New to Canon DSLR ( EOS 400D UK) Which Lens (1 Viewer)

Ageinghippie · Jan 17, 2007

Hello All,

Having upgraded from a FujiS5000, to DSLR, still learning, but the amount
of Camera shake I am getting is too much, camera very sensative.
Keep forgetting to set Shutter speed higher than Focal length to try and avoid.

I have the KIt Lense and Sigma 70-300 F4 -5.6 APO DG macro, which I find is not quite long enough for Birds.

Which lense should I go for Need Image Stabalisation, been looking at Sigma 80-400 OS and Cannon 100-400 IS.
Not sure which as there is quite a cash difference,I am leaning towards the Canon but not sure on the pump zoom.
Any advice please.

Cheers

Les

christineredgate · Jan 18, 2007

Les,you cannot go far wrong with the 100-400.It is worth paying the extra for,esp if you are taking bird shots.Many people on this Forum do use this lens.You could always go to a dealer,with your cam,ask to try both lenses,take a few shots with each ,then view at home at your leisure,and you may find you are able to make a choice.Not familar with Sigma,but you can add a converter to the 100-400,to extend your focal length.There is a thread running at the moment,where Ian F has shown some shots taken using a Kenko converter which costs less than £60.

filip_koziel · Jan 18, 2007

I thing, the ef 400L f5,6 will be sharpen (test on the http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/lenses/forgotten-400.shtml ) then 100-400 but it's more difficult to use.

IanF · Jan 18, 2007

I've only tried the 400mm f5,6 with the Kenko 1.5x converter so far and the results are first rate.

The weather has turned again today so it will be another week before I get chance to try it with the Canon 100-400m.

The Canon 100-400mm IS is well worth the money. It has first rate optics and the IS is a real boon. You can get decent results with a converter- I've tried it with the 1.4x converter, but it really come into it's own when you add an extension tube instead for macro photos of butterflies. The pump action zoom does take a bit of getting used to, I still don't like it, but the optical quality of the lens is outstanding - better than some prime lenses.

The 400m f5,6 is a first rate lens as well but a lot less forgiving due to it's lack of IS. However it is better suited to flight shots as the autofocus is noticably faster. A big draw back is the 11' minimum focus distance which also means making use of an extension tube difficult.

postcardcv · Jan 18, 2007

Ageinghippie said:
Which lense should I go for Need Image Stabalisation, been looking at Sigma 80-400 OS and Cannon 100-400 IS.
Not sure which as there is quite a cash difference,I am leaning towards the Canon but not sure on the pump zoom.

Either of these two lenses will not only give you increased reach, but you will also see and improvement in image quality compared with your Sigma 70-300. Have a look on the equipment review section on here for reviews of these lenses, from what I've seen they are ofa very similar standard.

One BF member (Keith Reeder) has used both of these lenses (the Canon on a 30D and the Sigma on a Nikon D70) and I know he feels there is litttle to choose between them. I'm sure he'll be along in a bit and will be able to give you a detailed comparison of them. Personally I'd go for the Sigma and save myself a couple of hundred...

IanF · Jan 18, 2007

The weather did an about turn at lunch time so I took out the 100-400mm and Kenko 1.5x.

I think the results with this teleconverter are as good as if not better than using the lens on it's own!

The attached photos are unprocessed, not even sharpened. Simply cropped, resized and saved at 95% compression to get the file sizes down.

mjmw · Jan 18, 2007

IanF said:
The attached photos are unprocessed, not even sharpened. Simply cropped, resized and saved at 95% compression to get the file sizes down.

Very impressive Ian. I applied some USM (unsharp mask) to eliminate the softening effects of re-sizing and the results using the Kenko are surprisingly good - were these shot on a tripod or hand-held? What were the techs (just for a couple of the images)?

IanF · Jan 18, 2007

They were shot with the camera resting on the viewing slot of a screen hide which is pretty sturdy. They were all taken from c.25-30'. For the GSW the lens was zoomed back to 300mm.

The Chaffinch and LTT below are entirely hand held from c.60' with a stiff wind blowing - the IS is a real boon for shots like these.

Exif appears the exact same on all shots apart from shutter speed and ISO.

For the LTT below it's -
Original date/time: 2007:01:18 12:39:50
Exposure time: 1/400 (0.00250)
Shutter speed: 1/400.00
F-stop: 5.6
ISO speed: 400
Focal length: 400.0000
Flash: 16
Orientation: 1
Aperture: 4.9709
Exposure bias: 0.0000
Metering mode: 6
Exposure program: 3
Digitized date/time: 2007:01:18 12:39:50
Modified date/time: 2007:01:18 12:39:50

Being a 'dumb' teleconverter you don't get the lens details at all.

For the GSW/Greenfinch above

Original date/time: 2007:01:18 13:20:59
Exposure time: 1/60 (0.01667)
Shutter speed: 1/60.00
F-stop: 5.6
ISO speed: 400
Focal length: 220.0000
Flash: 16
Orientation: 1
Aperture: 4.9709
Exposure bias: 0.0000
Metering mode: 6
Exposure program: 3
Digitized date/time: 2007:01:18 13:20:59
Modified date/time: 2007:01:18 13:20:59

The Great Tit and GSW below have been sharpened using USM and filtered for noise.

mjmw · Jan 18, 2007

To my eyes, this shows that the Kenko convertor is 'sharp enough' in good light and, of course, your good technique helps get the best out of the combo

The Woodpecker's head looked soft, but I can now see that this is caused by the bird's movement and slow shutter, not softness from the glass. There is a slight magenta colour cast in the last 3 images but this could be from a number of factors (not necersarily the convertor). Besides, this is an easy fix in post-processing.
Wow, I am quite surprised by those results, thanks for sharing!

avan · Jan 18, 2007

Very good result, is this with the non pro version? any picture with the 400mm f5.6. I already have the Canon 1.4X but looking for one that can be fit both the 400mm and the sigma 70-200mm.

IanF · Jan 18, 2007

The photos below are all taken with the Canon 400mm f5,6 and the Kenko Teleplus DC 1.5x MC which retials for around £60 - all are c.100 yards with the camera mounted on a tripod.

avan · Jan 18, 2007

Wow! I believe you don't need to tape the pin for AF with this converter. It seem a very good deal and a very good ratio: price vs image quality.

IanF · Jan 18, 2007

avan said:
Wow! I believe you don't need to tape the pin for AF with this converter. It seem a very good deal and a very good ratio: price vs image quality.

No pin taping needed. I was getting fed up of replacing the tape on the Canon converter. It was fine in the summer but in winter it is forever coming off no matter what tape I try.

The draw back of this converter is that you do need good light. Results are very muddy once the sun goes in.

Whereas the 400mm prime is superb at greater distances with this converter, the 100-400mm was disappointingly soft. Having said that though I haven't tried it tripod mounted which is how I tested the 400mm prime.

It's best range with the 100-400mm seems to be c.6' to 25' - provided it's bright light.

avan · Jan 18, 2007

I believe also the tripod could make a difference, but this show also the 400mm prime excellent quality.Taping lean for dirty contact too in the long run.

Ageinghippie · Jan 18, 2007

""The weather did an about turn at lunch time so I took out the 100-400mm and Kenko 1.5x.""

""I think the results with this teleconverter are as good as if not better than using the lens on it's own"

IanF and everyone

Thanks for all your comments, still not sure as to which Canon 100-400IS
or Sigma 80-400OS. will have to give it some thought.
I have been reading other posts with regards to the Sigma, but they are rather old. I will be mainly shooting hand held, I have a tripod Manfrotto Modo
but the suggested weight limit is 2kg, so its a case of Spending more,
on the Canon or less on the Sigma and getting a new tripod.
On the other hand not really part of this thread, but the Modo has a removeable centre Head and pole (head cannot be removed ) Can new centre
pole be purchased to fit the modo then purchase a new quick release head.

I think I will Toss a Coin

Cheers

Les

achilles500 · Jan 19, 2007

Which lens

Just noticed a shop on e bay (called DIGITAL REV) based in Hong Kong, selling new Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 L IS USM for £769.99 plus £50.00 P & P.

What are the thoughts on fellow members. Is this offer too good?

Steve

Wildmoreway · Jan 19, 2007

Ageinghippie said:
""I think I will Toss a Coin

Cheers

Les

I often find this to be the best method, I always toss several coins at once to make sure.

SW

PS Welcome to the Forum

Keith Reeder · Jan 19, 2007

Digital Rev has a good reputation - several people on here have reported successful purchases from them, and ten zillion bits of positive feedback on Ebay can't be wrong!

The question really is whether you'll be happy dealing with a retailer thousands of miles away if something goes wrong.

Puts me off, I admit.

carabid · Jan 19, 2007

Recomen 400mm f5.6L

The Canon 400 D is a great camera. I moved up to one last month and also got a 400 mm f5.6 L lens.. Am still learning best ways to use the lens but think it is great. It doesn't have image stabilization but I simply shoot at a high speed. You might want to look at threads about bird photography at the dpv site for Canon lens discussions http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/forum.asp?forum=1029

There is also a forum for Canon 300-400 cameras at http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/forum.asp?forum=1031

a general Canon talk forum is at
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/forum.asp?forum=1010

The general consensus at the lens site seems to be that the 400 is the best choice, less heavy than the 100-400 mm and with better pics under some conditions. Its used by some people who take great bird photos. Also seems a general consensus that L series lenses provide the best photos under most conditions for both birds and other subjects.

Best wishes.

Gallery: http://www.pbase.com/carabid

Ageinghippie said:
Hello All,

Having upgraded from a FujiS5000, to DSLR, still learning, but the amount
of Camera shake I am getting is too much, camera very sensative.
Keep forgetting to set Shutter speed higher than Focal length to try and avoid.

I have the KIt Lense and Sigma 70-300 F4 -5.6 APO DG macro, which I find is not quite long enough for Birds.

Which lense should I go for Need Image Stabalisation, been looking at Sigma 80-400 OS and Cannon 100-400 IS.
Not sure which as there is quite a cash difference,I am leaning towards the Canon but not sure on the pump zoom.
Any advice please.

Cheers

Les

citrinella · Jan 19, 2007

achilles500 said:
Just noticed a shop on e bay (called DIGITAL REV) based in Hong Kong, selling new Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 L IS USM for £769.99 plus £50.00 P & P.

What are the thoughts on fellow members. Is this offer too good?

Steve

Be careful !

This retailer has a good reputation but ...

Where they say 'NO VAT' they are not telling the whole truth. VAT is due, but they are taking the chance Customs won't pick it out and charge the VAT. The chances of this are so small that, when Customs do spot it, they will refund the VAT. Reports suggest they stand by their terms in this situation. Doing this they are still quids in.

However, looking at their offers closely, I have noticed that not all make the 'NO VAT' pledge. Check the one you are looking at carefully, and confirm with them if it is not clear before you buy.

Mike.

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