the 8x42 (1 Viewer)

Frank,

No they didn't, and I feel like a little kid who didn't get the present he wanted too. I figured the evaluation would use up the weekend. Don't see much hope to see them till Monday. I have little experience with DHL. Don't know if they work saturdays. Left my phone # on the door at the office, but don't have much hope the deliver on saturday or would call anyway. Se my post after your last at the campfire.

Steve,

They don't....delivery on Saturday that is...sadly. I do wonder if their depot is open on Saturday though. Maybe we could just go down and pick them up.

I do know that VA's pair came in though. I look forward to hearing his comments.

I glanced at this thread earlier in the day but I didn't have time to make sense of it (what an odd mix of topics and partial conversations!). As for the "mystery bino" -- in the pic it looked "cheap" to me, and based on the silver coatings on the prisms my guess was that, assuming all the fanfare has some justification, that it is the latest Vortex Razor class glass, probably made by one of the big Chinese manufacturers and branded as whatever it is. Well, curiosity got the better of me so I looked it up (just type some of those super precise specs of weight and eye-relief into Google and it will pop right up), and it appears that's what it is (seems cheesy not to just name it, but I'll play along since anyone who wants to know can look it up as described). Pretty nice if it is as good or better than the Razor--I'll be interested to know. Incidentally, I tried the Razor recently and it didn't exceed my expectations. It's quite good, maybe as good as some of the top-end stuff prior to introduction of the latest lens and especially dialectric coatings, though perhaps with more field curvature. The focus on the unit I tried was smooth but it was slow like the original EL focus. Given today's optics prices, the Razor is impressive, but given that I bought my (equal or better quality) B&L 8x42 Elite and Leica 8x32 Ultra/Trinovid BA for just over $700 (and though the value of the dollar has fallen my salary has remained constant) it doesn't seem so remarkable.

As for the premise that some roofs like the Razor would fair better in tests against the supposedly top-end glass if the tests were done w/o knowing the brand, I don't agree. The differences between different models are consistent and their different optical personalities are quite obvious. If the point is that the best $500 roofs are quite good, I don't think that is news.

--AP

Can I claim my prize? The weight matches to the hundredth of an ounce

Don't look at the link unless you want to know who makes (well, brands) this. And how much they want to sell it for.

http://www.wolfes.com/eshop/cart.php?target=product&product_id=6578&category_id=340

So as this is not a new name (and not a well known one) I speculate (like Alexis) this is a Chinese OEM design? Someone in Kunming or Xi'an?

That said if it is an OEM design is it the first one to use ED glass? The Chinese are moving up market!

EDIT:

Wild speculation (as I can't find this bin on their site!) as this OEM makes products sold under the name above (but the brander may mix and match many OEMs).

http://www.bosma.com.cn/

Bosma in Guangzhou might be the OEM.

They do Tele Vue, Vixen and SEGA OEM work. They also do the Celestron C50 (which is also sod by Barska with a different eyepiece ... I suspect there's some mix and match).

They also seem to like cranes, egrets and herons on their web site.

Alexis,

Yes, you and I are on the same page again when it comes to the formerly anonymous mystery glass and the Razor as well. If I could speculate for a bit (though it may be presumptuous) I think the earlier comments about comparing certain unbranded bins to the big three may be partially correct. I don't think it is too far of a stretch to say that most folks that visit this forum are "above average" in their experience with optics. For that small percentage of the population unbranding a very good mid-priced bin and comparing it to the high end glass might still show some of the unbranded bin's limitations. However, put it into the hands of just about anyone else and the small differences in edge distortion or field of view or any other optical characteristic might not be so apparent.

In my opinion the Razors and the Meostars of the market do provide exceptional optical performance for the price especially in comparison to the current Alpha glass. I do not think many folks will argue that. I do wonder when the time will come when one of these models though will equal that of the Germ/Aust/Japanese Alphas. Is it possible this glass might do it? Maybe, but as you pointed out the silver coated prism is probably the only characteristic here that separates this unbranded bin from the cream of the crop. Maybe, if we are lucky, then this glass will equal the optical performance of the former Nikon Venturers or the Leica Trinovids. Throwing ED glass into the equation would it be stretching it much to think that it could actually surpass them a bit?

Again, just thinking out loud.

Frank, do you think there is an 8x32 that will beat the best of the under 1000 dollar 8x42s in brightness?

For most of my use 8x32 is sufficient, and as the 8x42s tend to be around 350ft fov, I have not been too excited about them. I do little owling, so we are only talking daytime birding here, hawks in bright sky that may look black at low end, etc.

Frank, do you think there is an 8x32 that will beat the best of the under 1000 dollar 8x42s in brightness?

Click to expand...

Tero,

I will be the first to say that I am not really qualified to answer this. Someone like Henry or Kimmo might be able to answer that better. I know simple Physics is working against that happening. However, consider that "apparent brightness" can play a big role in the process. What I am referring to here is how contrast, choice of coatings and field of view play in how we perceive the brightness level of any given binocular. I can say that there have been at least two Alpha 32 mm that I perceive to display excellent brightness levels. I would love to compare them to one of the better mid-low priced 8x42s but I do not have any in my possession right now.

? That's weird. I posted a thread about that very model that got no responses from anyone that had seen them. That model name was assigned to a <$200 bin with some specs in common, but not an open bridge design.
Here's the 8x42:
http://www.webnotable.com/agptu/Cat...CategoryID=81&ProductID=1348&ProductTab=Specs

It was a pretty wild idea, since transmission in a 800 dollar binocular is going to be a high 90% number already. But I was just wondering if any 8x32 can approach say a Pentax DCF 8x43 or a Viper 8x42. Pretty much for cloudy winter day conditions.

By the way, do older people get the benefit of the brightness of 8x42, as their eyes dilate differently from young people?

This is going a little off the 8x42 is great topic, so I posed the question in terms of two Pentax models at
http://www.birdforum.net/showthread.php?t=121486

The other big thread at 24campfire (for those that haven't found it yet) is

http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/2373162/page/1/fpart/1

Tero,

Pretty much for cloudy winter day conditions.

Click to expand...

Note that a overcast winter day is somewhere between 10 and 100 times brighter than twilight (so that's 10 to 20dB difference). It may seem dark but it's not that dark. And in those conditions your pupil is still pretty much stopped down to "daylight" values.

Frank, do you think there is an 8x32 that will beat the best of the under 1000 dollar 8x42s in brightness?

Click to expand...

As I posted on another thread, comparing the Diamondback lack of twilight brightness against a Yosemite, for roof prism bins with the same type of mirror coatings like then the answer would be "no". But a dielectric mirror coated 8x32 (or a porro 8x32 ) could come very close to or beat an 8x42 with aluminum mirror coating because it has much higher transmission. A porro would win at much lower cost!

For pupil sizes although averages are often quoted and the general trend is to smaller amount of adaptation with aging the actual values are much more variable from person to person that is revealed.

If you have a digital camera with a flash and a ruler (hold it up to your face) you can measure your own eye pupil size at different brightnesses. Turn the red eye feature off (of course) as you want red eye.

OwenM,

I was trying not to post the name (you might edit your post to remove the name to preserve the mystery ). The model name you have is not quite right. See my original link (there's an extra bit).

Fiddler posted a mention of these guys (at the Optics shop in Buxton). I'd never heard the name so I search and I find this ...

http://www.birdnet.co.uk/binoculars/optisan.html

Looks like the Mystery Bins with a UK name. I can find spec so I don't know if they're optically identical but price seems a little lower. So someone must be making open frame cases in China.

The open-frame is set to become a fashion statement. Even without the ED glass