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Advice on best camera/lens combo (1 Viewer)

I use electronic shutter on my GX8,the rolling shutter effect with a panned shot containing a vertical can look awful,its called rolling shutter effect,its not just a few cameras its a down side to the electronic shutter,it only happens when panning,here is a reject i kept to show the effect,some one will come along and say it doesn't happen to them,well research it if in doubt.
 

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Just found another example of why you should avoid cameras that use electronic shutters (taken on my GX8),look at the small posts in the background,yes i could PP this one but imagine it was a tree.
I do share HermitIbis love of the Nikon V2,although i am selling mine as i no longer need a small camera since going to m4/3.
 

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I use electronic shutter on my GX8,the rolling shutter effect with a panned shot containing a vertical can look awful,its called rolling shutter effect,its not just a few cameras its a down side to the electronic shutter,it only happens when panning,here is a reject i kept to show the effect,some one will come along and say it doesn't happen to them,well research it if in doubt.

In the Robin Wong review of the Oly 1-ii, he describes why there is much less rolling shutter in that camera than in mk-1: the read out of the sensor happens about 5x faster, so the situations where the rolling shutter is visible are much fewer.

Niels
 
Just found another example of why you should avoid cameras that use electronic shutters (taken on my GX8),

Hi Mike. Just wanted to clarify something for the newer folks who maybe reading this thread. AFAIK, all m4/3 cameras have the option of using a mechanical or an electronic shutter. There would be any reason to avoid a camera simply because it has an option.

Moreover, in addition to Niels point about reduced rolling shutter effect in the EM-1 mk ii, reviews of the Panasonic G80/G85 indicate the shutter shock issue with its mechanical shutter has been virtually eliminated (think the same is true with the new Olympus), which eliminates one of the main reasons for resort to an electronic shutter.
 
shutter shock issue with its mechanical shutter -- What's that?

There has been a period where the movement of the shutter when it opened could induce shaking of the camera/lens in a way that could negatively affect the result. This is most pronounced around 1/100 s shutter time and is gone when the shutter is faster than 1/200 s. There are some combinations of camera and lens where this is more pronounced than others, but it has been seen in both panasonic and olympus cameras, and I feel I have seen reports that show the same effect in cameras from other manufacturers even though the name shutter shock may not have been applied. The cause has been speculated on in several different ways, but one thing changed in the G80/81/85 is that the opening of the shutter is different, it is only really the closing that is truly mechanical (if I have understood what is being said).

I have not really seen this issue mentioned with the new Oly em1-ii (positively or negatively).

How have I lived with this issue (my camera predates the fully electronic shutter): for other reasons, I prefer a shutter faster than 1/350 anyway (to freeze moving birds), so I am not affected by this in my normal shooting.

Niels
 
The effect on the photo of shutter shock is similar to camera shake.

This is most pronounced around 1/100 s shutter time and is gone when the shutter is faster than 1/200 s.

I have seen varying reports about what shutter speeds are most affected, and it probably varies somewhat from camera to camera. My Olympus EM-1 has a setting (I think added by a firmware update) that greatly reduces the effect, and it is designed to shutoff at shutter speeds of 1/320 sec or above. I have read reports that the EM-1 mk. ii does reduce the problem even further; of course it is completely eliminated if you use the electronic shutter.
 
This is a case where I might remember the numbers ("around 1/100") from Pana better because I have one.

The redesign of the shutter in G80 is one of the reasons that would be my preferred camera among the Panas currently available.

Niels
 
Hi Mike. Just wanted to clarify something for the newer folks who maybe reading this thread. AFAIK, all m4/3 cameras have the option of using a mechanical or an electronic shutter. There would be any reason to avoid a camera simply because it has an option.

Moreover, in addition to Niels point about reduced rolling shutter effect in the EM-1 mk ii, reviews of the Panasonic G80/G85 indicate the shutter shock issue with its mechanical shutter has been virtually eliminated (think the same is true with the new Olympus), which eliminates one of the main reasons for resort to an electronic shutter.


Wasnt suggesting avoid any camera with the option i was talking about the GX8 and the possible need (due to shutter shock)and so the consequences of using electronic shutters,you can also from what i understand lose some DR with electronic shutters.
As for any improvements with the EM1 MK11,it would have to filter its way down a few models before i could afford it|:D|
 
This is a case where I might remember the numbers ("around 1/100") from Pana better because I have one.

The redesign of the shutter in G80 is one of the reasons that would be my preferred camera among the Panas currently available.

Niels

This camera interests me but as yet i haven't found any reports on its ability to capture moving targets either AFS or AFC,have you seen any thing,sort of decided ime replacing my GX8 although its such a great camera especially for AFC on birds in flight.
 
Indeed I wanted to know what actually is shutter shock, so thanks all for the explainations! I had previously looked up the rolling shuter effect, but could not find anyhing clear on shutter shock...
 
However, I feel rather like just going for the best kit at once, shell out the money and then not worry any more for quite a while (the m4/3 with a 100-400 lens is about the biggest gear I currently can imagine to lug around). I did this with binoculars, just bought a Leica straight away, which I think saved me quite some money, ...

In recent years, the evolution of digital camera capability has been much more rapid than binoculars. That is perhaps even more true in the mirrorless interchangeable lens cameras (ICL) where features such as continuous autofocus are now at this moment making big strides. Even so, we already have cameras that are more than *good enough* to take great bird photos. More important than having the latest/greatest gear is learning to use the gear you have and getting out often with it to practice and find more lucky opportunities. I would simply caution you that although micro-4/3 camera improvements are becoming more incremental, we are still seeing some major improvements and lots of smaller refinements.

For those who are contemplating a new camera purchase right now, the very latest "flagship" Olympus E-M1 Mk II and Panasonic GH5 models costing ~US $2000 will probably be incrementally better in many ways, but the previous generation flagship or intermediate models are definitely a much better value. For example, the "old" flagship Olympus E-M1 is not quite as old as its 2013 release date would suggest, because there have been multiple firmware upgrades that significantly boosted functionality, and the E-M1 can be purchased for less than half the cost of the E-M1 Mk II. If you're willing to buy used I bet you could get one for only ~$300-400! Right now here in the states, you can get a brand-new E-M1 WITH the great general purpose 12-40mm f/2.8 Pro lens, an outstanding lens, for $1300, with a 4% reward on future purchase. A "normal" sale price for the 12-40mm lens is ~$800, so that is like getting the E-M1 brand-new for $500. So for customers who want to be more thrifty, one option is to wait and not pay full price for a new camera until you are more confident it will be your "last camera"... Lenses are generally longer term investments than camera bodies. However I must admit, I usually don't heed my own advice; I've squandered a large sum over the years chasing after better and better cameras...
|:d|
Dave
 
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A quick thought: Given that M4/3 cameras are still "not there", I'd seriously consider either waiting some more or getting a (reasonably) lightweight DSLR instead.

After all, a decent M4/3 body+the Leica/Panasonic 100-400mm is not cheap, and I still hear from users over here that the AF-C isn't quite up to scratch. That combination is also not that light, so you''re talking about something like 2kg of weight. There also about a stop difference minimum between the best M4/3 sensors and the best APS-C sensors with regard to high ISO capabilities.

There's a reason why virtually *all* birders here who carry a camera for record shots prefer a DSLRs over an M4/3. A DSLR is faster and the AF-C is more reliable.

Hermann
 
There's a reason why virtually *all* birders here who carry a camera for record shots prefer a DSLRs over an M4/3. A DSLR is faster and the AF-C is more reliable.

Hermann

I think you are wrong on what the reason is. Most birders do not carry a d500 or a 7dii and your statements only really carry for those. I personally think that once you are invested in a system with lenses, it is difficult and expensive to change and that is the biggest reason that more people have canikon.

Niels
 
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