• Welcome to BirdForum, the internet's largest birding community with thousands of members from all over the world. The forums are dedicated to wild birds, birding, binoculars and equipment and all that goes with it.

    Please register for an account to take part in the discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.
ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

After a year with an 8.5x42 SV FPro. (1 Viewer)

Hi Bruce,

Just wanted to say I enjoy reading your posts whenever I see them. They always provide good information and are easily read.

The much more notciable shake may be partly due to the much greater size, weight and forward balance of the 50 mm compared to a 42 mm. The 10X50 mm is a heavy beast and I find it harder to hold steady free hand compared to a 10X42. It is also more front heavy with the 50 mm of glass up front.

It would interesting if you notice the same amount of additional shake comparing your 8.5X42 with a Swaro EL SV 10X42. I suspect you will find some due to the additional magnification but not as much of a difference that you found comparing to the 10X50.

You know, I neglected to try the 10x42 even though it was sitting there. It did not cross my mind since I was more interested in the bigger exit pupil and bigger field of view of the 10x50. I will keep a note to try the 10x42 next time I stop by there.

I was out yesterday evening using a recently acquired Opticron 10X42 BGA VHD iMagic. It is relatively light for a 42 mm weighing only 24.6 oz (no strap or caps) and is relatively small in size. The place was an area of large open water reclaim ponds with no place to brace. I found the iMagic to be easier to hold steady than most other 10X binoculars I have used. I attribute a lot of that to the lighter weight and the smaller size putting the balance in the hands. It is a very nice binocular.

That is interesting. I will have to try that model as well when I am tempted by higher power again. The price is nice as well. I wonder though, as an owner of some nice high end binoculars, do you find going to a "lower class" binocular lacking at all? Not to sound like a snob; a real concern of mine when buying my Swarovski was not being able to satisfyingly bird with cheaper optics again.

I have not noticed any difference in my ability to get a subject in focus between using my 10X50 EL SV and the 12X50. I will have to watch for that in the future. Did you find it more difficult to achieve a quick focus with your 8.5X compared to the 12X?

I found with the greater depth of field of the 8.5x, it was easier to get things in focus than both the 10x and 12x. I know this somewhat contradicts my reasoning for why the 12x was easier to focus with than the 10x, but I'm having trouble putting it into words.

The 10X50 and the 12X50 are more special purpose binoculars for my use. Your 8.5X42 does sound like a great all round general purpose choice. If I wanted just one binocular, then I can see the case for the 8.5X as a compromise for the advantages for both. However in my case, going with both a 8X and 10X, then I would go with an 8X over a 8.5X to get more of the advantages of the lower magnification (less shake, more depth of field, larger exit pupil).

Yes I planned on only having one binocular, but the more time I spend here the more I am tempted to try others. They are fun to read about.
 
Jack ..... Thanks for the kind words. I appreciate it. I have also been enjoying your posts, especially the one in another forum on the different types of birders.

http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=350500

......
You know, I neglected to try the 10x42 even though it was sitting there. It did not cross my mind since I was more interested in the bigger exit pupil and bigger field of view of the 10x50. I will keep a note to try the 10x42 next time I stop by there.
........

If you do get a chance to compare the 10X42 and 10X50, then please let us know if you find any difference in shake. There is a good chance you will find the 10X42 easier to hold. It should be about the same as your 8.5X Swaro expect for the small magnification difference. I thought the 8.5X has a comfortable design with good balance.


..........
That is interesting. I will have to try that model as well when I am tempted by higher power again. The price is nice as well. I wonder though, as an owner of some nice high end binoculars, do you find going to a "lower class" binocular lacking at all? Not to sound like a snob; a real concern of mine when buying my Swarovski was not being able to satisfyingly bird with cheaper optics again.
..........

I am not sure where you are at but Opticron does have local dealers, mainly in Audubon Society shops and specialty stores. The iMagic BGA VHD is a recent model so it may not be at all dealers. Opticron is probably the most active manufacturer in attending birding festivals around the country so those are a great place to see most of their products.

http://www.opticronusa.com/Pages/dealers.html
http://www.opticronusa.com/Pages/festivals.html

As to the question of do I find the less expensive binoculars lacking compared to the high end, generally the answer is no. Obviously a Swaro 8.5X42 EL SV or a Zeiss SF will provide a noticeably better view than a Zeiss Terra and sometimes I have come across a viewing situation where I wished I had a higher end binocular, but most of the time I am satisfied with what I am using. That is because I try to match the binocular to the type of viewing I am going to do. The truth is, much of the time, the quality of the view or the requirements of the view, are not up to the capabilities of the higher end binoculars.

A good example is the use of the 10X42 iMagic the other day mentioned above. The location was the Glendale Rechaarge Ponds that consist of six large shallow basins that are alternately filled with about a foot or so of water to percolate into the ground and recharge the ground water. This is a bare open environment. Here are some Google image links to give an idea of what it is like.

http://www.birderfrommaricopa.com/user/cimage/a-glendale-recharge-pond-overview-gop9g.jpg
http://www.birderfrommaricopa.com/user/cimage/108.JPG
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/O_yef-HJU32m7KfPlenE3kQgYuFeFp2UC8QE3u6bKFfkBhES_rWq=w800-h533
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-MRV7wG2-Q4g/TxNAni6JgbI/AAAAAAAADiE/p6sGG3rGcrk/s1600/DSC08966.jpg

It is just west of the Arizona Cardinals Football Statium.
http://www.birderfrommaricopa.com/user/cimage/118.JPG

The photos show that there is nothing scenic, it is bare without any supports for bracing and the views can be quite far as there is no way you can sneak up on the birds. The great features of the Swaro 10X50 would not really come into play here. Even though it has better contrast, there is really nothing in the view to take advantage of it. The place is ugly and the birds are usually to far to get a close view of the feather detail or other features.

In theory, the Swaro should make it easier to get an id but in reality, the birds are so far that it does not make a material difference. Other factors such as shape, behavior and general color patterns come more into play rather than picking up micro contrast detail. I think it is actually easier to pick up more detail in this situation with the iMagic because I can hold it steadier longer when I have to do it free hand. That is important because there were hundreds of birds in the ponds and it takes time to pick out the different species. So in this situation, I thought the iMagic was an excellent tool for the situation and I was not let down at all. I have been out there just before dark and in that situation I used the 10X50 and it was the best choice.

It is amazing how good the less expensive models are getting. I do not have any that would be a disappointment. However when the light, the subject and the surrounding environment are right, then the high end is spectacular. If I think I will have a chance for those types of views then I will take the more expensive stuff. I will also go with them when doing more difficult viewing and looking to pick out fine detail. Game spotting is an example where you are trying to find a nose, an ear, a tail or distinguish between an antler or a tree limb.

I think the 8.5X42 Swaro EL SV is a great choice for a single binocular because it can do it all with not a lot of compromises. It may lack a little in magnification for the long views but even that may not be an issue if someone has trouble holding a 10X steady. The only caution (other than the high price) on the 8.5X Swaro is some folks (such as me) pick up rolling ball and can not adjust.

All of that being said, I think there are some very good quality less expensive models out there and I doubt you would have issues switching between one of those and the 8.5X Swaro in most cases.

.......
I found with the greater depth of field of the 8.5x, it was easier to get things in focus than both the 10x and 12x. I know this somewhat contradicts my reasoning for why the 12x was easier to focus with than the 10x, but I'm having trouble putting it into words.
.........

It may be that since you were able to hold the 12X as steady as the 10X, it was easier to see the detail with the 12X and that allowed you to focus faster.

.........
Yes I planned on only having one binocular, but the more time I spend here the more I am tempted to try others. They are fun to read about.

There is nothing wrong with just staying with one binocular but then again, there is nothing wrong with having more. The 12X you mentioned earlier may be better suited for different viewing situations so I can see a potential for getting a second model. Also, if you are a binocular enthusiast, then it is a lot of fun evaluating and using the different models. Each provides a different experience. Either way, I hope you stay with us.
 
Bruce, that was an excellent explanation. Thank you for taking the time to put that all into words and providing pictures for context. Bravo, truly. :clap:

You have given me much to think about. I have always tried to gravitate towards just owning one binocular that can do it all, but as you have explained, there is merit in having multiple binoculars, even multiple of the same magnification. Hmmm tradeoffs...

You have also helped quell my fear of dissatisfaction when moving down a rung to "mid class" binoculars. I will approach all models with an open mind. Your opinion that the mid class being close to the top tier optics is mirrored by others in the forum. I admit, when I was considering a new binocular, I was overwhelmed by the myriad of options. I decided not to wade too deeply and stick with the model I had tried and liked in the past: the 8.5x42. Perhaps I could have been just as happy with a cheaper model, but the buying-trying-returning cycle of shopping over the internet did not appeal to me.

I would like to go to a birding festival sometime, but it looks like there are none in my area in the near future. No opticron dealers around me either, though I do plan on going to the bay area in a couple months and I see at least one dealer there. Depending on her schedule, Mrs. Speer may be able to come and try out some optics too (busy one she is). Opticron seems like a nice birding focused company, and that is something she values.
 
Bruce:

A well done review, and I agree with your thoughts. I have been a 8.5x42 EL user for well over 10 years,
and recall Swarovski promoted this model as the "universal distance viewer".

That holds true today, and is why this model is very popular.

Jerry
 
Thanks Lee, Patudo, Jack and Jerry for the positive feedback!

Jack .... The festivals are a great way to see various optics. Some just have tours and workshops but many will have an exhibitor tent and many of those will have one or more optic vendors. Opticron is by far the most active in attending festivals here in the U.S. Zeiss, Swaro and Leica and sometimes Celestron are good at attending the major events. Canon will be at some majors but mainly promoting large mm camera lenses. I can not think at the moment of any birding events currently attended by Nikon. They do attend a few hunting and firearms events which are also a good place to check out optics. I suspect Tract and new comer GPO will be more active in birding events in the future. Most of the vendor exhibits are inside but the vendors are real good about letting you take models outside. It is a great way to see a lot of optics and get to meet with the factory reps. Some are contracted and others are true employees. Most all have a strong outdoor background.

Keep checking the Opticron U.S. show schedule to see if there is a festival attended by optic vendors near you. If you do go, consider taking your 8.5X42 Swaro with you. You can learn so much more about a binocular if you have another to compare against, especially if it is one you know well. Your Swaro is about as good as it gets so it is a great benchmark for comparison.
 
So many happy 8.5 user ... reading all this helps a lot !

I am having a hard time too deciding which binoculars are best for me, except I only need ONE pair ;) Sounds like an expensive obsession to get the perfect binocular collection ...

As we need one pair that does it all it will be the 8.5x42 ! I could test it, it is a joy to use, everybody in here recommends it, customer service top notch and we live next to the Swarovski Europe Office ... easy decision right ?

Today I could compare the 8x32 FP vs the 8.5x42 FP and the glare is almost non existent with the 42 (a little bit around the edges) whereas the 32 showed a pretty ugly grey veil from time to time. Only when I tried to push it to the limit but still it was there. Just like some users reported earlier in here. I too love the 32 but the 42 sounds like the saver option. Almost glare free so to speak. No rolling ball or any kind of sea sickness with the two although the first time panning in the woods is maybe a bit much for a human brain. I am simply not used to such an effect. After half an hour no problems at all.

The weight difference was surprising, these are really two different binoculars. You forget the 32 very quick, the 42 you know what your holding in your hand all the time. No friend of hanging them around the neck, so can´t comment on that.

We have a 7x42 Dialyt at home and somehow I have trouble holding it steady. With the two EL´s I had no problem at all. So maybe the newer binoculars just have better weight balance or I had a strong day. The Field Pro Package I could live without but it is there and it´s ok. I remove all straps anyway.

The built quality seems ok though I think every binocular in this price range should offer way more perfection. No matter if Zeiss, Leica or Swarovski. They all have their weak sides and this can be done better. In terms of build quality I am a fan of Leica. They are special when you grab them, at least to me. I never owned one, they don´t fit my eyes and are not waterproof ;)

The 32 focuser seemed broken, the 42 focuser was good by the way. I am no huge fan of the EL focuser but they work. 2300 Euros ! The focus knob needs a more premium feel to it !
The green color is nice in person, looks almost grey. Very nice.

The optical performance is well described above, just my two cents testing these wonderful binoculars, we really look forward using them.
 
Just back from another enjoyable trip to North Norfolk, finally manage to see a Yellow Browed Warbler so very pleased. The SVFP continues to impress and never put a foot wrong in varying weather and light, at times I used it tripod mounted looking out to sea, I was equally able to identify Common Scoters at distance just as easily as a friend with a 10x42, in fact when tripod mounted I really start to appreciate the whole field sharpness, its a staggering view when stabilised in this way.
 
So many happy 8.5 user ... reading all this helps a lot !

I am having a hard time too deciding which binoculars are best for me, except I only need ONE pair ;) Sounds like an expensive obsession to get the perfect binocular collection ...

As we need one pair that does it all it will be the 8.5x42 ! I could test it, it is a joy to use, everybody in here recommends it, customer service top notch and we live next to the Swarovski Europe Office ... easy decision right ?

Today I could compare the 8x32 FP vs the 8.5x42 FP and the glare is almost non existent with the 42 (a little bit around the edges) whereas the 32 showed a pretty ugly grey veil from time to time. Only when I tried to push it to the limit but still it was there. Just like some users reported earlier in here. I too love the 32 but the 42 sounds like the saver option. Almost glare free so to speak. No rolling ball or any kind of sea sickness with the two although the first time panning in the woods is maybe a bit much for a human brain. I am simply not used to such an effect. After half an hour no problems at all.

The weight difference was surprising, these are really two different binoculars. You forget the 32 very quick, the 42 you know what your holding in your hand all the time. No friend of hanging them around the neck, so can´t comment on that.

We have a 7x42 Dialyt at home and somehow I have trouble holding it steady. With the two EL´s I had no problem at all. So maybe the newer binoculars just have better weight balance or I had a strong day. The Field Pro Package I could live without but it is there and it´s ok. I remove all straps anyway.

The built quality seems ok though I think every binocular in this price range should offer way more perfection. No matter if Zeiss, Leica or Swarovski. They all have their weak sides and this can be done better. In terms of build quality I am a fan of Leica. They are special when you grab them, at least to me. I never owned one, they don´t fit my eyes and are not waterproof ;)

The 32 focuser seemed broken, the 42 focuser was good by the way. I am no huge fan of the EL focuser but they work. 2300 Euros ! The focus knob needs a more premium feel to it !
The green color is nice in person, looks almost grey. Very nice.

The optical performance is well described above, just my two cents testing these wonderful binoculars, we really look forward using them.

I got the 8x32 EL FP two weeks ago, and agree the focuser is very average. It felt way too slow to focus and also plasticy. Funny thing is that I love the Swarovski CL 8x25 focuser as it is relatively quick and smooth. I have made the EL 8x32 focusers smoother by winding them up and down a few hundred times.

Anyway just a very average design for the EL focusing system I guess. But I love the FOV , light and the field flatenners.
 
Something that I still do not understand is why people choose a 42 over a 32 because of low light performance. I am comparing the El 32 with the 42 since a few days and can't for the life of me see a difference that justifies the bigger glas.
Sure there is a difference but so tiny it's not even worth talking about.
When the sun went down and it got darker I could not see more with the 42, all details are gone anyway till both binoculars gave me a good run focusing something. If one does not know for sure if let's say a tree is in focus because the light is gone how do they pick a deer ?
 
Something that I still do not understand is why people choose a 42 over a 32 because of low light performance. I am comparing the El 32 with the 42 since a few days and can't for the life of me see a difference that justifies the bigger glas.
Sure there is a difference but so tiny it's not even worth talking about.
When the sun went down and it got darker I could not see more with the 42, all details are gone anyway till both binoculars gave me a good run focusing something. If one does not know for sure if let's say a tree is in focus because the light is gone how do they pick a deer ?

Personally, I find a 42mm is always more comfortable with extended viewing, the 5mm exit pupil makes it easier to let the eyes roam around, better depth perception, a more 3d view, I loved the 32mm apart from the veiling glare issue, personally its not all about a brighter view with the 42mm.
 
Something that I still do not understand is why people choose a 42 over a 32 because of low light performance. I am comparing the El 32 with the 42 since a few days and can't for the life of me see a difference that justifies the bigger glas.
Sure there is a difference but so tiny it's not even worth talking about.
When the sun went down and it got darker I could not see more with the 42, all details are gone anyway till both binoculars gave me a good run focusing something. If one does not know for sure if let's say a tree is in focus because the light is gone how do they pick a deer ?

Assuming you compared bins of the same (or almost same) magnification, your experience suggests that your pupils do not open wide enough for the extra light of the x42 to enter your eye and thus make a difference. If it could, you'd see a big difference in low light, especially with moving subjects that don't allow prolonged observation.

That said, I pick 8.5x42 for the reasons Torview gave, not low light performance.

--AP
 
Personally, I find a 42mm is always more comfortable with extended viewing, the 5mm exit pupil makes it easier to let the eyes roam around, better depth perception, a more 3d view, I loved the 32mm apart from the veiling glare issue, personally its not all about a brighter view with the 42mm.

Yes, bigger EP is definitely more comfortable especially with eyeglasses.
Recently, I almost acquired a Zeiss FL 8x32. It is very clearly better optically (build and mechanics as well) than my Viper 6x32. Thought about the FL replacing my 6x32.
However, the Viper remains since it is just more comfortable viewing with glasses. Also the image is calmer (less shake). Even 1mm difference in EP is noticeable to me.
 
Lately I`v taken every opportunity to check my SV` glare control as this was such a major problem for me on the 32mm model.

I`v come to the conclusion that the level of flare/glare is so low in the 42mm FP that it is effectively a non issue, at times there is some evidence to be seen but it has no meaningful impact on the view.

The SVFP easily outperformed my UVHD+ and Meopta B1 on glare/flare control and both these models are generally rated as very good in this area.

All things considered, the new armour (in a league of its own imho), the now faultless focus and diopter system, the FP strap system, the c/a free high contrast image and the Swarovski service reputation still put this model as close to perfection as I`v found in a one binocular for all needs purchase.
 
.....
.....
.....
The SVFP easily outperformed my UVHD+ and Meopta B1 on glare/flare control and both these models are generally rated as very good in this area.

All things considered ..... still put this model as close to perfection as I`v found in a one binocular for all needs purchase.


I feel the same way about the 8.5x42. Still one of my very favorites !

Regarding your remark about glare control etc.: in my experience, much depends on how you place your eyes behind the eyepieces, and that is particularly true with the 8x32 EL. Some models seem to be more „prone to encourage a wrong eye placement“ than others (and that´s a big part of the reason why different people rate different glasses so differently), although I would of course agree that in some bincoculars, straylight and glare control is better than in others.
 
I recently examined an old (probably 10 years) 8.5X42 El (2nd version with faster focus) alongside an SV and Field Pro. The not so surprising conclusion was the oldest, and well used, 8.5X42 was almost indistinguishable from the later models. There wasn't a thing wrong with it, optically or mechanically.

We often nitpick over differences that, in many cases, mean absolutely nothing to a birder. I'd happily use the older model as my one and only optic.
 
...The not so surprising conclusion was the oldest, and well used, 8.5X42 was almost indistinguishable from the later models. There wasn't a thing wrong with it, optically or mechanically....I'd happily use the older model as my one and only optic.

I agree! I have access to early and late examples of the 8.5x42 - a 2003 EL WB (upgraded by SONA), and a 2015 SV, and I slightly prefer the view through the older one. Both are superb instruments, and I could be happy with either. I consider the design to be one of the best all-round birding binoculars ever, right up there with the Zeiss 7x42B/GAT. Just my opinion, of course.
 
I notice online retailers sell the green version of the field pro but so have also seen what looks like a grey version too. Are these offered in two different colors? Or are they different models?
 
Warning! This thread is more than 6 years ago old.
It's likely that no further discussion is required, in which case we recommend starting a new thread. If however you feel your response is required you can still do so.

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top