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Done with Viper HD - current best scopes for under $1000 (1 Viewer)

waterwagen

Active member
Done with Viper HD - current best scopes for under $1000?

I currently have a Vortex Viper HD 80mm which I've had for a couple years and is now coming apart. Since I'll need to send it in for repair, I've started using my old Bushnell Spacemaster and that has reminded me of my lack of satisfaction with the Viper. As a near $1000 scope it seems disappointing. The spacemaster has better focus, is less finicky about eye position, and has less CA. The eye position issue on the Viper has bothered from day one. It's hard to describe, but it seems very hard to keep my eye in the sweet spot where the image is in sharp focus (it seems to drift in and out). This was not an issue with the Bushnell.

I'm planning on selling the Vortex when I get it back from repair. A comparably priced scope will be in the $1000 or less range, and I'm looking for suggestions on the best options. I'm not set on sticking with 80mm as my 60mm Spacemaster served me well for a long time, but I would lean toward the brighter scopes.

At the moment I'm seriously considering the Pentax PF80-ED-A with the Pentax XW20 fixed eyepiece for 25x power (or maybe the XW14 for 35x). That would put me at right about the $950 mark. Also tempted to splurge for the 65mm Vortex Razor HD at about $1200, as unlike the Viper scope, I'm very happy with my Vortex Razor binoculars (original model), and I've heard very good things about the Razor scopes.

Any thoughts?

Thanks in advance.
 
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I have been very impressed and totally satisfied with my Pentax 65mm ED2 with the XW14, I would think the 80mm ED would be even better.
 
I have been very impressed and totally satisfied with my Pentax 65mm ED2 with the XW14, I would think the 80mm ED would be even better.
I'm starting to think I may be overspending to get the 80 - maybe I should just save money and bulk with the 65. I like how much easier the Spacemaster is to handle.
 
Are you willing to buy used? You can get a Nikon Fieldscope ED III or Kowa 663/664 Prominar used for well under $1K these days. And a 65mm Zeiss Diascope for just a bit over.

If you want a full sized 80mm class scope the Pentax is a top option, as are the Zen-Ray ED scope and the Theron Mag82 (a Nikon Fiedlscope 82ED knock off).

If you like wide angle fixed eyepieces the Pentac XW of course are unsurpassed. Although the Pentax probably isn't quite at the optical level of the Nikon Fieldscope III the eyepiece selection is superior with its standard astrology fitting and below 30x you probably wouldn't notice the difference.
 
Nikon Fieldscope ED III. I looked at the Viper HD and I know exactly what you mean by hard to hold your eye in the sweet spot. I also owned a Razor HD 65mm and sold it to buy my Fieldscope. To my eyes it has the Razor HD every which way from Sunday other than FOV in the zoom eyepiece. But I also own a 24x fixed WA and 40x fixed WA and they are unreal.
 
The suggestion to buy used is an interesting one I hadn't thought of for some reason.

So that's two Fieldscope ED III recommendations. Interesting. Don't know much about Nikon scopes, but I have heard they are very good. Is there a specific model of eyepiece I should look for or is there only only one at each magnification?

I've started looking at fixed eyepieces despite always using zooms, mainly because I've heard the image quality is much better (which I've experienced in photography) and because that is one of the big selling points of the Pentax scopes. I'm a stickler for high quality, so this sounds very attractive to me.

I think I'm going to stay away from Vortex at this point because after doing more research, it appears there aren't many eyepiece options and that looks to be a real selling point for Pentax and Nikon.

I'm a bit concerned at the age of the Pentax scopes, but it sounds as if they still have modern optics.
 
I dont know if its one of the best but the new regal M2 100 is the cheapest 100 mm ED under 1000$, i think ... also, you can take a look to astros
 
I heard some great reviews on the Razor binoculars and spotters. If you go with the Pentax 80mm ED aren't you taking a step back in the optics? A plus for Pentax is using the 1.25" eyepieces. I had a 100mm for a time I loved it, used it for astronomy, birding and long range shooting. Someone made me a good offer and sold it.

Mike
 
If you want a full sized 80mm class scope the Pentax is a top option, as are the Zen-Ray ED scope and the Theron Mag82 (a Nikon Fiedlscope 82ED knock off).


I tend to agree with Eitan's recommendations/comments. The Zen Ray "ED2" in particular at Cameraland NY's prices is particularly attractive at the moment. Since Zen Ray upgraded it to the Prime HD Cameraland is selling the older model for $799.99. The factory supplied zoom is basically a copy of one of the earlier Swarovski zooms plus you can get their fixed 30x, wide angle eyepiece later on if you are so inclined.

http://www.cameralandny.com/optics2/zenray.pl?page=zenray-zened2_20-60x82
 
I tend to agree with Eitan's recommendations/comments. The Zen Ray "ED2" in particular at Cameraland NY's prices is particularly attractive at the moment. Since Zen Ray upgraded it to the Prime HD Cameraland is selling the older model for $799.99. The factory supplied zoom is basically a copy of one of the earlier Swarovski zooms plus you can get their fixed 30x, wide angle eyepiece later on if you are so inclined.

http://www.cameralandny.com/optics2/zenray.pl?page=zenray-zened2_20-60
I'm concerned by the fact that I haven't heard of the manufacturer and by whether the eyepiece selection will be as good as Pentax. Especially when buying over the Internet and unable to try it.
 
Can anyone comment on whether I'll get better image quality from a somewhat higher end 60mm like the fieldscope or a slightly lower end 80mm like the Pentax? I've always thought of 60mm as primarily being inferior in brightness but I've been reading some things which indicate resolution will be noticeably worse also. Not too concerned about brightness at dusk, so I suppose the biggest issue for me would be if I wanted to jump up to higher magnifications, say 35+, and having a dark image.
 
a 60mm is a 60mm..a 80 is an 80...you will always get more light from the 80...I would go with that if I were you...

I am not a Nikon fan but a friend of mine has one and wow, I was impressed. go with what others are suggesting here with the Fieldscope.... jim
 
FWIW my wife and I are happy with the 2-wheel focusing of the angled 65mm Zeiss (ca. 2007); with the 15-45x zoom, which gives a 15x FOV of 168' at 1000 yards.

IMO the Manfrotto 700 RC2 head, and Benro C-156m8 tripod are effective with this scope, providing an overall weight just over 6.5 lbs

Mike
 
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The Zen-Ray looks almost identical externally to a Vortex Razor.

Does anyone know if I could put Pentax eyepieces (or similar astro eps) on it? The ZR site doesn't seem to say and my forum searches for Zen Ray aren't turning up any results.
 
Dug up a couple of older threads on the Zen-Ray from shortly after it came out. Seems like there are some copies of them that are very good, with the 20-60 zoom eyepiece considered very good.

What does everyone think of the quality of this scope compared to the Pentax? Is the Zen body good enough to forego the Pentax eyepiece selection?
 
Get ahold of curvevrazy on here. He has a Fieldscope ED III 60mm and a Zen. He has told me that the Zen outresolves the Nikon by a tad but the Zen is an 82mm which isn't really comparing apples to apples. I would love to see a shootoit between the Zen and a Fieldscope 82.
 
Jayman,

I can't help with a direct Zen Ray/Nikon comparison but I can come close. A few summers ago I compared the Zen Ray, the Celestron Regal and the Theron Mag82 (Nikon clone). The thread is here:

http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=204083&highlight=Theron+Optics

Waterwagen,

I have owned both of the Pentax ED (generation 1s) in 65 and 80. They are very good scopes. I was slightly more impressed with the 65 mm than the 80 for two reasons. For one, the 65 mm is compact for a 65 mm spotter while the 80 mm is big for an 80 mm class spotter. Size wise I think it is comparable to the Regal 80 that I have pictured in the review linked above. The second reason is that the 65 gave me the impression of better apparent sharpness. At the time I chalked it up to their being more "lemons" reported in the 80 mm version than in the 65. Based on those experiences I would recommend the 65 to the 80.

I would say also that the Pentax XW eyepieces are probably my favorite spotting scope eyepiece. They provide excellent image quality...good CA control, bright image, good apparent sharpness, a wide field, a flat field and a huge sweetspot. Plus, they provide all that with plenty of eye relief. I used the XW 20 with the Pentax 65 as my primary spotting scope combination for many years. Keep in mind that, at the time, I used the scope primarily for hawkwatching and, for that, the combination was excellent.

Having said that I would rate both the Zen Ray and the Theron Mag82 as better optically. Part of that could probably be attributed to the larger aperture but I also believe that part of that is design related. Zen Ray has been known to have some excellent multicoatings on all their optics. The image is always very saturated with color and bright. The latest round of their coatings also produces a very neutral color tone.

The selling point for the Mag82 is similar optical performance to the Zen Ray but with the inclusion of two eyepieces for the original purchase. Both eyepieces are faithful copies (in design) of the Nikon equivalents. It comes with both a 30x wide angle eyepiece (around 70 degrees) and a 25-75x zoom.

Hope this helps in your decision making.
 
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