusers and following up on how those issues were or were not resolved.

That would take a lot of digging, but what else does he have to do until Birdfair opens on Friday? :smoke:

Brock

Here they come like a pile up on the LI Expressway.....
Your personal sample size of ZERO has yielded a 100% complaint rate. Sounds like a wonky poster to me.
 
Hello all,

Oh well, here is another anecdote about one of those Austrian brand binoculars

may be found here.

Of course, it is anecdotal and statistically insignificant.

Happy bird watching,
Arthur :hi:
 
Damn near split my sides at this one Bob. :-O :-O :-O :-O

Lee
No amount of verbal abuse from the Zeiss Fan Boy Club bothers me because I know deep down inside they are sorry they bought that rusty, stained, fogged up Zeiss with all those metal fragments clunking around inside of it. I have changed over to a Canon 10x42 IS-L anyway. It has 40% better resolution than the Zeiss SF and has a rock steady view and costs about a 1/3 of the price of the Zeiss SF so no amount of Swaro bashing can hurt me anymore. The Canon 10x42 IS-L will give you a better view than any other 10x42 binocular. Excuse me I will be down at the Canon binoculars threads. There are too many Zeiss Fan Boys around here. You know you should have a thread just for Zeiss Fan Boys where you can tell everybody how much you love them and exactly where you have your Zeiss tatoo. HaHa.:king::king::king::king::king:
 
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No amount of verbal abuse from the Zeiss Fan Boy Club bothers me because I know deep down inside they are sorry they bought that rusty, stained, fogged up Zeiss with all those metal fragments clunking around inside of it. I have changed over to a Canon 10x42 IS-L anyway. It has 40% better resolution than the Zeiss SF and has a rock steady view and costs about a 1/3 of the price of the Zeiss SF so no amount of Swaro bashing can hurt me anymore. The Canon 10x42 IS-L will give you a better view than any other 10x42 binocular. Excuse me I will be down at the Canon binoculars. There are too many Zeiss Fan Boys around here. HaHa.

And you seriously wonder where the vapid comment came from that hurt your feelings so bad. :-O
 
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