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Common Diver? - Norway (1 Viewer)

Since I can not use the multi-quotes for some reason... I kindly thank Fat Paul, Andy and Steve for the replies on page 1. I actually knew which were different species and how to differentiate...but was just stating another extra thing for birders to worry about researching before traveling over to Europe.

As far as the name changes... personally, I don't care what name is used(Grey vs Black-bellied Plover for example) but there should be some consistency and not based on location where the bird was seen.



Anybody have a phone number and I'll call and set it straight! 3:)3:)
 
Birdbrain22 said:
. . .I actually knew which were different species and how to differentiate...but was just stating another extra thing for birders to worry about researching before traveling over to Europe.

As far as the name changes... personally, I don't care what name is used(Grey vs Black-bellied Plover for example) but there should be some consistency and not based on location where the bird was seen. . ..
Click to expand...

Another “extra thing thing” to worry about? C’mon, just another minor cultural difference to keep you on your toes! And, of course, an incentive to learn the latin names and with them, avian taxonomy, that noblest and most interesting of subjects (to me anyway).

Personally, I love local names with their sometimes interesting histories and associations, and deplore any and all efforts at standardization for the convenience of a few “world birders” whose interest in their quarry sometimes seems to me to extend little beyond ticks on a list. Nutcracker fusses about American cultural “imperialism” supplanting the “official” British names; me I worry about the forces of standardization obliterating local and regional names of all kinds, official or informal, British or American—Bonxie, Baldpate, Peewit, Fly-up-the-crick, whatever.
 
fugl said:
Another “extra thing thing” to worry about? C’mon, just another minor cultural difference to keep you on your toes! And, of course, an incentive to learn the latin names and with them, avian taxonomy, that noblest and most interesting of subjects (to me anyway).
UOTE]

Most birders worth their salt, research the birds before they go anywhere and will be aware of any or most, alternative names. You don't even need to learn the latin names unless you want to discuss them with someone who doesn't speak English.

When I do a trip, I include on my list, any alternative names so I know where I am with things. However, we aren't actually talking about that many birds in Europe and it's not a big job to figure out any confusion species re names.

The thing that really keeps you on your toes, mainly in Asia but the Americas also, is the large number of splits that have taken place over the last 5-6 years, that really is a challenge, especially with literature that may not be well out of date!



A
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andyadcock said:
the French don't like learning English.
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For a bunch of people who don't like learning English, they're pretty good at it... Like everywhere else, attempts to speak the language are appreciated, but most people under the age of 50 will speak at least some English.
 
Fat Paul Scholes said:
For a bunch of people who don't like learning English, they're pretty good at it... Like everywhere else, attempts to speak the language are appreciated, but most people under the age of 50 will speak at least some English.
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That's actually not true, many have poor and some non existent English. Get away from the main Cities and you'll have language issues.

Don't turn this in to another 'how xenophobic the English are', it's a known fact that the Fremch, resent having to speak ANY other language, especially when that language is English.

The French PM has not made a single address in English during his visit to the UK AFAIK, even though he probably has good English. I won't say anymore than this, I know which way it will be taken.


A
 
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andyadcock said:
That's actually not true, many have poor and some non existent English. Get away from the main Cities and you'll have language issues.

Don't turn this in to another 'how xenophobic the English are', it's a known fact that the Fremch, resent having to speak ANY other language, especially when that language is English.

The French PM has not made a single address in English during his visit to the UK AFAIK, even though he probably has good English. I won't say anymore than this, I know which way it will be taken.


A
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What do I know? I only visited France 2 or 3 times a year for the last 15 years, including cities, and rural areas. People (especially younger people) have always been very happy to speak to me in English - especially after hearing how bad my French is...

I'm not claiming everyone is fluent - but the idea that the French resent speaking English is utter crap. They're surrounded by tv, films and particularly music in English.

The French person sitting next to me suggests that if the French resent speaking English at all, it's only in the context of english speakers not making any effort at all and expecting everyone else to do the heavy lifting for them.

I suggest that if you don't want this to turn into a thread about xenophobia, stop making incorrect, disparaging, sweeping statements about a nation of people...
 
Fat Paul Scholes said:
What do I know? I only visited France 2 or 3 times a year for the last 15 years, including cities, and rural areas. People (especially younger people) have always been very happy to speak to me in English - especially after hearing how bad my French is...

I'm not claiming everyone is fluent - but the idea that the French resent speaking English is utter crap. They're surrounded by tv, films and particularly music in English.

The French person sitting next to me suggests that if the French resent speaking English at all, it's only in the context of english speakers not making any effort at all and expecting everyone else to do the heavy lifting for them.

I suggest that if you don't want this to turn into a thread about xenophobia, stop making incorrect, disparaging, sweeping statements about a nation of people...
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Just like the one you made you mean, 'For a bunch of people who don't like learning English, they're pretty good at it'.

Forgive that my experience has been the opposite of yours. On a flight in Asia that had to be turned around for tech issues, none of the large number of French on board, understood the announcement. The result being that on landing, they thought they were in Cambodia, they were actually back in KL.

Many, many times, even in Paris, I've tried to talk to people and it seemed they had no English at all, that's not an opinion, that is my experience.

That's enough of this nonsense
 
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Andy - I was ridiculing your statement, not making any sort of comment about the French, other than that they’re quite good at speaking English.

Good to see you defending your position from a pretty solid evidence base....

And yes, enough of this nonsense.
 
Thanks to Maudoc and Nutcracker for the advise on the field guide... I greatly appreciate that recommendation, I will be ordering that as I definitely will need it.

Just to clarify though, I was asking about personal guide to show a visiting foreign birder the hotspots while in France. I have checked some websites, but they all seem to be only offering longer week or 10 day tours. Any advice in this regard?
 
Birdbrain22 said:
Thanks to Maudoc and Nutcracker for the advise on the field guide... I greatly appreciate that recommendation, I will be ordering that as I definitely will need it.

Just to clarify though, I was asking about personal guide to show a visiting foreign birder the hotspots while in France. I have checked some websites, but they all seem to be only offering longer week or 10 day tours. Any advice in this regard?
Click to expand...

I can't find it now but isn't there a forum on here somewhere with contacts for local, non preffesional birders who like to take people out?


A
 
Birdbrain22 said:
Thanks to Maudoc and Nutcracker for the advise on the field guide... I greatly appreciate that recommendation, I will be ordering that as I definitely will need it.

Just to clarify though, I was asking about personal guide to show a visiting foreign birder the hotspots while in France. I have checked some websites, but they all seem to be only offering longer week or 10 day tours. Any advice in this regard?
Click to expand...

Have you looked at birdingpal?
www.birdingpal.com
 
andyadcock said:
I can't find it now but isn't there a forum on here somewhere with contacts for local, non preffesional birders who like to take people out?


A
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I know there is a forum where folks look for others to share a trip and costs. Maybe if I look deeper into that, I can find something. Thanks Andy.
 
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