685B monopod & 234 head for 500mm? (1 Viewer)

In the previous thread "monopod for tall person" the 685B was mentioned, and the 234 basic or RC was also mentioned as a good head. I just got the 685B, and it does work as claimed (quick adjust up and down - a neat trick), but I don't know what head to get. The 234 looks like just the thing to add the vertical tilt, but it's only rated for 5.5 to 6 pounds load, and at present I only plan to use the monopod with my Canon 500mm f/4 IS, which is considerably heavier. I'm using the 393 gimbal on my tripod for the 500mm, but would not like to add that much weight and "clunkiness" factor to a nice lightweight monopod. One of the reasons I got the 685B was because of it's load rating sufficient for the 500mm.

Does anyone use the 234 with a supertele in the weight class of the 500mm, and if so, do you feel comfortable with it despite the load rating?

Never used the 234 with anything that heavy. Might be worth looking at the Really Right Stuff head as well.

I don't have any experience using that much weight on the 234 head, but, considering that all it does is tilt, I'm wondering exactly what it would do wrong if you overloaded it. I guess it's possible that the tilt knob would not be able to tighten enough to hold it and it would keep tilting, but it seems like it would have to be REALLY overloaded for that to happen.

If your lens has a tripod ring (as opposed to attaching the tripod it at the camera), and the ring's attachment point is fairly close to the center of gravity of the camera/lens setup, I'll bet the 234 would hold it OK, since with a balanced load there really isn't all that much leverage against the knobs on the head that hold it in place.

I have read about folks using a Sigma "Bigma" lens (120-500, I think) with the 234 with good success, so I say give it a try! The 234 is completely metal (no plastic) and pretty sturdy.

RAH said:

I don't have any experience using that much weight on the 234 head, but, considering that all it does is tilt, I'm wondering exactly what it would do wrong if you overloaded it.

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Unless the weak spot is the QR system, if that failed you culd have problems. Personally I wouldn't risk my 500 f4 on a head that wasn't rated to hold it, why take the risk? A cheapish Manfrotto ball hed won't addd much more weight but will hold the lens no problem.

Thanks guys. I am being careful about properly handling the weight of the 500mm. My wife got me a small monopod for Christmas, but even the manufacturer didn't list a load rating for it, so I didn't even try it out. I exchanged it for the 685B right off. The MH-01 from RRS looks like it addresses my specific problem. Thanks Quantum Tiger for that lead. All I gotta do now is check out how much it'll cost . Money, money, money. This hobby is really getting out of control. Thanks to all for the advice and suggestions.

postcardcv said:

Unless the weak spot is the QR system, if that failed you culd have problems....A cheapish Manfrotto ball hed won't addd much more weight but will hold the lens no problem.

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Yes, the QR system COULD be an area of concern, but the cheapish Manfrotto ball heads and the 234 head have the exact same QR system. The 234 has the same standard plate and QR system as most of the moderately priced Manfrotto heads, so I do not think that is an issue.

Thanks RAH and postcardcv. The link to RRS that Quantum Tiger listed goes to a page where RRS talks about recommending their QR system on top of the 234 basic head, which does not have the manfrotto QR. I have a 3-way Manfrotto head with manfrotto's QR that I use for smaller stuff, but I wouldn't dare use that small QR system on the 500mm. I was hoping manfrotto had a 234 version that used the same large QR plate that came with their 393 gimbel, which I have on the 500mm most of the time, and I could just slid it right into the smaller tilt head on the monopod, but that doesn't seem to be an option.

RRS lists their own MH-01 heavy duty tilt head for larger lenses like the 500mm instead of the 234 and RRS QR combo. Their MH-01 costs ten times the price of the $20 234 basic head. And that wouldn't count the replacement foot for the 500mm to fit their QR system, another $100. Then I'm either changing the foot on the lens to switch from the gimbel to the monopod, or I gotta find some sort of adaptor for the gimbel mount, or chuck the 393 gimbel and spend a fortune for the RRS gimbel system. It's a nasty expensive web of mismatched accessories if I ever saw one.

I suppose I could skip the QR altogether and just screw the 234 basic head onto the 500mm foot. I don't plan to let the head take any real stress anyway. I wouldn't dare let go of the lens while on a monopod, no matter what sort of head I used, so the chances of it overpowering the tenstion on the 234 and tilting down are nil anyway. All I want is a hinge point so it can tilt while still in my hands.

Maybe that's the answer to my question with help from all of you to bounce the problem off of. If I get the $20 solution and end up not feeling comfortable with it, all I've wasted is $20. Might be worth a try. Many thanks to each of you.

Fred, I agree that the basic 234 head might be a good solution and you're only out $20 if it isn't.

For a quick release setup, couldn't you do as mentioned in the tall person thread where they mention the "basic 234 with no QR and a Really Right Stuff B2 Clamp", which I guess must be more robust than the Manfrotto QR setup, which I agree is kind of smallish.

For a quick release setup, couldn't you do as mentioned in the tall person thread where they mention the "basic 234 with no QR and a Really Right Stuff B2 Clamp",

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It seems that would only complicate things. I already have one QR plate that came with the 393 gimbel screwed to the 500mm lens foot. Getting the RRS clamp would mean also getting their $55 plate or their $95 replacement foot for the lens. Then I'd find myself switching plates (or the whole lens collar foot) between the gimbel head and the monopod tilt head. That pretty much defeats the purpose of "QR". If Igot another RRS clamp to replace the one on the gimbel head, then that's even more money, assuming that's even a possibility. So, the $30 monopod my wife got me for Christmas turns into a few hundred dollar spending spree. I don't see any option to put a larger Manfrotto clamp on the 234 head to match the existing plate from the 393 gimbel. That would be a less expensive solution if it were possible. The expense just seems to compound itself with every solution option. Not fun.

OBXGuide said:

RRS lists their own MH-01 heavy duty tilt head for larger lenses like the 500mm instead of the 234 and RRS QR combo. Their MH-01 costs ten times the price of the $20 234 basic head. And that wouldn't count the replacement foot for the 500mm to fit their QR system, another $100. Then I'm either changing the foot on the lens to switch from the gimbel to the monopod, or I gotta find some sort of adaptor for the gimbel mount, or chuck the 393 gimbel and spend a fortune for the RRS gimbel system. It's a nasty expensive web of mismatched accessories if I ever saw one.

I suppose I could skip the QR altogether and just screw the 234 basic head onto the 500mm foot. I don't plan to let the head take any real stress anyway. I wouldn't dare let go of the lens while on a monopod, no matter what sort of head I used, so the chances of it overpowering the tenstion on the 234 and tilting down are nil anyway. All I want is a hinge point so it can tilt while still in my hands.

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Granted the RRS stuff is expensive - but it's good quality. You should be able to get away without replacing the foot on the 500mm by just using a multi-purpose rail on the existing foot - which saves you $40.

I agree with you though - the point of a QR system is to have just one system - otherwise it is a faff. I bit the bullet a few years back and bought RRS QRs for my tripod and monopod plus the plates for all my gear (while the pound was strong and the dollar was weak it was quite an attractive option) and I much prefer them to the manfrotto system for ease of use.

It does looks like you can put an arca-style QR system on the 393 though (for more expense!) (see http://www.ophrysphotography.co.uk/pages/equipmentupdate.htm

Postscript

Just had a quick look at Speedgraphic site and it appears that Manfrotto do make a QR which is compaitble with the 393. It's the 357 Sliding Plate Adaptor. I have no idea whether mounting one on a 234 is possible (or a good idea) - but it is a lot cheaper than some of the other options.

Well Ian, I think you've hit the nail on the head. The 357 you found (something I'd had no luck finding out about, even poking around the Manfrotto site) turns out to be exactly the same clamp and plate that comes on the 393 gimbel. I recognized it as soon as I saw the picture on the web site. The 357 clamp would mount to the 234 head using the 1/4-20 camera screw. I'd prefer using a 3/8 screw, but since I don't plan to take my hands off the lens in the first place while it's on the monopod, it should be okay.

Although the product descriptions for the 234 only mention the 1/4-20 screw, it does appear from the image that the thumbwheel on it is reversible with a larger (3/8) thread on it's other side. But that may only be how it appears. IF it did have a reversible 1/4 to 3/8 threaded screw, I would think they would mention it. However, on the RRS web site they talk about mounting their B2-pro clamp on the 234 tilt head. In that description the say to remove the "reversible stud and gray thumbwheel" and replace it with a stainless steel 3/8 bolt to mount their clamp. That seems to indicate it is indeed reversible and accepts a 3/8 stud. So maybe there is hope.

While maybe not the most elegant solution, I think it is indeed worth giving this a try, as the cost of the Manfrotto tilt head and clamp with an additional plate included is only a few dollars more than just the B2 clamp alone, not to mention the 2 plates and 2nd clamp I'd have to get to go the RRS route. If I did it "right" I'd get the heavier RRS MH-01 tilt head (instead of the 234) while I was at it, but I simply cannot justify that expense at the moment. You see, in the past year I've bought the Canon 500mm IS, 300mm IS, 70-200mm IS, a 50D, and a new Chevy Silverado crewcab 4WD pickup for my photography "hobby". My better half is extremely tolerant of my excesses in this regard, but I think I'd be wise to lay low for awhile. I should at least try to give the appearance of some modicum of self control. (this is where the unconscious twitching and facial ticks come into play )

Anyway, thanks for taking the time and effort to find what I was having no luck locating. I really appreciate it. I will give this a try an report on the outcome.

I'd say there is definately hope. Certainly my 234 was precisely as described by RRS. I didn't use a 3/8 bolt & some glue though - just the reversible stud and it does the trick for me.

My Manfrotto 234 basic head and 357 Pro QR clamp with 357PL plate came in today, and I installed them on the Manfrotto 685B Neotec monopod. I was a little disappointed when I first unpackaged the 234 head and tried to tighten it for drag, as it was really jerky and uneven, but I was working it by hand with no weight on it. Once I installed it on the monopod and put the 500mm on top, the weight made it easier to find a tension setting to provide a little drag when tilting. It felt a lot smoother, though basically the head seems to be designed for either loose or locked. I guess I was expecting too much for a $20 head. I have no idea if the RRS MH-01 I considered is any better for setting a drag. It may essentially only lock or unlock too. I guess what I was looking for is a fluid head feel, and it doesn't provide that.

I took out the 1/4-20 bushing from the base of the head and mounted the head to the monopod by the 3/8 stud (only choice). I reversed the thumbwheel stud in the head to attach the 357 clamp on top by the 3/8 stud also. I was able to easily adjust and balance the lens and body with the slide plate, and I think this will work out fine. I was able to set the tilt head tension so it would hold the lens position but still be easily tilted, though I suspect that in the field it may require frequent tweaking to maintain the setting. Won't really know that until I've put it through its paces. I can say if you loosen the hinge bolt tension far enough, the horizontal hinge bolt will wobble inside the staft and you can feel it in the head, but nobody would ever actually us the thing at that loose of a setting.

I've inserted two thumbnails below with links to larger images on my web site showing the rig. One image includes the grip of the 685B Neotec monopod for those who might be interested in this neat monopod. It's a one-handed operation to let the monopod collapse or slide to a shorter height The grip has a pinky finger safety catch that must be squeezed first, then you squeeze the larger grip release with the rest of your hand. To make it taller simply pull it up without having to squeeze anything. The small foot pedal on the leg base is held down with your foot while pulling up, or you can just pull the leg by hand to extend it. It is truly a breeze to extend and collape, and seems quite solid with the 500mm and body weight on it.

The head and QR
The head, QR and monopod grip

Now that the monopod has the same clamp and plate as the Manfrotto 393 gimbel head I use on the tripod, it's a simple matter to switch the lens between them. I must admit though that it's a bit unnerving to have $7000 of lens and camera waving about on the end of a stick! I'm thinking about rigging some sort strap that I can sling around my neck or clip to myself just in case I have a momentary lapse of brain function and let go of the thing without thinking. The wrist strap that comes with the monopod is useless. I'll have to come up with something better.

Glad it all fits together as planned.

I tend to keep the camera strap around my neck the majority of the time that my camera is on top of the monopod, and I find that adequate as a safety - but your 500 is a tad heavier than my setup. With the QR setup it's relatively easy to pop the gear off the pod whilst walking and then pop it on again when you need to shoot.

Hi, I use the little manfrotto tilt head with an RRS quick release on the fat alu Manfrotto monopod (681?). This is with a 300/2.8VR + D300/batterypack, so I think it's around 4 kg. I find it works fine, but I keep a strap around my neck most of the time. The arca swiss foot on the lens can slide in the QR so I can balance it well to minimize torque on the head. I don't mind having a hand on the camera anyway, since it's not standing on its own. Like people say, the head is sturdy in construction, so if something gives its the locking screw slipping. So far no problems (1 year) , it's not rock solid, but solid enough. BR/ Per