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Worlds best roof prism versus the world's best porro prism binocular! (1 Viewer)

I think the bicycle forums would eat him alive! Birdforum is very gentle, by comparison :)...
The photography (aka cameras) forums, with perhaps DPReview being the most notable, also make this equipment subforum tame. DPR is frequented by many fanboys, with fangs.:eek!:
I was on a motorcycle forum when I had bikes once and talk about anal.
 
I think the bicycle forums would eat him alive! Birdforum is very gentle, by comparison :)

Speaking of which: are you on Bikeforums or Slowtwitch, Sancho?

Edit: Giant Defy and Canyon, eh? Nice bikes, both. I have a Ridley Damocles, a Lynskey Sportive and a couple of others, but am thinking of treating myself to either a Cervelo S5 or a Specialized Venge in a few months when I turn 40, with the new SRAM Red (electronic shifting is the work of the devil!!!). Already have the wheels waiting for it - HED Stinger 6 tubs.

(Apologies to the rest of the group, but I figure bike geekery might be a step towards the better, given where this thread is going)

Yes, I was on Bikeforums but hardly ever visit it. Man, you are seriously Biked Up! My younger brother (also your age) is similar. He still races, and advises me on my bike purchases and bits and bobs. Today he sent me a text about the Ideal Number of Bikes to have. I'll repeat it here as it also applies to Binocular Ownership.
"The Mathematical Formula for the Ideal Number of Bicycles to own is N+1, where N= the Number of bicycles you already own.
Another version of this formula is D-1, where D= the number of bicycles that will cause your wife to divorce you".

I would further postulate that in the case of Binoculars, the "1" in both formulae above almost always refers to a Nikon EII 8x30, Swarovski SLC 15x56, or Zeiss FL 8x56 - binos we would all love to have, but for some reason have sold, or never get around to buying because we know in our heart of hearts that they would languish unused.
 
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First time I looked through an SE in while. I put them up to my eyes and went WOW! No wonder they are legendary they are seriously good optics! The SN 550846 means mine have the newer coatings and are eco glass. I am just going to discuss the optics and then award a winner between the two but first a few things about the binoculars. The Nikon EDG II 8x32 and Nikon 8x32 SE look similar in alot of ways. The armouring on both is almost identical and very comfortable. The focus on both also is very similar meaning very smooth with no rough gritty spots and equally smooth turning both ways. In other words perfect. Both of them have excellent ergonomics and balance and you can tell they are really quality. Weight is actually pretty close with the EDG weighing a couple of ounces more than the SE. Of course the EDG is waterproof and fogproof and focuses closer but both binoculars have very similar FOV's. Diopters work perfect on both and the IPD tension is perfect. I had no trouble with blackouts in the SE like some have reported. They work perfectly for me. The EDG has rollup eyecups while the SE has rubber but if the rubber eyecups hit the ER you need they work just as well as the rollups. These two binoculars represent one of the best porro prism binoculars made and one of the best roof prism binoculars made. In my opinion they are the best. Now, to the optics. Using both binoculars for a while and doing a little birding with them I noticed several things. The SE of course has a better 3D image and this can be be very beneficial in birding. The SE has also has better DOF which is also helpful because you don't have to focus as much as you do with the EDG II. CA in both was well controlled and I couldn't give the advantage to either because I could see very little CA in either binocular. The SE has better glare control which was obvious when observing near the sunset. The edges on both binoculars were almost the same being very sharp with a very slight advantage going to the EDG which is razor sharp right to the edge. When you look off center in the SE you can see a very, very slight fuzziness at the edge ,whereas, in the EDG the edge is razor sharp. Contrast in both is excellent and I would rate them equal. The Nikon SE 8x32 to my eyes has better contrast than the EII 8x30 which I just tried a few days ago and much sharper edges. When birding with the two I noticed the SE brought out fine gradations of color and hues that the EDG didn't. The SE could help you ID a bird in tough situations better than the EDG I feel because of this. Finally, I took the binoculars and compared resolution on a chart at about 20 feet away and I found the SE could resolve just a hair better than the EDG. Print was more readable with the SE and I think this is why the SE brings a little more detail out of the bird especially when you are looking into shadows and under cover. These are both amazingly good binoculars but I think the porro optically is a slight bit better which is amazing because it is 1/4 the price. It presents an awesome 3D sharp view that is hard to beat. I would have to give the title of the world's best binocular to the Nikon 8x32 SE. It is legendary but it deserves it. Buy one before they are all gone!
 
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The SN 550846 means

Dennis, you win: yours are 44 units newer than mine, which are cowering in shame. Have one on me. B :)

Nice review; I think you found a good solution to the optical corner you'd painted yourself into. You are keeping the SE, of course. But does this open the way to sample other roofs? :eek!:

David
 
First time I looked through an SE in while. I put them up to my eyes and went WOW! No wonder they are legendary they are seriously good optics! The SN 550846 means mine have the newer coatings and are eco glass. I am just going to discuss the optics and then award a winner between the two but first a few things about the binoculars. The Nikon EDG II 8x32 and Nikon 8x32 SE look similar in alot of ways. The armouring on both is almost identical and very comfortable. The focus on both also is very similar meaning very smooth with no rough gritty spots and equally smooth turning both ways. In other words perfect. Both of them have excellent ergonomics and balance and you can tell they are really quality. Weight is actually pretty close with the EDG weighing a couple of ounces more than the SE. Of course the EDG is waterproof and fogproof and focuses closer but both binoculars have very similar FOV's. Diopters work perfect on both and the IPD tension is perfect. I had no trouble with blackouts in the SE like some have reported. They work perfectly for me The EDG has rollup eyecups while the SE has rubber but if the rubber eyecups hit the ER you need they work just as well as the rollups. These two binoculars represent one of the best porro prism binoculars made and one of the best roof prism binoculars made. In my opinion they are the best. Now, to the optics. Using both binoculars for a while and doing a little birding with them I noticed several things. The SE of course has a better 3D image and this can be be very beneficial in birding. The SE has also has better DOF which is also helpful because you don't have to focus as much as you do with the EDG II. CA in both was well controlled and I couldn't give the advantage to either because I could see very little CA in either binocular. The SE has better glare control which was obvious when observing near the sunset. The edges on both binoculars were almost the same being very sharp with a very slight advantage going to the EDG which is razor sharp right to the edge. When you look off center in the SE you can see a very, very slight fuzziness at the edge ,whereas, in the EDG the edge is razor sharp. Contrast in both is excellent and I would rate them equal. The Nikon SE 8x32 to my eyes has better contrast than the EII 8x30 which I just tried a few days ago and much sharper edges. When birding with the two I noticed the SE brought out fine gradations of color and hues that the EDG didn't. The SE could help you ID a bird in tough situations better than the EDG I feel because of this. Finally, I took the binoculars and compared resolution on a chart at about 20 feet away and I found the SE could resolve just a hair better than the EDG. Print was more readable with the SE and I think this is why the SE brings a little more detail out of the bird especially when you are looking into shadows and under cover. These are both amazingly good binoculars but I think the porro optically is a slight bit better which is amazing because it is 1/4 the price. It presents an awesome 3D sharp view that is hard to beat. I would have to give the title of the world's best binocular to the Nikon 8x32 SE. It is legendary but it deserves it. Buy one before they are all gone!
Still going strong after all these years...
http://betterviewdesired.com/Nikon-Superior-E-8x32.php
 
First time I looked through an SE in while. I put them up to my eyes and went WOW! No wonder they are legendary they are seriously good optics! The SN 550846 means mine have the newer coatings and are eco glass. I am just going to discuss the optics and then award a winner between the two but first a few things about the binoculars. The Nikon EDG II 8x32 and Nikon 8x32 SE look similar in alot of ways. The armouring on both is almost identical and very comfortable. The focus on both also is very similar meaning very smooth with no rough gritty spots and equally smooth turning both ways. In other words perfect. Both of them have excellent ergonomics and balance and you can tell they are really quality. Weight is actually pretty close with the EDG weighing a couple of ounces more than the SE. Of course the EDG is waterproof and fogproof and focuses closer but both binoculars have very similar FOV's. Diopters work perfect on both and the IPD tension is perfect. I had no trouble with blackouts in the SE like some have reported. They work perfectly for me The EDG has rollup eyecups while the SE has rubber but if the rubber eyecups hit the ER you need they work just as well as the rollups. These two binoculars represent one of the best porro prism binoculars made and one of the best roof prism binoculars made. In my opinion they are the best. Now, to the optics. Using both binoculars for a while and doing a little birding with them I noticed several things. The SE of course has a better 3D image and this can be be very beneficial in birding. The SE has also has better DOF which is also helpful because you don't have to focus as much as you do with the EDG II. CA in both was well controlled and I couldn't give the advantage to either because I could see very little CA in either binocular. The SE has better glare control which was obvious when observing near the sunset. The edges on both binoculars were almost the same being very sharp with a very slight advantage going to the EDG which is razor sharp right to the edge. When you look off center in the SE you can see a very, very slight fuzziness at the edge ,whereas, in the EDG the edge is razor sharp. Contrast in both is excellent and I would rate them equal. The Nikon SE 8x32 to my eyes has better contrast than the EII 8x30 which I just tried a few days ago and much sharper edges. When birding with the two I noticed the SE brought out fine gradations of color and hues that the EDG didn't. The SE could help you ID a bird in tough situations better than the EDG I feel because of this. Finally, I took the binoculars and compared resolution on a chart at about 20 feet away and I found the SE could resolve just a hair better than the EDG. Print was more readable with the SE and I think this is why the SE brings a little more detail out of the bird especially when you are looking into shadows and under cover. These are both amazingly good binoculars but I think the porro optically is a slight bit better which is amazing because it is 1/4 the price. It presents an awesome 3D sharp view that is hard to beat. I would have to give the title of the world's best binocular to the Nikon 8x32 SE. It is legendary but it deserves it. Buy one before they are all gone!

Dennis:

Nice review and well done. I have had both of these binoculars and have
compared them and your results are very much as I see it.

I really enjoy the SE, and both of these binoculars are at the highest level.

I am a bit surprised you rank the 8x32 SE over the EDG, after your
recent big push of the EDG. But I see it that way also.

But, as far as the 10x42's go, I like to compare the SE and the EDG 10x42,
and the EDG, has the edge, in this comparison.

It seems the 8x32 SE, does really have it. :t:

Jerry
 
For all that bluster can someone teach Dennis how to make a freaking paragraph? It's a shame that I can't even bear to read the self proclaimed best reviews because it's a giant blob of undifferentiated text. Mix in some white space dude.
 
Evil one,
I enjoyed reading your review. Well, it does cause eyestrain, like no binocular review, of all things, should. I enjoyed the content I mean. Yaay for the aging champion! How bout that?
Ron
 
Dennis, you win: yours are 44 units newer than mine, which are cowering in shame. Have one on me. B :)

Nice review; I think you found a good solution to the optical corner you'd painted yourself into. You are keeping the SE, of course. But does this open the way to sample other roofs? :eek!:

David
No. I want to sample some other porro's! I am developing an appreciation for them. I like low price and superb optics. For some reason I am liking the 3D view also. Maybe I will try a Habicht some time but I think it would be hard to beat the SE's if they work for you. I am keeping both the EDG and SE's and the Sightron's. I need a waterproof pair and the EDG's are the best I have seen. For optics the SE is king. I forgot how sharp the edges are on the SE. They are almost as sharp as the EDG and for $600.00 what a bargain. I feel the coating improvements on the SE made a big difference. The contrast is really, really good on them now. I see very little CA on the SE's either even without ED glass. Pretty amazing glass for the money. One thing that surprised me about the SE's was the glare control. Looking right near the sun there was almost NO glare. They must have some good baffling in them. The EDG's had definitely more glare. The EDG and SE look alot alike. Almost like identically designed except one is a porro and one is a roof. Both are VERY nice binoculars!
 
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The Porro resolves fine color differences better than the roof, I wouldn't have expected anything else.

Bruce

I noticed the SE brought out fine gradations of color and hues that the EDG didn't.
Yes. That's it exactly. Fine color differences and gradations of black and white and the greys in between. I could pick out little differences on the birds that I couldn't on the EDG. The SE will out resolve by a small margin at about twenty feet also. Try it on a resolution chart or fine print inside.
 
So all along it would seem this thread was about finding something better than the EDG in order to allow you to change to another "best" roof having boxed yourself into a tight and unforgiving corner.

Nicely done review though Dennis. It would seem you can be informative and insightful when you leave the "high horse" tied up.

Hope to purchase an 8x32 SE soon.
 
I am sorry Dennis, but if the SE is optically better than the EDG than you didn't compare the best roof to the best porro. Because when I compared the SE to the 8x32 SV the SV was better, so logically it follows that the SV is better than the EDG ;-)
 
The 42mm EDG is number one on Allbino's so if they tested the 32mm EDG you know that it would be number one also. It's logical. Same optical formula,same glass etc. It beat the SV in the 42mm so it probably would in the 32mm. Let's be honest.
I don't have a dog in this fight, since I own neither. However, the 32mm EDG and SV are smaller so the SV may or may not receive a higher score for handling, as it could for any other of the subjective scores which make up the overall ranking. I don't think it can necessarily be a foregone conclusion. It could be an interesting test though!
 
I don't have a dog in this fight, since I own neither. However, the 32mm EDG and SV are smaller so the SV may or may not receive a higher score for handling, as it could for any other of the subjective scores which make up the overall ranking. I don't think it can necessarily be a foregone conclusion. It could be an interesting test though!
I would be surprised if the new 8x32 SV received a better score for handling than the 8x32 EDG II. Even though it is bigger and heavier the ergonomics and balance are excellent on the 8x32 EDG II. The balance is not as good though on the EDG I because I have had them both.
 
I am sorry Dennis, but if the SE is optically better than the EDG than you didn't compare the best roof to the best porro. Because when I compared the SE to the 8x32 SV the SV was better, so logically it follows that the SV is better than the EDG ;-)
Try the 20 foot resolution test with the 8x32 SE and new 8x32 SV with fine print. It might surprise you. I doubt there is ANY roof that will out resolve or bring out more detail and color hues than a fine porro. What area besides edge sharpness did the SV beat the SE? Next time when you are birding REALLY look at minute details on the bird and see if the SE doesn't bring out those fine details better. It's not real noticeable at first until you really look closely. You might be surprised. I was. I had an SV 8.5x42 and I did not find it superior to my EDG. It had rolling ball and a gritty uneven focus.
 
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So all along it would seem this thread was about finding something better than the EDG in order to allow you to change to another "best" roof having boxed yourself into a tight and unforgiving corner.

Nicely done review though Dennis. It would seem you can be informative and insightful when you leave the "high horse" tied up.

Hope to purchase an 8x32 SE soon.
Adorama has excellent service and they have the Nikon 8x32 SE in stock. But act fast it only shows one left.
 
I am sorry Dennis, but if the SE is optically better than the EDG than you didn't compare the best roof to the best porro. Because when I compared the SE to the 8x32 SV the SV was better, so logically it follows that the SV is better than the EDG ;-)

Not a fair test but my 8.5 sv is sharper than my EDG 8x32. My 8x32 el non sv is also sharper. The SV is also sharper than my FL or ultravid hd. My Steiner wildlife pro also compares well with EDG in the center. The EDG is a referb, but I've looked through many and it was better than the non referbs. Seriously considering selling the EDG.

Someone do the Official SV and SE test, please don't make me buy one. o:D

I have heard the SE is as good as the SV.
 
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