Caspian gull (1 Viewer)

Or Ponic gull (Larus cachinnans) the eastern yellow-legged.

http://www.birdforum.net/pp_gallery/showphoto.php/photo/42660/sort/1/cat/500/page/1

Dunno if this has been split.

Thank you for that. I have put it as another photo for the yellow legged,unless Rasmus or Cuckooroller tell us different

I meant 'Pontic'.

I'm sure someone can clear up the split issue for me.

Wed Apr 6, 2005 5:55pm

Probably barabensis/eastern cachinnans or heuglini. Seems like to advanced moult for a western (and eastern)? cachinnans in february, although the bill looks good for caspian.Large white-headed gulls in this region are often very difficult to identify, especially younger birds like this, which would be a 1:st winter, second callender year, some old brown juvenile tertials and outer greater coverts. All other feathers are second generation. The primaries looks to fresh (black) for caspian at this age and time of year, they are usually much worn and bleached. Heuglini moults later, and therefore usually has fresher (blacker) primaries. although there is variation! It is by the way widely accepted that caspian and yellow-legged gull are two seperate species!
Regards Jan.J

looks very cachinnans to me

really leggy
long parallel sided bill etc
head shape and eye
attenuated wings
scapular pattern

bill looks too light for heuglini and lower scapular pattern is wrong too

Tim

This is one that I will not touch. I'm not good on Gulls, especially white-headed ones, mostly out of almost complete disinterest for the group as a whole. Rasmus is not keen on them either though undoubtedly better than I am. I will leave this to the many that I have noticed on this site that are much better at dissecting out these exasperating and pleomorphic Gulls!

TA,
you could be right! Agree that bill looks long and parallel sided, and the eye looks small, but I´m not so sure about the head shape though (female?), could fit both barabensis and heuglini! It´s leggy alright, could fit the other two as well. The thing is that the legs looks "slender" which would be more in line with cachinnans. As mentioned, moult seems to advanced for cachinnans in february, maybe even for eastern cachinnans, wich acording to Gulls, has a more restricted moult than western birds. One would also expect a cachinnans to have more worn and bleached primaries at this time of year, so therefore it fits heuglini better. Some scapulars seems already worn, grown in some time ago. Also, cachinnans usually dont appear so streaked on flanks, more unmarked in this area, the opposite to barabensis and many heuglini, but there is probably much variation. On bill the gonys-angle looks "cachinnans flat" but (if one should be fussy) I think the upper bill tip looks a bit to bulbous. As mentioned before this is a bit like mission impossible, there is much individual variation within, and between species/forms! It´s between, I think, heuglini and barabensis!(?) Have you seen on Dick Newells site, his Oman 2002 photos, the so called "unassigned 1st or 2nd winter gulls"? If you go there, look at the first gull,po1255 and po1260. I certainly would put Gashead´s gull there.
www.magikbirds.com
Regards Jan.J