Three Porros and a Roof, an Eclectic Mix (1 Viewer)

I was out with a friend yesterday testing bins and birding. He brought a Nikon 8x32 SE and a Leupold 6x30 Yosemite. I brought Leica 7x42 Ultravids and Fujinon 6x30 AR-SX. We set up water bottles with printing on them at 30, 35, and 40 steps to allow for 6, 7, and 8 power. This also helped to judge DOF.
We had the bins laid out on a portable table along with chairs so we could relax and use our elbows for a steady rest. I wear contacts and my friend wears fairly large round eyeglasses. Here are our less than scientific observations:

Leupold Yosemite
I'm glad my friend surprised me by bringing this one along as I've been wanting to try them out. Very light and friendly in the hand, the full field of view is quick to find and generally have a very easy view. Quite sharp on axis with fall-off starting at about 50% of the view, not a large sweet spot. The eyecups are the familiar twist ups of the type that are seen on many bins now. My Nikon 8x25 ProStaffs have the very eyecups for instance. With a claimed 20mm of eye relief, both David and I have no problem seeing the full field easily. The focus mechanism felt overly stiff and slightly rubbery and vague. At our bench the Yosemites performed well but birding was a little different. More on this later.

Fujinon 6x30 AR-SX (Nautilus)
These are individual focus and for many will be discounted right out of the gate for that. They are significantly larger and heavier (by 11 oz.) than the Yosemites. They also have their objective lenses set at close to 1 1/2" wider than the Yosemites lending more of that 3D goodness that many of us appreciate about porros. Very sharp on axis with very little fall-off at the edges. Very bright for a 30mm bin also. David found the eye relief insufficient for him while I find it ideal for me. These Fujinons, along with some others in their line, have the oculars recessed a bit in their housing wasting maybe 3mm of eye relief. Again, at the bench these work great but as a birding bin the IF is often a problem.

Nikon 8x32 SE
These are the ones I wanted to use the most. With all the buzz lately on these forums about these (and porros generally) I needed more face time with them. Yes, the view is very transparent and sharp, good nearly to the edges. Color and contrast look great as well, and they do feel great in the hand. David has cut off the rubber eyecup so that there is now a broad flat rubber ring surrounding the ocular. He says they are perfect for him wearing glasses. I on the other hand, had problems with the controversial "black-outs". I found the positioning of the bins to my eye fussy and not very intuitive, slowing down my ability to acquire targets quickly. Another issue I didn't much care for was the focusing, which for my tastes is overly damped (slow). These two issues make this bin not a good choice for me as a birding binocular.

Leica 7x42 Ultravid
Here is the champion birding bin of this group, by a wide margin. Eye relief is perfect for both of us, and for me target acquisition is instant. Very sharp, with good contrast and color. Field of view is about the same as the Yosemites and slightly wider than the Fujinons and Nikons. The focus mechanism is in a completely different league than the other bins here. Very light and quick with the point of focus realization being easy and immediate. I can't overstate this aspect as this, combined with ease of view, are two of the major qualities a birding bin should have IMO. The image quality is very close to the Nikon and that is first cabin.
I'm also of the belief that 7x just may be the best compromise in magnification, for my type of birding.

After our little test we decided to bird the local area (Santa Monica Mountains, Southern California) that includes savannah, chaparral, oak woodland, and riparian. I started out with David's Yosemites as I found them charming and wanted more time with them. That didn't last long. A 1/4 mile in I became frustrated with the focus even with their being just 6x. David warned me about this as it is his one serious complaint with them and I found I agreed. I waked back to the car and got my Leicas.
For the price though the Yosemites are very nice indeed, sans the focus issue.

My love affair with the Fujinons has cooled a bit. I realize now that the reason the IF didn't bother me too much before was that I was using them at my local patch and have the birding landscape committed to memory. Knowing the area and where the birds are I can anticipate and pre-focus with pretty good results. Birding in a less familiar setting and being ready to view different subjects at different distances is another story. I still contend that as a marine, shore, and open ground bin they are great with lot's of that 3D effect due to very wide spaced objectives and great optics.

Though I want to love the Nikon SEs I just can't, not in their current form. Quicker focus, blackout issue, and lack of waterproofness would have to be resolved, for me. One man's ceiling is another man's floor however and David finds them to suit him perfectly with the exception of the waterproof thing.
I'm rooting for Nikon to make changes that will make them more universally acceptable. I would also like to see Fujinon get serious about producing center focus, lighter, bird-able bins.

Oh BTW, the birding highlight of the day was we witnessed a Great Blue Heron taking a (very large) gopher at it's hole and having a time of it trying to swallow it. I had my ED50 with me as well and had quite a show.

No pictures of the Heron VS Gopher????? Rats (pun intended). I never heard of a heron taking on something like a gopher, cool!!!

DHB said:

No pictures of the Heron VS Gopher????? Rats (pun intended). I never heard of a heron taking on something like a gopher, cool!!!

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There was no heron vs gopher. It was ALL heron! They are deadly with that sword of a bill. I've seen this gopher carnage twice previously by herons and is common in our neck of the woods. They impale the critter with their bill and usually (with one fell swoop) flip them up so gravity helps the prize to pass down their gullet. In this case the gopher weighed at least a pound and wasn't so easily swallowed, though it was as dead as the look in the eyes of a ticket taker at the Ivar Theater*. It remained stuck in his neck for the five minutes or so we watched and was still there as we walked on.

*Apologies to Tom Waits

I'm sure that some of my affection for the SE comes from the fact that I use it primarily as a hunting binocular, where the slowness of focus from 10 feet to 50 yards almost never comes into play.

Fireform said:

I'm sure that some of my affection for the SE comes from the fact that I use it primarily as a hunting binocular, where the slowness of focus from 10 feet to 50 yards almost never comes into play.

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That makes sense. I suspect that when some do comparisons viewing fixed objects they aren't fully considering handling either.

Clearly there are a number of other uses for binoculars than birding. I'm thinking that with all the demands required of a good birding bin, it is the most demanding niche to fill.

I did that little cut-out trick with the E II eyecups. When you folded them over I could not get the appropriate IPD to see a single field of view. If they came with the now conventional twist-up eyecups then this would not have been an issue.

I am surprised that the Ultravid came out on top...but just a little. The view threw them is beautiful. The depth of field, the field of view, the brightness but I am surpised the trumped the SE by that much. Were you going by overall rating (which I can understand if you consider the blackout issue, the waterproofing level, etc...) or just optics?

FrankD said:

I am surprised that the Ultravid came out on top...but just a little. The view threw them is beautiful. The depth of field, the field of view, the brightness but I am surpised the trumped the SE by that much. Were you going by overall rating (which I can understand if you consider the blackout issue, the waterproofing level, etc...) or just optics?

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I tried to be clear but maybe something got lost.
The way I see it optically they are very close in image quality. Too close really for me to care. I somewhat prefer the 7x view for the bit of extra depth and width but it's a minor factor when I say the Leica is the superior birding tool.
No it is in this order: the blackout issue, the slow focus, and lack of waterproofness that make the SE not attractive enough for me to buy.

The first two affect how quickly and transparently the binocular functions as a birding tool. The last issue bothers me not because I bird much in the rain, but because I prefer to use water when cleaning my bins. The Leica offers better function and utility while affording a fantastic view that rivals the SE.

Regarding blackouts, some will no doubt say or think it's a matter of getting used to them. I have had other bins with the same issue and got rid of them. I don't like having to accommodate to a design that isn't a natural fit.

Just out of curiosity, do you wear glasses? If not, the trimmed eyecups may have created the blackout problem for you. That would have done it for me before I wore glasses. FWIW, I never knew there was a blackout problem with the SEs until I started reading these forums.

I get the kidney beans with my Zeiss FLs if I don't keep the eyecups dialed just right.

Fireform said:

Just out of curiosity, do you wear glasses? If not, the trimmed eyecups may have created the blackout problem for you. That would have done it for me before I wore glasses. FWIW, I never knew there was a blackout problem with the SEs until I started reading these forums.

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I don't wear glasses when birding, I use contacts. I have a method of holding binoculars that allows me to use my index fingers as stops for eye relief and my thumbs to block stray light. The problem I have with the SEs isn't that my eye consistently was too close, as I can control that, it's that the forgiving zone for eye placement is small and I have to hunt for it.

I went out this morning trying to mimic the blackout effect with the Fujinons and the Leicas. I couldn't get the Fujis to blackout under any circumstances. To get the Leicas to almost blackout I had to twist the eyecups all the way in and place my eye so close I thought my eyeball was going to touch the glass.

Kidney beaning wasn't an issue either. I have a system for very accurately setting the IPD.

8x32 SEs seem to be one of those polarizing bins that either work well for you, or they don't. If they do work well for you, as in your case, I can see where you may find it difficult be understand why others have problems with them. But... they do.

I agree that the weak point of the Yosemite is the rather stiff and somewhat balky focus. However, the first binocular I had and the one I learned birding was a little like that. So I got used to it and find I can function with almost any type of focus arrangement. One hope I have for the new Vortex Raptor is a slightly less stiff focus wheel. Although that's probably more of a function of the waterproofing process than anything else.

Kevin Conville said:

Kidney beaning wasn't an issue either. I have a system for very accurately setting the IPD.

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What is your system, Kevin?

"System" in retrospect is a bit over stated. Method is a better word.

I hold the bins 8" or so away from my eyes and with one eye closed center the exit pupil in the ocular lens. I then close that eye and open the other and that exit pupil should be dead center also. Adjust until they are. Blinking back and forth a few times aids accuracy in that it eliminates any sub-conscience movement of the bins to center the pupil.

It helps to be in good enough light to accurately see the complete edge of the ocular lens.

Kevin Conville said:

"System" in retrospect is a bit over stated. Method is a better word.

I hold the bins 8" or so away from my eyes and with one eye closed center the exit pupil in the ocular lens. I then close that eye and open the other and that exit pupil should be dead center also. Adjust until they are. Blinking back and forth a few times aids accuracy in that it eliminates any sub-conscience movement of the bins to center the pupil.

It helps to be in good enough light to accurately see the complete edge of the ocular lens.

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Interesting technique. Thanks!