New Nikon Monarch X (1 Viewer)

FrankD · Jul 20, 2009

Patric,

Interesting comment about the edge sharpness. I briefly looked through one a month or so ago at a local birding store. I thought the edge sharpness on that particular unit was quite good. I just don't remember if it was the 10x or 8.5x version.

Nothing spectacular mind you but better than the typical $300 roof.

ceasar · Jul 20, 2009

I hope so Frank!

They cost $599.00!

http://www.eagleoptics.com/binoculars/nikon/nikon-monarch-x-10-5x45-binocular

Bob

FrankD · Jul 20, 2009

Bob,

Yeah, well you know how that goes these days. With $500 price jumps on some brands' models with no apparent change to the design I am not ruling anything out.

Swedpat · Jul 20, 2009

Hi again,

Yes, my honestly impression was that there are better binoculars in that pricerange. Also compared Swarovski SLCNew7x42B to Zeiss Victory FL 7x42, and tried Nikon HG 8x32 and 10x42 on the same occasion at the dealer. In my opinion all these were far superior to Monarch X.

Regards, Patric

Steve C · Jul 20, 2009

I was not favorably impressed by the first impression of the Monarch X either. I think it is an ergonomic disaster with that rod between the hinges, but I realize that may well be just me. The view is OK, but it cannot stand a side by side with the ZEN ED, which is a lot less money and a lot better image and a much wider fov. For the price they ask, there is certainly something lacking.

Swedpat · Jul 20, 2009

Steve C,

I have read about Zen Ed binoculars, and understand they are very good for the price? Also Vortex are good, especially Razor serie, but are Zen ED even better? I experienced the on-axis sharpness of razor 8x42 exceed my Swarovski SLCNew 7x42B.

Regards, Patric

Steve C · Jul 20, 2009

Patrick,

I don't know what else there is to be said about the ZEN ED. For what they cost, they just about have to be seen to be believed. I do think the ZEN has a bit brighter and maybe a bit sharper image than the Razor.

Swedpat · Jul 20, 2009

Thanks Steve,

I understand I have to try some of these Zen ED's! According to what you tell me they likely are Zeiss Victory FL challengers, but to a much lower price!

Regards, Patric

Pileatus · Jul 20, 2009

Swedpat said:
Thanks Steve,

I understand I have to try some of these Zen ED's! According to what you tell me they likely are Zeiss Victory FL challengers, but to a much lower price!

Regards, Patric

Patric,

Plain and simple, the Zen does not rival the Zeiss FL.

John

Swedpat · Jul 20, 2009

John,

The foundation of my thought is just that I found as well Razor 8x42 and Victory FL 7x42 to be sharper(on axis) than SLCNew 7x42. This does not mean I prefer these instead of the SLC because SLC 7x42 is the best when it comes to sweet spot, eye relief and viewing comfort. But the difference it's quite small between them all, though it's noticable with a careful comparison. If Zen ED is sharper than Razor it has to be very close to Victory FL.

Regards, Patric

Kevin Purcell · Jul 21, 2009

John Traynor said:
Plain and simple, the Zen does not rival the Zeiss FL.

Have you used both, John?

I find for sharpness it does in fact rival the FL.

The FL has some other advantages: slightly brighter and a bit better contrast (they go together) and better in-field/edge of field/out of field stray light control when the light gets tough but that doesn't diminish the ZR performance.

Steve C · Jul 21, 2009

Patrick,

I guess it depends on how one defines "rival". The truth of the matter is that the image of the ZEN ED class of binocular is quite competitive with the image of the alpha on many levels. In reality, this is a comparison of $2,000 US binoculars with $400 US binoculars. In the light of day, it is unrealistic to try to postulate equality between the two. If you have a ZEN and one of the alphas, you will eventually be able to seperate differences at several levels that favor the alpha binocular. But, you really need both side by side. Or you need to have enough knowledge to be able to seperate small differences.

These Chinese binoculars have decreased the performance difference levels enjoyed by the alphas more than anything else since Pentax first phase corrected the DCF WP. The new dielectric coatings of the ED 2 will close the gap a bit more.

Back to the Monarch X, it is behind the open bridge ED's from ZEN et. al.

Swedpat · Jul 21, 2009

Steve,

I understand this may be quite subjective, because there are several factors included.
I agree what you are saying, because Swarovski SLC, though not as sharp on-axis as Zeiss Victory FL, not at all (in my opinion) is much worse in this respect. (many people actually have hard to see a substantial difference between a midprice and high-end binocular.) Therefore I consider a binocular sharper than SLC to be close to Victory FL.

Regards, Patric

Pileatus · Jul 21, 2009

Kevin Purcell said:
Have you used both, John?

I find for sharpness it does in fact rival the FL.

The FL has some other advantages: slightly brighter and a bit better contrast (they go together) and better in-field/edge of field/out of field stray light control when the light gets tough but that doesn't diminish the ZR performance.

I've seen a lot of $300 roof binoculars and many more inexpensive porros that were "sharp". The Zen is very nice but, as you said, the FL has other advantages.

John

FrankD · Jul 21, 2009

Patric,

I think both John and Steve are correct. The ED glass design of the Zen EDs makes them exceptionally sharp. The FLs are even sharper though...or should I say "apparently sharper". Issues such as contrast and brightness certainly play a part in that that and the FLs are the brightest bins I have ever owned.

I think you could call the current Zen EDs comparable optically with the likes of the Swaro SLC and Leica Trinovid overall with the understanding that they control CA better than either (meaning a cleaner and apparently sharper image)....plus they are less than half the price of either.

Kevin Purcell · Jul 21, 2009

John Traynor said:
I've seen a lot of $300 roof binoculars and many more inexpensive porros that were "sharp". The Zen is very nice but, as you said, the FL has other advantages.

John

So you've not actually used one?

Your argument sounds like the one against Black Swans ...

Rara avis in terris nigroque simillima cygno

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_swan_theory
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Swan_emblems_and_popular_culture#European_myth_and_metaphor

A rare bird, indeed.

brocknroller · Jul 22, 2009

ceasar said:
I hope so Frank!

They cost $599.00!

http://www.eagleoptics.com/binoculars/nikon/nikon-monarch-x-10-5x45-binocular

Bob

Bob,

The price dropped $100 because somebody couldn't resist trying a few samples (I suspect it was Ben

.

The sale is advertised as an "open box special" in EO's latest newsletter.

http://www.eagleoptics.com/binoculars?query=Nikon+Monarch+X

So if you open a box, a Nikon Monarch X depreciates $100, and if you lose a Zeiss FL box, the price drops $600.

If they follow the same pattern with the next generation EL, and open the box, and then lose it, that should drop $700 from the rumored, record-breaking price of $3,000.

Now, it seems to me from the above examples that if you lose something that belongs to a bin, you should receive a discount, correct?

If you've seen the new EL, you must have noticed that they lost the bridge! (see photo below)

Well, if a missing box is worth $600, how much discount do you think a missing bridge should be worth? $1,000 at least, I'd say.

Okay, so let's assume a new EL is delivered to EO and somebody (not mentioning names) opens it, and then LOSES the box, and the bin turns out to have a MISSING bridge to boot, that's got to be worth (wadda minute, I've gotta get my scratch pad so I can do my siphoning)....

Let's see, 3,000 crawdads siphon 100 crawdads...siphon 600 crawdads... siphon 1,000 crawdads... equals 1,700 crawdads, I mean, 1,700 dollars discount!

IOW, with a $1,700 discount ($100 less than the price of the current gen EL), you could buy the next gen EL for only $1,300 on sale!

I can't wait for the open box, lost box, missing bridge next gen EL sale!

BrockView attachment 208230

FrankD · Jul 22, 2009

Brock,

Sometimes your logic scares me.

...and, yes, I noticed that little sale in the most recent EO newsletter as well.

Kevin Purcell · Jul 22, 2009

Not to be a total cynic but often "open box" and "demo" are a couple of ways of skirting manufacturers MAPs (minimum advertised prices). "Yeah, they're open box".

Of course in this case I don't know for sure but it's an open secret.

MAPs are another reason to call a optical retail and ask them "what they can do for you". You'd be surprised how often they can do something that they can't mention on a web site.

brocknroller · Jul 22, 2009

Kevin Purcell said:
Not to be a total cynic but often "open box" and "demo" are a couple of ways of skirting manufacturers MAPs (minimum advertised prices). "Yeah, they're open box".

Of course in this case I don't know for sure but it's an open secret.

MAPs are another reason to call a optical retail and ask them "what they can do for you". You'd be surprised how often they can do something that they can't mention on a web site.

Kevin,

Are you saying what I think you're saying? That you can haggle over the store's list price on binoculars!???

As "Laugh-In"'s Artie Shaw used to say... "Vedy Interesdng".. but I forget the punchline.

Well, that is very good to know, particularly since I have champagne taste but a Coca Cola bank account.

It reminds me of my experience with a used appliance dealer.

When I was in college, I moved out of the dorms and I needed a washer and dryer set. I was looking at various brands in his warehouse and noticed that none of them had price tags.

So I asked him what does this set cost? And he said: Wadda ya gibme?

I didn't understand him so I asked again. He said again: Wadda ya gibme? I got the gibmes, so wadda ya gib me for that set?" True story.

I didn't realize that I could dicker over prices with optics store salespeople like I could a used appliance dealer.

I thought the prices were set in stone. But then again, they say the only two things in life that are non-negotiable are death and taxes, but not according to tax lawyer Ronnie Deutsch!

I got to work on my haggling skills.

"Okay, this is my final offer on a Neu Neu EL - $1,300, take it or leave it."

CLICK.

"Ah, don't try to kid a kidder, you just made that clicking sound with your tongue.....

...... Hello?..... Hello?.... HELLO?"

Brock

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