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ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

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RayE

RayE

Well-known member
Now its ok spending lots of money on binoculars if you have the money. 3yrs ago bought a pair of binoculars from Aldi's 10 x 25 they supprised me, how good they were, they still supprise me, went back and bought another pair for my girlfriend. Was in Aldi today and they have binoculars in again 12 x 32, £5.99, yes, bought a pair, can get them in black or silver. Get them while you can.
 
Now here's one of my favourite little bug-bears so excuse me if I let the side down again but:

My first pair of binoculars were given to me by an uncle when I was about eight. 8x30's very old - brass fittings etc. They did the job for an eight year old.

They did for me until I was about fourteen when, with my newly acquired income from Saturday work at a local farm, I purchased a pair of "Boots Pacer" 8x30's for about £10.00.

A few years later they got bent and so I decided to splash out on a pair of Ziess 8x30's at around £120 thinking that I was "moving up in the world" (a complete fallacy of course).

At the same time I started to experiment with 10x50's and despite more common opinion; I've actually come to prefer 10x50's over 8x30's (no doubt; I should be flogged for this herecy).

About five years ago I purchased a pair of Simmons 10x50 in a closing down sale, they should have been around £70.00, I got them for £49.00.

I very quickly started leaving the more expensive Zeiss 8x50's in the cupboard and using the far cheaper Simmons 10x50's.

Since then I've tried very many different types of binoculars as used by other birders right up to the extremely expensive equipment.

My Simmons 10x50 were in a car that was stolen three years ago but shortly afterwards I spotted a pair of "Ying-Yang-Yong" 10x50 selling for £15.00 in "Lidle", is this another cause for great shame? These looked almost identical to my lost Simmons apart from the name, they had the same old fashioned sturdy design, the same comfortable soft rubber eye-cups, the same coated lenses and the same level of clarity.

Anyway; I brought a pair and have used them ever since.

A few months later I saw yet another pair in another shop, identical but for name and again selling at £15.00 and so I brought a pair for my son (I suspect it's a standard design made under licence in China by several companies).

Two weeks ago I was rummaging about in a crappy little tourist tat shop in Barmouth when I spotted yet another pair, identical in all but name and so I brought them just for the hell of it; fifteen squids; what's to lose.

Now here's my point; Having also used binoculars owned by others and costing over £300 in some cases and then comparing them to my lowly Chinese £15 jobbies; I fail entirely to find £285 pounds worth of difference in clarity or versatilty.

Also; I can very happily leave my binoculars in my car at all times, I take them out in the rain, snow, fog and hail. I let them swing casually from my rucksack, bash them against rocks and trees with impunity, get them splashed with salt water and covered in sand with and.....it doesn't matter, because if they do get wrecked (and they haven't yet) then I can simply replace them with another pair of Chinese Ying-Yang-Yongs setting back that enormous 15 squids.

Here's the contentious point; whilst I'm sure that your £300 all singing all dancing bino's are superior to my £15 Chinese interlopers, I'm equally convinced that my birding pleasure is not minutely compromised or dimminished by this fact and that your £300 jobbies are not £285 better than mine.

I'm almost tempted to make an obviously erroneous assumption of a slight optical snobbery and this temptation is somewhat increased by your complete lack of reponse to Ray's very worthy thread in favour of what might at first glance and to the underclass to which I obviously belong, of your possibly geekish discussions regarding your better bred binoculars.

.....and yes......my tongue is very firmly in my cheek........
 
I have got to admit I am open minded about the price of bins. Is it quality before money not the other way around. :-O

To me, it is not the price that counts, it is more to do whether the equipment is any use at all

My OH is in the mind that the more expensive the better the product :-C

We own a pair of RSPB bins, 8x40's which where quite expensive, but I have to say they are the best bins I have ever used. They are more compact, easy to transport, and the quality of vision in super.

I thought 'brand' names came in to it a bit here, but I believe that the RSPB have wildlife watchers interests at heart anyway.

The second pair of bins we possess are a large pair of Miranda 10x50's. They seem inferior, they bulky to carry around, and they are not so good. Also the fact that they have used to death. We use these for around the house and they are never taken out at all.

Knowing my OH he will buy bins that are dear. I have never managed to talk him around to my way of thinking yet. :-C

Having said this, RSPB bins get my thumbs up :t: :t:

I will show him this thread and see what he thinks. The information is very interesting to read and I will look forward to reading more comments here

;)

Peewit
 
I birded an entire year with 12x binoculars. The image was no better than my 8x32s now, it was worse. But fuzzy and big. FOV was ridiculous. I learned to point those cheap roofs very precisely at the bird. My 10x was very easy after that.
 
For years I had a very cheap pair of 7x50 porros bought from RSPB warehouse in Sandy (long time ago) no problems for years in Bedfordshire but in Wiltshire they have trees and hills in the way that meant that the poor close focus of these and a more recent pair of cheap roofs, made them unuseable. This does seem to be a problem with some cheap bins, it doesn't matter how good they are - if you can't focus them it rather defeats the object... N.B. The not as cheap 8x30 Jenoptems were still fine.
 
Hi

I own 2 pairs of the Lidl bins 1 Meade 1 Bresser
I also own several quality pairs Nikon SE , E2, Zeiss etc
The centrefield performance of the Lidl's is astonishing for £10 and £15 respectively and i have and will gladly use them for casual viewing knowing as you stated any damage is not expensive to rectify
However on the flip side of the coin i often find myself wishing i had one of my "besties" with me when something rare or brilliant is there to be viewed
The Lidl bins are great for the money and aviation viewing is excellent with both my pairs ..... but if the old Vulcan bomber ever reaches the sky again (which is expected) i would be hankering to have my best gear there on the day
Its really horses for courses a good and low cost view is often as rewarding as high end stuff
Lets face it better to have a view than none !

PS The Lidl bins do suffer from stray reflections and when put up against great kit can look a little washed out contrast wise .... but as i posted on another forum some while back they defy the laws of commerce with their cost

Regards
RichT
 
I've seen two different types on sale at Lidle; one with coated lensers and the other without.

I have the ones with coated lenses and I haven't noticed a problem with unwanted relflections, lack of contrast or being washed out, even in comparison to the more expensive bins that I've tried but then again maybe I don't have particularly discerning tastes.
 
Hi

Both my pairs have a bluish coating which performs very well for the cost
The difference in contrast is only evident when making the comparison against very high end bins ie swapping from one to the other
Stray light reflections in my pairs are easily seen in conditions where sun is behind the eyepieces
Its a distraction but not a show stopper
They really cant be beat imho for £10 or £15 but the pairs i own do have differences from my better pairs if looked at more closely
Whether its worth the huge cost uplift is a matter of personal inclination

Regards
RichT
 
DGRW said:
Now here's one of my favourite little bug-bears so excuse me if I let the side down again but:



Here's the contentious point; whilst I'm sure that your £300 all singing all dancing bino's are superior to my £15 Chinese interlopers, I'm equally convinced that my birding pleasure is not minutely compromised or dimminished by this fact and that your £300 jobbies are not £285 better than mine.

I'm almost tempted to make an obviously erroneous assumption of a slight optical snobbery and this temptation is somewhat increased by your complete lack of reponse to Ray's very worthy thread in favour of what might at first glance and to the underclass to which I obviously belong, of your possibly geekish discussions regarding your better bred binoculars.

.....and yes......my tongue is very firmly in my cheek........
Click to expand...

It's quite rediculous for you lower classes to accuse us of snoberry.
Anyway no self respecting bird watcher should admit to owning a pair of bins that cost less than £1,000.00
 
The word is ridiculous. The window that you type into has a spell checker of sorts.

All but one of my bins are made in China. The other one in Hungary.
 
Okay, I put my hands up. I confess to spending far too much on bins. On the other hand, I spend practically nothing on watches, clothing, beer, cars, petrol (a.k.a. gasoline). Marginal Utility is a very personal concept.......;)

I also wonder about the economics of greatly improved "cheap" bins. Somebody, somewhere, is constructing these things. I wonder what they´re being paid. (Now, how does one dismount from this High Horse?)
 
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Now, how does one dismount from this High Horse?
Click to expand...
With considerable care. I understand that they're constructed by dwarves in the foothills of Tibet.
The window that you type into has a spell checker of sorts.
Click to expand...
Yes....and it's most annoying when my spellchecker insists on reverting to that foreign language used by Americans rather than the pure mother tongue. You really do need to understand the use of the vowel "U" in words such as Colour and the correct pronunciation of words such as Lieutenant. I do however approve your use of Chinese binoculars.


signed:

A rediculus lower class snob...............
 
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I'm in this camp. I have a pair of Ultravid 8x42's. They cost a fortune, but I work on the principal that if I look after them they will last me the rest of my life, and having tried lots of different bins there is a difference. Whether they justify Leica's hugely inflated price is another matter.
 
Sancho said:
Okay, I put my hands up. I confess to spending far too much on bins. On the other hand, I spend practically nothing on watches, clothing, beer, cars, petrol (a.k.a. gasoline). Marginal Utility is a very personal concept.......;)

An excellent point Sancho. I suspect that Optics are many birders main outlay. If I look at workmates expenditures on Sports-cars, drinking, chasing women, gambling, ,more drinking, gigantic TV's, fabulous holidays, yet more drinking, Sky TV with sports channel, even more drinking, houses they cant afford (both home and in holiday destinations), loads more drinking, and all the other things I miss out on, then what kind of indulgence was my Zeiss scope with Carbon-fibre tripod, various cameras and and several pairs of binoculars (I've got a lot of eye's...).
Lets put these things in perspective!!!
Click to expand...
 
Steve Jones said:
Sancho said:
Okay, I put my hands up. I confess to spending far too much on bins. On the other hand, I spend practically nothing on watches, clothing, beer, cars, petrol (a.k.a. gasoline). Marginal Utility is a very personal concept.......;)

An excellent point Sancho. I suspect that Optics are many birders main outlay. If I look at workmates expenditures on Sports-cars, drinking, chasing women, gambling, ,more drinking, gigantic TV's, fabulous holidays, yet more drinking, Sky TV with sports channel, even more drinking, houses they cant afford (both home and in holiday destinations), loads more drinking, and all the other things I miss out on, then what kind of indulgence was my Zeiss scope with Carbon-fibre tripod, various cameras and and several pairs of binoculars (I've got a lot of eye's...).
Lets put these things in perspective!!!
Click to expand...

Thanks Steve. You´re entitled to your Zeiss and CF Tripod, etc., you´ve earned them and I hope you get great use out of them! It´s my defence anyway when I´m feeling guilty about splashing out on some new piece of kit. Don´t have any of the other stuff on your list either, and wouldn´t have a use for them. BTW, Scodger on another thread is looking for folk to donate an old pair of bins for Wildlife Wardens in Zambia....an excellent idea, and another way for an over-opticked birder like me to salve my conscience a wee bit! (Mind you, I have four bicycles....I hope I don´t start feeling guilty about them, ´cos I´m not giving any away!;) )
Click to expand...
 
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Steve Jones said:
OK I'll go back to using 3 garden canes tied together with string then.
Click to expand...

Surely we should all be using CF for the sake of the environment? I mean, if all the birders in the world had CF tripods, that would create a massive Carbon Sink and we´d get a Nobel Prize or something....(or is CF really, really, bad? ´Cos one of my bicycles has a CF frame, and I love it....)
 
I have never spent 'big money' on a pair of bins as I think it's possible to get very good ones for between £200-£400, but strangely, I don't have the same feelings about spending money on scopes (£1000+ no problem for an ED glass 80mm, but then I do a lot of digiscoping, and feel that you can see the difference at the higher powers used with a scope, and if I can then the camera certainly can).

After using a pair of £150 Opticrons for 15 years, I finally changed to a pair of £400 Nikon HG's a couple of years ago (which I still consider to be a fantastic bargain by the way). With neither pair did I feel that I was missing out compared with models costing £800+. The Opticrons are still optically fine by the way, if a little tatty.

I have however, looked through a few cheaper pairs (and some very cheap pairs) but have never come across a pair of £15 bins that compared even to my Opticrons. The £17 7-Dayshop roofs came close, but the close focus was a joke, and the build quality of them left a lot to be desired (some of the screws looked like they had been home made on a lathe!). Optically they were ok (though I expect that sample variation is a big issue) but they just don't have the natural feel, balance, sharpness and quality feel that you get with the Nikons. Also, what state would they now be in after 2 years of hard use, or after another 5-10 years?

If you cost out the total outlay of buying several pairs of cheap bins over the years, it would probably exceed the expense of buying one decent pair such as a Swarovski SLC 8x30. If you dropped the latter and damaged them, you'd probably be given a new pair (or the equivalent) by Swarovski after they'd repaired them, but if you're happy with cheap and can't see the difference anyway, then why bother spending more?
 
Not sure if the math adds up, Steve, you would have to buy a cheap pair every year for thirty years. The mid price binoculars, on the other hand, will easily last 10-15 years.
 
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