2012 UK Orchid season updates (4 Viewers)

Lorne · Jun 27, 2012

Dorset

Hi all, Fearnor posted one of the atrofuscus on the 23rd, at Radipole RSPB there are now 3 plants in different areas, just 1 in the same place as the last 2 years. Several normal Bee & at least one very odd. Also just up the road by another part of the RSPB we have now found a belgarum, for me the 1st for Dorset. Unfortunately no fulvofusca yet this year.

leptochila · Jun 27, 2012

Since we're on a Bee orchid theme; here are 3 abnormal plants photographed 2 days ago at my local site. The one verging on trollii and the one with extra long petals are new to me at this site.

Mike.

Kumba · Jun 27, 2012

Var Bi-Color

From Warwickshire

the young hunter said:
Since we're on a Bee orchid theme; here are 3 abnormal plants photographed 2 days ago at my local site. The one verging on trollii and the one with extra long petals are new to me at this site.

Mike.

johnstagg · Jun 27, 2012

rmielcarek said:
Common Spotted numbers locally seem to be down this year, and they are also harder to find because the grass in the meadows is so tall this summer.

Went to a site today that has held var rhodochila in the past but couldn't find one in a quick search.

Earlier in the week I did find this quite heavily pigmented plant.

Rich M

We found this variant rhodochila amongst the Common Spotteds at a site in Somerset yesterday.
John

Ghostly Vision · Jun 27, 2012

Lorne said:
Hi all, Fearnor posted one of the atrofuscus on the 23rd, at Radipole RSPB there are now 3 plants in different areas, just 1 in the same place as the last 2 years. Several normal Bee & at least one very odd. Also just up the road by another part of the RSPB we have now found a belgarum, for me the 1st for Dorset. Unfortunately no fulvofusca yet this year.

Hi Lorne

Good to see you are still out and about.

fulvofusca is the name that has "replaced" atrofuscus. As such, not sure what you mean by your statement?
Sean

Ghostly Vision · Jun 27, 2012

byronmachin said:
Hi Alan, the photo was taken with a flash, as it was late evening and the woodland was very dark. Broad Leaved Helleborine are the only species growing in this woodland. No other Helleborines have ever been recorded in a wide distance of the area. I am heading back tommorow night and will take photo's of the neighbouring plant and check the area for others, then post on here. Byron

Hi Byron

I thought Violet helleborine had been recorded before in north Staffs?

I would like to visit your site if you could email me the details, or maybe we could meet up?

The stage of flowering would indicate Broad-leaved helleborine rather than Violet, which would hardly be above ground yet. Alan, where did you get that name for the acrollophyllous E helleborine?

Sean

rmielcarek · Jun 27, 2012

Ghostly Vision said:
Hi Lorne

Good to see you are still out and about.

fulvofusca is the name that has "replaced" atrofuscus. As such, not sure what you mean by your statement?
Sean

Sean

Surely Lorne is saying that none of the plants photographed qualify as fulvofusca?

Rich M

Ghostly Vision · Jun 27, 2012

Obvious when you point it out Richard!

But Lorne's first pic seems pretty good?

Sean

rmielcarek · Jun 27, 2012

Ghostly Vision said:
Obvious when you point it out Richard!

But Lorne's first pic seems pretty good?

Sean

Actually the first and third photos seem to show a lip that is devoid of any markings which is what defines fulvofusca.

Both have a paler area at the base but the photo in Scrugli and Grasso (who first described this variant) seems to show such a pale area, maybe not quite so obvious (although I only have the page as a rather poor pdf). I've just looked at my pics of the 2010 Radipole plant and some (older?) flowers on that had a slightly paler base.

Maybe Lorne can clarify as he has actually seen the plants?

Rich M

IJS · Jun 27, 2012

Been to a lovely site this evening to see fragrant orchids. Absolutley loads at this site. Lots of common spotted and twayblades too. The butterfly orchids had gone over however. While the pyramidal were just opening up. I spotted a couple of varieties, one was a pure white fragrant and the other was a great hybrid fragrant x common spotted.

leptochila · Jun 27, 2012

Ghostly Vision said:
Alan, where did you get that name for the acrollophyllous E helleborine?

Sean

It's named in Harraps as monotropoides with albiflora apparently a synonym.

Would be interested to see this plant in flower.

Mike.

davidearlgray · Jun 28, 2012

byronmachin said:
Hi Alan, the photo was taken with a flash, as it was late evening and the woodland was very dark. Broad Leaved Helleborine are the only species growing in this woodland. No other Helleborines have ever been recorded in a wide distance of the area. I am heading back tommorow night and will take photo's of the neighbouring plant and check the area for others, then post on here. Byron

Hi Byron, do you know what the soil type in the wood is? As I have a theory that most Helleborines are affected by the Ph of the soil.
It looks like a very interesting plant!

Cheers,
Dave.

Robert S J Smith · Jun 28, 2012

Was wondering if anybody on here could help me with Common Twayblade in West Norfolk? I realise it's quite late in the season for them but I'd really appreciate a PM for next year. All the sites I check turned up nowt

Cheers,

Robert

Bodhyfryd · Jun 28, 2012

Two surprises at Alyn Waters

This is my first post.

I was interested to see a post about a sighting of Common spotted orchid var. Rhodochila in Somerset. Today I went to Alyn Waters, (nr Wrexham, N Wales) and was directed to a single specimen (probably just past its peak) of this variety.

The other surprise at this local site was to see quite a few Dune Helleborines - not yet fully in flower - another week or two, I should think. We had been over to Anglesey to Newborough Warren last week, but had certainly not expected to find them on our doorstep - well away from dunes. They were growing in the margins of light woodland on the Nature Reserve. Does anyone know how long they have been here?

heakl · Jun 28, 2012

Ghostly Vision said:
Alan, where did you get that name for the acrollophyllous E helleborine?

Sean

Where did you get acrollophyllous from Sean? Not in my dictionary, and no results when I googled it! do you mean lacking chlorophyll?

Var. monotropoides is in Harrap 2005.

More to the point of this thread, a google search for "broad-leaved helleborine" + monotropoides will give several results, including:-

http://www.bsbi.org.uk/WarksBotanicalReport2011.pdf

There is a photograph of monotropoides on the first page, and yes, it does have a purple stem, exactly as Byron's photograph.

Alan

Lorne · Jun 28, 2012

Hi there, I have to say that looking at my pics again it does look like the 3rd one is poss a fulvofusca? I think if anyone would like to go back to the originals they can be checked out here; http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=174590&page=2
This does seem to be an odd year for bees, I have to say that checking Portland I could not find any! When I realised they were out at Radipole & Lodmoor I did the long walk down to Dancing Ledge, Every year hundreds of early spider followed by large numbers of bee, even if the weather has been against them. For the 1st time in poss 15 years not a single one! But oddly, after crossing back towards Winspit & expecting none there either, we started to find them. In the past poss a third there would be trollii, when there are hundreds this must be the best site for them in the UK. This time I could only find one. Others are starting to look like belgarum which this year appear to be spreading from their original site on the roundabout at Winchester.
I have also been up to Fontmell Down to check the bees there in the hope of finding some bicolour, no luck but did find this???(not bee) Poss pseudopeloric or as Rich says sepaloid?

rmielcarek · Jun 28, 2012

Lorne said:
I have also been up to Fontmell Down to check the bees there in the hope of finding some bicolour, no luck but did find this???(not bee) Poss pseudopeloric or as Rich says sepaloid?

Blimey Lorne, hard to work out which bit is what on that one. I take it it's a Fragrant, judging by the colour?

Rich

slatts · Jun 29, 2012

At Noar Hill on a glorious sunny afternoon you could see seven different orchids which is about 12% of our native species in one place. Abundant musk now, common spot and fragrant starting to go over but still some nice ones. Saw three nice frogs and about a dozen coming. Two bee orchids on their last flower, lots of very nice twayblades everywhere, and a few pyramidals right out plus loads to come. Plus a superb early evening serenade from a songthrush

fgrsimon · Jun 29, 2012

One Red Helleborine in flower at the Glos site last weekend, just about visible to the naked eye from the fence if you look carefully. Only had my 50mm Macro lens with me but it was just enough to confirm the id for certain and that one flower is open, with two or three to come.

Will return this weekend with my 300mm and a lot of patience...

Got a guided tour of Sandwich this evening with a wonderful chap called John Vanderdol of Sandwich Bird Tours. Saw Bees, Southern Marsh, Pyramidals, Marsh Helleborines (not quite in flower yet) and of course Lizards, hundreds of them. He said the site has been surveyed and the estimate is that there may be as many as 30,000 in total in the Sandwich area!

rmielcarek · Jun 29, 2012

Odd Bees

Si Mackie, who has a knack for finding odd looking Bees, found the plant in the two left hand photos yesterday in a private field.

Superficially it resembles a var friburgensis (syn botteronii). Although the split basal shield and the messy patterning on the lip are fine for that variety, on closer examination the pink petals aren't really wide enough (and have rolled edges) and the lip shape is all wrong, more like a var belgarum.

This morning when I visited I found a couple of var belgarum close by and you can see how it could have mutated from them.

In the same field there was another, rather battered, oddity with a broad yellow band across the tip of the lip.

Oh what fun these Bees are.

Rich M

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