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Bullfinch - Does it also sing in a frequence we cannot hear? (1 Viewer)

Jaysan

Jaysan

Well-known member
Bullfinch - Does it also sing in a frequency we cannot hear?

Hello,

I wonder if anyone has some information on bullfinch songs please.

I have found bullfinches difficult to hear when I am 20-30m away. I have always thought they have a very soft fluty sound. Today whilst photographing a bullfinch from up close, I noticed its throat puffing quite a few times and I did not hear a thing. A little later I heard its soft fluty sound.

I wonder if Bullfinch can sing in a frequency range that humans cannot hear (either high or low)? Does anyone have information on this?

Thanks for your help.
Jaysan.
 
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Hi Jaysan

I'm surprised that you've not had a response to your query. I suspect that what you were witnessing was a bullfinch "subsong" AFAIK some song birds have a very soft song that they make on occasions - almost as if they are talking to themselves. As you say bullfinches have a very soft voice normally - if they do produce a subsong I imagine it would be extremely soft.

Although bullfinches are capable of producing sounds like this in captivity


View attachment BullfinchButNotAsWeKnowIt.mp3

I don't think they produce noises beyond our hearing range but maybe someone knows more on this subject.


Here's a very soft series of calls from xeno-canto

http://www.xeno-canto.org/123747
 
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I think generally bullfinch song is pretty quiet and unobtrusive, and even contact calls can sometimes be very hard to hear - I was watching some from c.5 m away last week and could barely hear the contact calls they were making.
 
Thanks to both of you. I was surprised not to get any response as well. Look forward to hearing the mp3.

The issue I have is this. Lets assume we can hear all the sounds made by bullfinches. Since a song or a contact call has to be heard by other members of its species, these calls will be ineffective the mInute the birds are 20-30m away. Makes these calls pointess if you know what I mean.

Regards
Jaysan
 
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If the two of a pair want to keep in contact in dense shrubs when they're just 3 or 4 metres from each other but can't see through the twigs?
 
Thats my point Nutcracker.

By the way, the whistling bullfinch is stunning Torchepot. Thought it was a human. If they can whistle so loudly, then there should be a reson why they are not choosing to in the wild.

This is more like the call I hear locally http://www.xeno-canto.org/99445

Regards,
Jaysan
 
Jaysan said:
Thats my point Nutcracker.

By the way, the whistling bullfinch is stunning Torchepot. Thought it was a human. If they can whistle so loudly, then there should be a reson why they are not choosing to in the wild.

This is more like the call I hear locally http://www.xeno-canto.org/99445

Regards,
Jaysan
Click to expand...

I read somewhere that Bullfinch calls are more about maintaining the pair-bond than territoriality. They are believed to pair for life and are amongst the most strongly pair-bonded European songbirds. The local birds here rarely seem to venture more than a few metres apart. Perhaps the fact that they are so strongly bonded and in such close proximity means there's no need for anything but the softest calls (despite the fact that they're physically capable of them).

They also seem to be far less aggressive to each other than most of the other finch species we get here - every Spring they descend on our plum trees and strip the buds but I've never seen them squabble even when we get several birds together.

I read up a bit on subsong and while I couldn't find any direct reference to it in Bullfinches (though a few recordings on xeno-canto are labelled as subsong) it's been reported in several other finches. There seems to be some debate about it's purpose - but it doesn't seem to be used for communicating with other birds - perhaps more like "practising" or learning song or in birds that haven't come into breeding condition.
 
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Nutcracker said:
Louder calls risk being heard and traced by predators!
Click to expand...

Not sure how much of a factor this is for diurnal predators, I believe they (sparrowhawks etc.) hunt by sight primarily.

I would think it's more likely to be related to energy expenditure. Why spend loads of energy producing loud calls and songs if your mate is right next to you and bonded to you for life?
 
Thanks Nutcracker. Makes sense after reading that they pair for life and stay v.close.

Clearly loads of pros and cons with low/high volume calls.

Thanks both. Its been an interesting read. I remain curious and am considering getting a bat recorder. If it doesnt work on bullfinches, I can still use it on bats:)

Regards Jaysan
 
Torchepot said:
...
I don't think they produce noises beyond our hearing range but maybe someone knows more on this subject....
Click to expand...

I did some *internet* research about that not so long ago, and I was surprised to learn that birds can not hear ultrasounds/high frequencies. This doesn't mean they can't produce these sounds of course, but it wouldn't make much sense ?

Their hearing capacity and range vary a lot with species, but most have less acoustic range than young humans, except maybe some owl species. One explanation for their relatively bad hearing is that their ears are too close to allow them to locate the origin of sounds with enough precision, so it's much less useful than vision for them.

About subsongs, I was very surprised to hear that while hiding, sounds so low I could barely hear them while sitting maybe 1 or 2 meters away from the bird (Wren or Blackcap) ! I also witnessed alpine swifts coming together, nearly hovering, and "chatting" with "melodious" sounds ! higher volume than the Wren/Blackcap of course, as I could hear them a few dozens meters from the ground, but much softer than their usual calls.
 
Apparently some birds really produce sounds above their hearing range, here is a recent study : http://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822(18)30074-5 "Black Jacobin hummingbirds vocalize above the known hearing range of birds" : Christopher R. Olson,, Marcela Fernandez-Peters, Christine V. Portfors, Claudio V. Mello

Based on the audibility profiles from 48 avian species with broad phylogenetic representation, effective communication in birds is thought to occur within the 0.5–6.0 kHz range, with peak sensitivities at 2–3 kHz [5 and there is little evidence of major shifts across species. Even the blue-throated hummingbird (Lampornis clemenciae), whose complex song includes a few elements that exceed 20 kHz, shows no evidence of hearing sensitivity above 7 kHz
Click to expand...

Humans are supposed to hear in the 20 Hz - 20 kHz range, although I suspect there are very few people with that sensibility, and adults quickly lose the capability to hear the highest frequencies.
 
moving slightly off topic, i have noticed the song thrush cocking head and seeming to listen before diving in and grabbing a worm from soil at grass roots. if correct this suggests hearing is, in some species, developed or employed beyond territorialism and bonding to food location. pure conjecture but maybe woodpecker hears hollows where grubs have bored, and so on.
 
Hi Jaysan,

Jaysan said:
I wonder if Bullfinch can sing in a frequency range that humans cannot hear (either high or low)? Does anyone have information on this?
Click to expand...

Bergmann/Helb/Baumann in "Die Stimmen der Vögel Europas" state that birds, like humans, usually can't hear frequencies beyond 20 kHz, and hardly ever produce sounds beyond 8 kHz.

The book shows a sonograms of the voices of some 450 European bird species, including the Bullfinch. The sonograms only extend to 10 kHz, as this is enough "to cover even very high pitched signals, as for example the Kinglets', completely".

The Bullfinch's normal song is in the region of 2 to 3 kHz, so it's easily audible to the average human.

Birkhead's "Bird Sense" points out that warning signals passerines use to warn each other of raptors are very high-pitched normally, as they can't be heard (at least at distance) by the raptors. (Obviously, drawing attention to oneself in the presence of a predator would be a bad move).

At least some of these warning signals appear to be well within the range of normal human hearing though (if you're close enough).

If you have a smartphone, it might be worth it to install a spectrum analyzer app that does sonograms in real time. Basically, that gives a picture matching the sound you hear at any time. Pretty cool, and easy to understand even if you're not technically minded and don't care about frequencies etc. at all :)

Regards,

Henning
 
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