Phylloscopus Warbler ID - Loei, Thailand - Oct 9, 2017 (1 Viewer)

Hi all,

Any chance of an ID on this warbler seen in Loei province, Thailand on Oct 9, 2017. These are the only two pics I managed and I didn't hear a call etc. Seen at a hillside temple.

Is it an Arctic?

Thanks in advance,

Ben.

I would say so.

Thanks, Andy.

Best to say "Arctic/Kamchatka" - based on current knowledge they can only be separated on call/song.

Thanks, gandytron. I was unaware that was the case; thanks for the info! I will amend my eBird checklist to show as such.

Cheers,

Ben.

I've just been looking at this article.

http://www.thaibirding.com/ornithology/kamchatka-leaf-warbler-sakhalin-leaf-warbler.htm

Did I understand correctly that any Kamchatka seen in Thailand is likely to be migrating either to the south or north? HBW gives wintering grounds as Bali and the Lesser Sundas.

Ben, Dave saw a Kamchatka a few days ago on his patch in Bangkok. So the date is favourable.

http://bangkokcitybirding.blogspot.ae/search?q=kamchatka

I know they're not separable on current knowledge except on call and song, but I must say the Loei bird and Dave's bird look somewhat similar, with a long yellowish super.

andyb39 said:

I've just been looking at this article.

http://www.thaibirding.com/ornithology/kamchatka-leaf-warbler-sakhalin-leaf-warbler.htm

Did I understand correctly that any Kamchatka seen in Thailand is likely to be migrating either to the south or north? HBW gives wintering grounds as Bali and the Lesser Sundas.

Ben, Dave saw a Kamchatka a few days ago on his patch in Bangkok. So the date is favourable.

http://bangkokcitybirding.blogspot.ae/search?q=kamchatka

I know they're not separable on current knowledge except on call and song, but I must say the Loei bird and Dave's bird look somewhat similar, with a long yellowish super.

Click to expand...

Andy/Ben

Yes the wintering range of Kamchatka LW seems to be Bali/Lesser Sundas. In the last few years since the split, more attention is being paid in Thailand to "Arctic Warbler" ID, with only one confirmed record of Japanese LW but Kamchatka has been confirmed from DNA and on song in spring and seems to be regular late spring migrant (I saw my first, singing bird in May this year).

Passage through Thailand in autumn is less well understood as I think birders here have focused on listening to song in spring and have not paid so much attention to birds they encounter in autumn.

Hopefully more work can be done to establish plumage/behavioural differences in due course to help aid the ID of these birds.

I think this mirrors the situation with Iberian Chiffchaff in the UK - I just saw some information about the first autumn record in the UK from Nov last year, despite many spring birds being identified on song over the last 10 or so years. In that case the ID was confirmed by vocalisations and backed up with notes on plumage/behaviour.

best wishes to you both

Dave

Hi all
really difficult evaluating these from photos. Some may think this has the ambience of a TBW rather than an arctic. IMO #1 is a pale-legged leaf warbler.
One can almost see this in the latent image evident in the grey olive-crown contrasting with the brighter wing feathers. The brighter wing feathers of worn arctic are not easy to see at all usually they are narrow fringes. One would not use feet\leg colour as being singularly critical but at least you can point to these as within the individual perception of others. All the arctic groupings have orange/flesh legs with yellow soles. Arctics with greenish warbler like dark flesh legs are rare. None of the Eastern Asian species have legs\ feet like in photo #1 in IMO. Wonder if anybody else agrees with this.

Bryon Wright said:

Hi all
really difficult evaluating these from photos. Some may think this has the ambience of a TBW rather than an arctic. IMO #1 is a pale-legged leaf warbler.
One can almost see this in the latent image evident in the grey olive-crown contrasting with the brighter wing feathers. The brighter wing feathers of worn arctic are not easy to see at all usually they are narrow fringes. One would not use feet\leg colour as being singularly critical but at least you can point to these as within the individual perception of others. All the arctic groupings have orange/flesh legs with yellow soles. Arctics with greenish warbler like dark flesh legs are rare. None of the Eastern Asian species have legs\ feet like in photo #1 in IMO. Wonder if anybody else agrees with this.

Click to expand...

Bryon,

Phylloscs can be difficult in the field, but are arguably harder in photos due to no chance of call, indications of behaviour e.g. foraging strategy, preferred microhabitat, presence/absence of a characteristic tail dip (the latter as seen in the "PLLW/Sak" pair).

However I see no reason to bring "PLLW/Sak" into the equation for this bird because:
1) in my opinion the crown and nape are concolourous with the mantle as would be expected in "Arctic/Kam"
2) the ground colour is green (like "Arctic/Kam"), rather than olive (like "PLLW/Sak")
3) there is no evidence of yellow-olive panel formed by the richly coloured fringes of the primaries (which we would see in "PLLW/Sak")
4) the wing bars appear concolourous with the supercilium (as we would expect in "Arctic/Kam"). In "PLLW/Sak" we would often (but not always) find the wing bars to be more buffy than the supercilium.

Best wishes,

Dave

Thanks, Dave; I greatly appreciated the detailed response and identification tips.

Given that I'm a rank novice, I was mostly hoping for an ID to ensure my eBird entry was as accurate as possible; however, now that I have more knowledge re: behaviour/habitat, hopefully I can narrow down future phylloscopus IDs.

Many thanks,

Ben.