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Old Wednesday 2nd December 2015, 13:00   #51
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Originally Posted by oetzi View Post
I found this picture on flickr, a user has built himself a device to protect against reflexions from the eyepieces.
I was interested to find out how those were made and found this on Andrew Ferarri's flickr site:
"Many people who own the Pentax Papilio binoculars are surely aware of the annoying stray light entering the eyepieces. The easiest solution is to cut up a piece of bicycle tube into the shape in the foto. You will gain in contrast and avoid internal reflections in the lens system. Works very efficiently and will not cause harm to your eyes in case you bump into the shield. Another good bonus is the fact that you always leave them on even in the carrying case."
I must thank the OP and the many contributors to this thread for their views and reviews. The Pentax Papilio II 6.5x21 will do very well until I can find the old Leitz Trinovid 6x24 at a reasonable price!
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Old Thursday 3rd December 2015, 13:20   #52
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I must thank the OP and the many contributors to this thread for their views and reviews. The Pentax Papilio II 6.5x21 will do very well until I can find the old Leitz Trinovid 6x24 at a reasonable price!
Hi,

even if you found a Trini 6x24 at a reasonable price, I'd be astonished if it offered a better view than the Papillo 2 - except for the field of view, which has to be paid for in dollars and miniscule eye relief...

I'd say, this is more of a collectors item.

Joachim
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Old Tuesday 23rd May 2017, 19:22   #53
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New Take on an Oldie but Goodie

I have become interested in owning a pair of binoculars that offered a very close focus for insect and floral viewing and narrowed it down to the Pentax Papilio II's. Price was right, thus stepped out on a limb...

I had considered the 8.5X for the additional resolution reasons, but decided on the 6.5 to garner a wider FOV, wider EP and less hand-holding shake. Unfortunately, the 1st 6.5x21 U-Series Papilio II Binocular I got came in Out of Collimation! I was really stern with the vendor when requesting an exchange, as the first pair came in with the OEM box set loosely inside the much larger shipping box (No Padding), allowing it to bounce around on it's 1500 mile journey (Sure it was out of collimation...Go Figure)!

Received the exchanged Papilio II in Perfect collimation! However, the smooth focuser was hitting high resistance when out at 100yds or so. If I went steady to infinity, no hang up. But when I stopped around a focus of 90 to 110 yds, it took good effort to break the resistance for either going back to CF or up to infinity...Weird. Worked it steady for a couple of days with No Improvement...Had to go Back! Actually, the 1st & 2nd Papilios had serial numbers that were just 2 digits apart, both must have been manufactured on a Monday morning...After Holiday!! A 2nd exchange (3rd Papilio) was quickly on the way, with hopes a 3rd time would be the charm. Otherwise, it would have been like, "3 strikes-Your Out"!

Well, the 3rd Pentax Papilio II 6.5X21 has hit a Grand Slam!

Functions and features are very impressive:

*super smooth even focus with no slack, no stickion, this unit has 1 revolution of focus for 5ft down to an amazing CF of just 15", 1 revolution for focal sweep from 5ft to 100ft, another full revolution beyond infinity
*IPD smooth with perfect resistance, perfect collimation, eye cups comfortable with great 3 position lock-ins
*solid grippe armor, full bino strap 360 deg rotation, good Ocular cover, nice cordura case and just 10oz of bino weight

Optically, these bat well above their price point:

*FOV is crystal clear and is sharp out to 90%+...Big Sweet Spot
*Colors are a little on the warm side with bright images-even in the shadows
*Pin-point focus and superb resolution details for a 6.5X
*CA and glare issues appear well controlled
*Reverse porro design presents a nice DOF stereopsis
*Good eye relief (no glasses) with quick FOV acquisition

Overall, I'm impressed with these 6.5X21's as they can offer a comfortable view throughout, Especially within their Amazing CF Range!! The vendor (B&H) has listened and the past 2 OEM boxes were well protected with BW (bubble wrap) and arrived in perfect collimation. The only real negative is that these are not weather proof, thus need to be treated accordingly!

Ted
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Old Tuesday 23rd May 2017, 22:17   #54
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Great and interesting review! I tried one in a store a few years ago just to satisfy curiosity. I was astounded at it's close-focus ability.

I'm surprised at how poorly B&H packed them. I've ordered a lot of things from them over the years, and have always been very happy at how well they pack items for shipping. I will also say that for the few times I have needed their customer service, they handled things quite well.......
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Old Wednesday 24th May 2017, 13:06   #55
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Originally Posted by Theo98 View Post
I have become interested in owning a pair of binoculars that offered a very close focus for insect and floral viewing and narrowed it down to the Pentax Papilio II's. Price was right, thus stepped out on a limb...

I had considered the 8.5X for the additional resolution reasons, but decided on the 6.5 to garner a wider FOV, wider EP and less hand-holding shake. Unfortunately, the 1st 6.5x21 U-Series Papilio II Binocular I got came in Out of Collimation! I was really stern with the vendor when requesting an exchange, as the first pair came in with the OEM box set loosely inside the much larger shipping box (No Padding), allowing it to bounce around on it's 1500 mile journey (Sure it was out of collimation...Go Figure)!

Received the exchanged Papilio II in Perfect collimation! However, the smooth focuser was hitting high resistance when out at 100yds or so. If I went steady to infinity, no hang up. But when I stopped around a focus of 90 to 110 yds, it took good effort to break the resistance for either going back to CF or up to infinity...Weird. Worked it steady for a couple of days with No Improvement...Had to go Back! Actually, the 1st & 2nd Papilios had serial numbers that were just 2 digits apart, both must have been manufactured on a Monday morning...After Holiday!! A 2nd exchange (3rd Papilio) was quickly on the way, with hopes a 3rd time would be the charm. Otherwise, it would have been like, "3 strikes-Your Out"!

Well, the 3rd Pentax Papilio II 6.5X21 has hit a Grand Slam!

Functions and features are very impressive:

*super smooth even focus with no slack, no stickion, this unit has 1 revolution of focus for 5ft down to an amazing CF of just 15", 1 revolution for focal sweep from 5ft to 100ft, another full revolution beyond infinity
*IPD smooth with perfect resistance, perfect collimation, eye cups comfortable with great 3 position lock-ins
*solid grippe armor, full bino strap 360 deg rotation, good Ocular cover, nice cordura case and just 10oz of bino weight

Optically, these bat well above their price point:

*FOV is crystal clear and is sharp out to 90%+...Big Sweet Spot
*Colors are a little on the warm side with bright images-even in the shadows
*Pin-point focus and superb resolution details for a 6.5X
*CA and glare issues appear well controlled
*Reverse porro design presents a nice DOF stereopsis
*Good eye relief (no glasses) with quick FOV acquisition

Overall, I'm impressed with these 6.5X21's as they can offer a comfortable view throughout, Especially within their Amazing CF Range!! The vendor (B&H) has listened and the past 2 OEM boxes were well protected with BW (bubble wrap) and arrived in perfect collimation. The only real negative is that these are not weather proof, thus need to be treated accordingly!

Ted
Hi Ted!
You know I have never even picked up a pair of those! They sound like pretty good little binoculars!
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Old Wednesday 24th May 2017, 13:47   #56
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Great and interesting review! I tried one in a store a few years ago just to satisfy curiosity. I was astounded at it's close-focus ability.

I'm surprised at how poorly B&H packed them. I've ordered a lot of things from them over the years, and have always been very happy at how well they pack items for shipping. I will also say that for the few times I have needed their customer service, they handled things quite well.......
Thanks Phil,

Yep...6.5X at 15"...who needs a microscope...Nice!

Had similar "lack of packing" issues back in November with my 10X42L as the OEM box arrived loose inside the shipping box, causing the OEM box to became accordioned. However, the binos were in perfect condition. B&H CS did respond to my -packing issue- feedback and appears to have it fixed...for now!

I also have communicated with them concerning their Exchange policies and CS has responded back quickly, positively and very satisfactorily!

Ted
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Old Thursday 25th May 2017, 00:23   #57
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You know I have never even picked up a pair of those! They sound like pretty good little binoculars!
They most certainly are. I agree with all the positive things Ted has said about them (and am glad to have avoided the packing and shipping problems when B&H send me mine).

...Mike
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Old Thursday 25th May 2017, 17:14   #58
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I have tried several Pentax Papilio II's. They were good as close distances but I didn't feel they were that sharp at greater distances. I feel their design is focused towards close focus and you give up some performance compared to other small binoculars at greater distances.
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Old Sunday 28th May 2017, 01:11   #59
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I just placed an order for these much lauded binocular carbuncles. Should be here in a couple of days.
They'll be locking horns directly with mint Leitz 6x24 Trinovid and Amplivid.
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Old Sunday 28th May 2017, 15:32   #60
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FOV - no contest.
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Old Sunday 28th May 2017, 22:57   #61
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FOV - no contest.
Yet, I can't gaze at my own navel fluff through the Leitz.

I'm very keen to see, first hand, the ruthless impact of six plus surging decades of optical engineering, including the all important trickle down effect into good cheaper products.
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Old Monday 29th May 2017, 00:26   #62
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I feel their design is focused towards close focus and you give up some performance compared to other small binoculars at greater distances.
I'll agree with this as well. But they are so nice for close-up viewing that I think they can be forgiven.

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Old Tuesday 30th May 2017, 05:33   #63
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I received the Papilio ll today. The first thing I did when I looked through it was laugh . In a good way.

A few thoughts...
When looked at in current day context, for just over a hundred bucks, they're quite the surprise packet. This is a superb example of an outstanding Chinese made product performing exceptionally well at its price point.
No optogeekery or resolution charts required here...20 seconds of viewing is more than enough to see that these are indeed great little binoculars. I spent some time inspecting the wear in the denim weave pattern on the knee section of my jeans, and also the car dashboard. Quite bizarre novelty type viewing....the Papilio could possibly be used as an excellent magnifier for extracting splinters in a foot etc. I know I have a little wax in my right ear...I'll be getting Mrs Rathaus to properly inspect the wax status using the Papilio.

None of this was really a surprise. What did surprise was how easily I adapted to the smaller FOV for medium distance viewing. The View is really quite easy on the eyes, lovely and sharp on axis and has a nice sweet spot. No significant problems or issues stand out.

However, as others have noted, I fail to understand why leading manufacturers have all but abandoned the brilliant 6x24 type of format such as the old Leitz Trinovid. No doubt this format will return one day accompanied by much hysteria and fanfare.
Until then, the likes of the Papilio are a far better option, imo, than the (Zeiss et al) 8x20 and 10x25 type formats. I have an otherwise perfect pair of Zeiss 8x20. I purchased them used because I thought they were cute and could be useful. How wrong I was. Even if I did possess the constricted pupils of a 90year old heroin addict, I see no reason for this format when there is living proof of the massive superiority of the Leitz 6x24 format with its incredibly compact body and stunning optics including that 4mm exit pupil. The alpha 8x20/10x25 formats also showcase the relative excellence and value of binoculars such as the Papilio.

Cheers,
Rathaus

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Old Tuesday 30th May 2017, 05:53   #64
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Size reference -
Leitz Trinovid 6x24, Zeiss 8x20B, Leitz Amplivid 6x24, Papilio, Swarovski 8x32 EL, Canon 10x42
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Old Tuesday 30th May 2017, 17:05   #65
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I also was surprised and tickled with my first views...not expecting the quality I saw (wonder if denim weaves are similar)...

If only they were weather resistant...just have to acclimate these little gems to go from AC to 100% humidity!

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Old Tuesday 30th May 2017, 23:41   #66
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I also was surprised and tickled with my first views...not expecting the quality I saw (wonder if denim weaves are similar)...

If only they were weather resistant...just have to acclimate these little gems to go from AC to 100% humidity!

Ted
Lol...I think I read into that too much

I just took a quick photo of the denim on my knee. The photo just can't do the image justice. The knee looks like a massive three dimensional mound with great resolution. The photo does give some indication of the magnification.

I'm not quite sure of any specific birding application of the ultra close focus. One could certainly make a very close inspection of a dead bird without touching the creature. A bird could potentially be inspected for lice with these binoculars.
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Old Friday 2nd June 2017, 12:33   #67
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...I'm not quite sure of any specific birding application of the ultra close focus. One could certainly make a very close inspection of a dead bird without touching the creature. A bird could potentially be inspected for lice with these binoculars.
More birdwatching than birding, but you could use them for ultra close looks at birds coming to a feeder affixed to the outside of a window (e.g. hummingbirds to nectar feeder, wrens to mealworm feeder) that are accustomed to observers moving around just on other side of the glass.

--AP
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Old Friday 2nd June 2017, 14:30   #68
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I recently bought a pair of the 8.5s on offer at 94 on UK Amazon and think they're a great little second pair of bins with unparalleled usefulness for insect-watching.
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Old Friday 16th June 2017, 04:59   #69
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Hi all,
Long time lurker (and amateur :-) and first time poster.
I've had the PII 6.5 for a few months, they are my first binoculars and I love the macro and general vibe for my backyard and for travel with a big backpack. I do want sometihng a bit more compact however for longer hikes. Price is not a huge issue - is there anything to recommend that might be in the 200-300 range that can give me a similar warm up-close feeling but be more pocketable? Used is OK too if its reliable! Thank you.
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Old Friday 16th June 2017, 09:47   #70
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Hi all,
Long time lurker (and amateur :-) and first time poster.
I've had the PII 6.5 for a few months, they are my first binoculars and I love the macro and general vibe for my backyard and for travel with a big backpack. I do want sometihng a bit more compact however for longer hikes. Price is not a huge issue - is there anything to recommend that might be in the 200-300 range that can give me a similar warm up-close feeling but be more pocketable? Used is OK too if its reliable! Thank you.
Hi,

first of all, welcome to BF!

Unfortunately the Papilio range is quite unique in their close focus ability of 0.5m - the next best pairs have about double the close focus distance with 1m or so, usually with difficulties due to their objectives being too far apart (the reverse porro construction of the Papilio is there for a purpose) and I don't know of a pocket one (which doesn't mean much).

The most pocketable bins regardles of close focus ability are Leica and Zeiss Conquest 8x20 (discontinued) which can be folded to fit a shirt pocket - but the close focus is 3m, the field of view is kind of narrow at 110/1000m and the exit pupil is small making eye placement tricky and low light capability nonexistant.

Since you want close focus in a pocket, you might think about a monocular... there's quite a few with good close focus.

Carson has a very cheap 7x18 with close focus down to half a meter like the Papilio although reviews are mixed - probably due to sample variation... or a slightly larger 7x32.

The Docter 8x21 (formerly known as Zeiss Turmon) is also nice and quite compact with close focus to 1m or so - less with the available macro lenses.

Or a Zeiss Mono 6x18T* - focus distance 0.3m and costs 260€ over here...

Joachim

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Old Friday 16th June 2017, 16:03   #71
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Hi,

The most pocketable bins regardles of close focus ability are Leica and Zeiss Conquest 8x20 (discontinued) which can be folded to fit a shirt pocket - but the close focus is 3m, the field of view is kind of narrow at 110/1000m and the exit pupil is small making eye placement tricky and low light capability nonexistant.

Since you want close focus in a pocket, you might think about a monocular... there's quite a few with good close focus.

Carson has a very cheap 7x18 with close focus down to half a meter like the Papilio although reviews are mixed - probably due to sample variation... or a slightly larger 7x32.

The Docter 8x21 (formerly known as Zeiss Turmon) is also nice and quite compact with close focus to 1m or so - less with the available macro lenses.

Or a Zeiss Mono 6x18T* - focus distance 0.3m and costs 260 over here...

Joachim
Wow, thank you Joachim! A lot to parse here and I appreciate it muchly. If I gave up a little bit of the very close-up (say was ok with a 3m distance) what Zeiss would you recommend that hasn't been discontinued?

I've been really intruiged by monoculars and spent much time reading about them, but I can't wrap my head on the idea of sitting in a chair after a day of hiking (eg a camp chair or rock or whatever) and holding those to my eye for 10, 15 minutes. Maybe its just bias from never having used them to be honest, they just seem strange!

Thank you again for your insights :-)
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Old Friday 16th June 2017, 16:24   #72
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I had recent quest for genuinely pocketable binoculars a while back. I had had a pair of the Zeiss Conquests for many years but unfortunately lost them. I tried out lots, and got lots of recommendations but nothing came close to the Conquests for size, most of the high end 8x20s are just that bit bigger and aren't "forgettable" in your pocket. That goes for the "better" Zeiss Victory and Leica Ultravid. In the end I went for the Leica Trinovid 8x20, they are a tad fatter than the Conquests but the eyecups are better at swapping between my wife and I.

Beware that there are some Chinese fake Conquests out there and some vendors are still selling them.
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Old Friday 16th June 2017, 16:28   #73
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It depends on what I am staring at: Minox 8x25 macroscope for fairly static small stuff: infinity down to 14 in/35 cm. Frequently use a low level tripod as I find monoculars less stable than bins.

Papilio 6x21 for more agile stuff: infinity to 50 cm.

The monocular would not be my first choice for staring at birds for long periods; hard to hold steady for long periods, wearing looking through one eye, and slow focussing better suited to acurate macro work.
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Old Friday 16th June 2017, 17:29   #74
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I had recent quest for genuinely pocketable binoculars a while back. I had had a pair of the Zeiss Conquests for many years but unfortunately lost them. I tried out lots, and got lots of recommendations but nothing came close to the Conquests for size, most of the high end 8x20s are just that bit bigger and aren't "forgettable" in your pocket. That goes for the "better" Zeiss Victory and Leica Ultravid. In the end I went for the Leica Trinovid 8x20, they are a tad fatter than the Conquests but the eyecups are better at swapping between my wife and I.
Googling about, the trinovids don't seem to be available in the US - only German links. Thanks for the thoughts though!
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Old Friday 16th June 2017, 21:22   #75
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They are!

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...Binocular.html
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