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Birding - a hobby for all people? (1 Viewer)

stonechat1

New member
Hi folks,

this morning came something in my mind what I never haven been aware before. I do birding for more then 30 years, of course mostly in my regional area but also in other european countries and overseas. Never I meet colored birders. Have been in Canada (Ontario, Quebec) a couple of times for birding and meet a lot of people from the US but never I meet a colored birder. But I also never meet Turks (largest ethnic group in my area) in Austria who do birding. Is birding something what some ethnic groups don´t do?
Please note that this thread is not racially motivated. Just curios of the experiences you made!

Thanks for your input,
Roman
 
Well, socio economic placements of black people due to the nature of western racism (not you) aside, whilst I have never met a black birder, look at that members from africa, parts of the americas etc, they are out there.

Birding is a niche hobby, so if a minority do it and you are looking for a minority within that minority, chances remain slim.
 
In the areas where I've birded most in recent years (Nevada, California, Oregon) participation's been more a matter of class than race, and when that's allowed for I don't know that I've seen much difference.
 
Dave Lindo?

Birding is not a club or particarly organised group, so there is nothing which favours one ethnic group over another. I don't see how any there cod be any invisible barriers set up. Certainly a bit odd that it appears to be a mostly white and male hobby in the UK at least... I guess any research would need to look at why people get into birding and see where the take up point is... Who knows?
 
Hi folks,

this morning came something in my mind what I never haven been aware before. I do birding for more then 30 years, of course mostly in my regional area but also in other european countries and overseas. Never I meet colored birders. Have been in Canada (Ontario, Quebec) a couple of times for birding and meet a lot of people from the US but never I meet a colored birder. But I also never meet Turks (largest ethnic group in my area) in Austria who do birding. Is birding something what some ethnic groups don´t do?
Please note that this thread is not racially motivated. Just curios of the experiences you made!

Thanks for your input,
Roman

I've met thousands of American birders, but only a handful of African-American birders. Underrepresentation of people of color in the birding hobby has generally been recognized by the ABA and others as a problem in this country and at least one book has been written about it. See brief review here:

http://birdfreak.com/birding-for-everyone-encouraging-people-of-color-to-become-birdwatchers/

Best,
Jim
 
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About David Lindo, who came here on several ocassions, I assumed he is one of several black birders from his local area. I saw him on TV in the episode on Long-eared Owls in Kikinda, and he asks the host "Why are the local people staring at me?". The provided answer was "Because they have never seen anyone lying on their backs in grass to look up at the owls" but my immediate response was "of course they are staring at you because you are black". The skin tone diversity in small towns like Kikinda is negligible (the considerable ethnic diversity is based on culture/language/religion instead of phenotype which is just regular white Caucasian) and situation is similar to one in other parts of the world where dark-skinned locals see a white birder - they are curious and amused.

About the people with Middle Eastern heritage, I guess they have a tradition of shooting/netting birds for food and keeping songbirds in cages, and going out just to look at the bird and then go home without a souvenir might be something not even thought of.
 
I step into these waters with trepidation!
We are constantly being told that the lack of involvement of "ethnic groups, females, young people" in various activities is "a problem that needs addressed". Why? There always seems to be an assumption that there is a bias involved e.g. "Western racialism". Is that really all there is to it? The birdwatching clubs that I have been involved with bend over backwards to accommodate and attract young members. In fact they try all sorts of things to get new members - all they have to be is interested in birds. So, what happens? The membership "bias" towards the middle class, middle-aged to geriatric doesn't change.
Similarly with "The Ramblers"; all you need is to be interested in walking but despite Herculean efforts the membership profile stays the same.
My stamp collecting club does all sorts of work with youngsters but the membership gets ever more ancient.
We see great effort and resources put into "inclusive activities" in our national parks and reserves but does the profile of visitors change?
Yes, there is bias and there are cultural issues and a whole range of issues but it is not all one way traffic. My daughter is, just about, happy to have birds pointed out when we go for a walk; my grandchildren have long moved on to other interests - that leave me cold. Sometimes, it really is that we are not all the same.
 
I step into these waters with trepidation!
We are constantly being told that the lack of involvement of "ethnic groups, females, young people" in various activities is "a problem that needs addressed". Why? There always seems to be an assumption that there is a bias involved e.g. "Western racialism".

As to the "why" the issues vary by country, but in this country caucasians will soon be a minority. If they are the only ones supporting conservation proposals, that does not bode well for birds or nature. And even apart from the politics, I believe an appreciation of nature is important for human beings to reach their full potential.

I'd disagree that there is an assumption of "bias" or prejudice keeping persons of color out of hobbies such as birding. I think most assume birders in this country, tending to the liberal side of the political spectrum, are less prone to racial prejudice than the population at large.

Best,
Jim
 
At least in Britain, demographics probably play a significant role, with relatively recently arrived ethnic groups quite understandably often choosing to live in major urban connurbations, which provide the best opportunities for both employment and mutual support.

Most good birding sites are in rural areas, which are not always particularly welcoming to minority groups. Having previously enjoyed living in multicultural London, my wife and I have been shocked by the levels of deeply entrenched racism where we now live in mid-Somerset (especially amongst middle-aged and elderly people), despite it being a boringly white area with no obvious reasons for such bigoted attitudes - but they probably read the Daily (hate-)Mail...
 
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I too have only seen a handful of African-American birders here in the states, and even fewer Hispanics. My wife is Hispanic, and I now have both her parents hooked on birding. They recently spent a month in SE Texas, and while they blended right in with the great numbers of Mexican-Americans there, they never saw another Hispanic birder the entire month they were there.

I know they are out there, but there can't be too many.
 
I tend to agree with Egret - I really don't like this quota stuff - if you want to go look at birds or stamps (or planes as I often did) then who cares what you are. If ethnic minorities don't want to be involved in things then that's their decision. We shouldn't be forcing people to do activities because that activity's followers should reflect the population.
 
I tend to agree with Egret - I really don't like this quota stuff - if you want to go look at birds or stamps (or planes as I often did) then who cares what you are. If ethnic minorities don't want to be involved in things then that's their decision. We shouldn't be forcing people to do activities because that activity's followers should reflect the population.

Indeed, there's such a thing as "multiculturalism" or so we used to be told. There are also such things as social class & assimilation rates. As long as there's no active discrimination it will all come right in the end (maybe). In the meantime a few welcoming speeches can certainly do no harm!
 
Most good birding sites are in rural areas, which are not always particularly welcoming to minority groups. Having previously enjoyed living in multicultural London, my wife and I have been shocked by the levels of deeply entrenched racism where we now live in mid-Somerset (especially amongst middle-aged and elderly people), despite it being a boringly white area with no obvious reasons for such bigoted attitudes - but they probably read the Daily (hate-)Mail...

Ah, rural idiocy, a fine Marxist concept that's always spoken volumes to me. But for sheer benightedness I'd pit my Esmeralda Co. redneck against your Somersetshire yokel any day of the week. And the Egyptian peasant? Oy vey!

Like it or not, bird watching is a thoroughly bourgeois phenomenon and I don't see that changing anytime soon. Does anyone?
 
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At least in Britain, demographics probably play a significant role, with relatively recently arrived ethnic groups quite understandably often choosing to live in major urban connurbations, which provide the best opportunities for both employment and mutual support.

Most good birding sites are in rural areas, which are not always particularly welcoming to minority groups. Having previously enjoyed living in multicultural London, my wife and I have been shocked by the levels of deeply entrenched racism where we now live in mid-Somerset (especially amongst middle-aged and elderly people), despite it being a boringly white area with no obvious reasons for such bigoted attitudes - but they probably read the Daily (hate-)Mail...

Well put, Richard.
 
levels of deeply entrenched racism where we now live in mid-Somerset (especially amongst middle-aged and elderly people), despite it being a boringly white area with no obvious reasons for such bigoted attitudes

Such feelings are at least in part often caused by a fear of the unknown. Meeting individuals of the despised group can do wonders for people's attitudes (although at first it's likely to be `X is such a pleasant person, pity he/she's a ...').

Andrea
 
There must be the reverse too. How many white people play Kabaddi for example or the sitar etc? It's one of those issues that is not an issue but is picked up by the 'multiculturists' who cannot understand that perhaps some people that, according to the quota, should be birdwatching, are not.

I'm not sure I would agree it is bourgeois hobby though, plent of non-middle class people at both ends of the spectrum do it (birdwatching that is)
 
Meeting individuals of the despised group can do wonders for people's attitudes (although at first it's likely to be `X is such a pleasant person, pity he/she's a ...').

Andrea

That is so true, and I have personal experience of that - when you reflect on it, it is a shameful thing
 
Such feelings are at least in part often caused by a fear of the unknown. Meeting individuals of the despised group can do wonders for people's attitudes (although at first it's likely to be `X is such a pleasant person, pity he/she's a ...').

Andrea

You've hit the nail on the head, as far as English insularity goes, Andrea. Being Scouse and working class I wasn't surprised,when I first broke into academe, when people commented on my accent ( it's not a particularly broad one ). What did surprise me was the 'kindness' shown by people suggesting "it may be better" if I sounded more like them. Not one of them would have considered themselves to be behaving in a discriminatory fashion, just being helpful. BTW I never had the same reaction from Welsh, Scots or Irish colleagues. As non-WASP's ( I hate the phrase 'ethnic minority' - we're all members of an 'ethnic minority' somewhere, although WASP isn't any better ) break out of their, racially perceived, boundaries they will become more involved in birding and it's up to other birders to welcome them.

Chris
 
Birding is a peculiar ethnic expression of our advanced western culture (yes, I said 'advanced') and is very much a minority pursuit even within that culture. It's no surprise that other cultures aren't observed doing it as much at this point in history but it does happen. I have several other arcane interests and pursuits that are also heavily favoured by my particular ethnic group, but in every case except birding there has been at least one person from another culture that excelled at whatever it was. I await with confidence the appearance of some black or Asian kid who racks up something like 800 birds in a single North American year. But the fact is that both those cultures are interested in other forms of achievement.
 
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