• Welcome to BirdForum, the internet's largest birding community with thousands of members from all over the world. The forums are dedicated to wild birds, birding, binoculars and equipment and all that goes with it.

    Please register for an account to take part in the discussions in the forum, post your pictures in the gallery and more.
ZEISS DTI thermal imaging cameras. For more discoveries at night, and during the day.

Nikon Premier LX L 8x20? (1 Viewer)

BobinKy

Well-known member
I want to purchase a nice pair of compact roof binoculars for birding and nature walks. I am looking for edge to edge sharpness, bright views, color vibrancy as good or better than my Swift Audubon 8.5x44 820ED binoculars, carrying them in my pocket, and totally submersible if the need arises.

My budget for this purchase is $700.

The sales rep at Eagle Optics recommended the following:

Leica Ultravid 8x20 BCR
Eye relief -- 16mm
FOV -- 341 ft/1000 yds
Close focus -- 7.2 ft
Weight -- 8.5 oz
Dimensions (HxW) -- 3.6 x 4.4 in
Weatherproofing -- Waterproof/Nitrogen Purged

Nikon Premier LX L 8x20
Eye relief -- 15mm
FOV -- 356 ft/1000 yds
Close focus -- 7.8 ft
Weight -- 9.5 oz
Dimensions (HxW) -- 3.7 x 4.2 in.
Weatherproofing -- Waterproof/Fogproof

I appreciate any and all opinions, including recommendations of different binoculars than the above. However, please remember my budget.

I plan on enjoying several nature preserves and bird sanctuaries this fall.
 
My choice

I tried both of the small binoculars you are considering as well as some others.
In my opinion they are the two best and I believe both are excellent in all respects. I purchased the Nikons a few days ago as I was comfortable with the focus adjust and the view was in my opinion very slightly better. I am surprised by the excellent depth of field provided by the nikons and edge to edge sharpness is very good. The leica was excellent as well -- I believe you will be happy with either one. As mentioned many times in the forum it is best to try the pair you will buy, the first set of Nikons I tried had a slightly sloppy focus adjust.
 
If you truly want the binocular to be pocketable, the two you have on your list are the ones to go for. If at all possible, it would be very good for you to try out both before committing to either one, since the feel, handling, and the way they fit your face and the way their view either does or does not feel natural to you are very subjective, and vary from person to person. Thus, while I can pretty confidently say that both models are excellent and "equally good," and could perhaps state a personal preference, I could not predict which one you would find better nor whether you would find the difference in fit and preference subtle, dramatic or something in between (although my guess would be more towards the subtle end). If E.O. will send you both with the understanding that you keep the one you prefer, that would be the best solution from your viewpoint.

Kimmo
 
Kimmo is right you need to try them. Although the Optics of the Ultravids are superb I really couldn't get on with them and bought the Nikons. BUT this really will be a personal choice.

Frankly though any similarly priced 8x32 will be much more usable. You are paying for that dinky compact size.
 
From my experience, both are optically excellent, though perhaps the Nikon has the edge. What I didn't like about it was the relative looseness of the hinges that maintain your inter-pupillary distance, which is very critical with compacts. They seemed likely to need re-adjusting too often, which would annoy me. Other than that they were great. The Leicas are stiffer, a little more compact, and slightly more durable feeling if my memory serves me, but that might be a subjective opinion.

I haven't bought either yet, as I still have a pair of 8x20 Trinovids, and can't yet justify the expense of another pair. The only thing that really bothers me about the Trinovids is a tendency to barrel distortion in some lights, whereas the Nikons and Ultravids appeared to have a more 'natural' view (difficult to explain, but with the Trinovids I'm very conscious that I'm looking through glass, whereas with the other two the experience is more akin to 'being there', just 8x closer).
 
What I didn't like about it was the relative looseness of the hinges that maintain your inter-pupillary distance, which is very critical with compacts.
I think the high end producers would all do well to make a nice 8x28mm single hinged product. They will have years of use without problems.
 
An 8x32 Ultravid is not bigger than anybodies 8x28 'compact'. Single hinged binoculars don't end up that compact anyhow.
 
If you truly want “pocketable”, something that will be carried in your trouser or shirt pocket that you can carry anywhere, out of sight, then double hinged is your only option. I am not aware of any single hinge models that will fold down to that size (but then, until last December, I had never bought anything but “big 3”).

As far as hinge looseness, I have only had one set that ever developed a problem (with the right tube), an older version of the Swaros, and I have carried 8x20’s in my pocket for the last 40 years (maybe just luckier than most).

I am still using, on a weekly basis, the 8x20 IF Zeiss that I bought around 1965 and also used, up till about 3 years ago, a set of Leitz Trinovid’s bought around 1975. Off and on, I will change what I am using for comparison purposes, between Swaros and Nikons, but my 3 main workday bins are the 6x and 8x20 IF Zeiss (smallest, lightest) and the Leica Ultravids. I tend to carry the Ultras when I am in the field working and know I will be needing them and the Zeiss when I am going to be in the office or have site visits or meetings where a pair of bins around your neck would look a little odd.

The main difference, as I see it, is with a single hinge that will not go in your pocket, you tend to set them and leave them that way, where on a double hinge, you tend to get them out, adjust and use them, then fold them back up and put them back in your pocket. If you are going to set them and carry them around your neck a larger, single hinge would probably be better. I guess that I have used compacts so much that I can “almost” set them by feel and do not have the IPD problems a lot of people have with them. I guess practice really does help.

If the only thing I used a binocular for was birding I would probably only own a 8x32/7x42 and a 12x50. But as it is, I like to have bins with me when camping, hiking, fishing, hunting, flying, canoeing, sporting events and other activities. Heck, I have even used bins at chess tournaments.

Lest you think I am only a compact fanatic, I do own and use several 8x32 BA’s, 8x30 SLC, 7x42 Ultravids, 10x25 LXL and 12x50 BN among others, but mostly, as weekend or recreational glass.

I really think both types are justified. Just my opinion though.

Ron
 
I think the high end producers would all do well to make a nice 8x28mm single hinged product. They will have years of use without problems.

I agree, excellent thought. A 8x28 would fit in nicely between compacts and 8x32. I might even long for a 7x28, that would be really something.

Zeiss made a single hinge compact 8x20 Classic, years ago, but this model seems to have vanished into thin air for some reason. It had the looks of a very slim 8x30 Classic, with a nice big focus knob on the eyepiece end of the hinge, and the same thick rubber armouring.
I regret I never gave them a try at the time, after seeing them advertised in a Zeiss brochure.
Whatever happened to them, I wonder?

Greetings, Ronald
 
Spunky12:

Thank you for your comments on the Leica and Nikon compacts.

I own a pair of Nikon Travellite V 8x25s. I want to upgrade my viewing quality and come close to being able to carry the quality of the Swift Audubon EDs around in my pocket.

Do you have any thoughts on comparing the Nikon Travellites to the Nikon Premiers? I hope the difference is a no-brainer. However, it would be comforting to hear from someone with more knowledge and experience than myself.

--Bob
Kentucky, USA
 
Kimmo:

Thank you for your "conclusive" comments for my quest. . . to walk around with quality optics in my pocket.

Your review of compact binoculars in Alula (2006) was excellent. You covered every point a consumer of compacts should consider.

Yes, I probably will purchase both pairs from Eagle Optics and return one of them. From my initial telephone contact, the sales representative said this arrangement fits nicely into their "30-day guarantee" and they would like to be the source for my quest. I realize I could purchase a compact cheaper through another source. However, I am glad to pay for the "buy and return" option--a service most appreciated. My Kentucky location is not exactly a binocular shopping mall. However, there are several nature preserves and an Audubon bird sanctuary within minutes of my house.

Kimmo, once again, thank you for excellent review and comments.
 
Pete:

Thank you for your suggestions regarding my quest. . .to walk around with quality optics in my pocket.

Others have suggested I look at the 8x32 size--particularly the Pentax DCF ED 8x32 binoculars. They do have the ED glass and a larger exit pupil size. However, from the specs I have seen online, the Pentax ED 8x32s are bigger and heavier than the Leica Ultravid 8x20s and Nikon Premier 8x20s.

Please let me know if you or the others have any thoughts on the Pentax.

--Bob
Kentucky, USA
 
SteveClifton:

Thank you for your opinions on the Leica Ultravid and Nikon Premier 8x20s. I have heard from others that the Lieica has an advantage over the Nikon in some mechanical issues.

--Bob
Kentucky, USA
 
Tero:

Thank you for your comments here in the Nikon section, as well in the Leica section.

You mentioned a Pentax. Can you tell me which model you are referring to?

--Bob
Kentucky, USA
 
A If you truly want “pocketable”, something that will be carried in your trouser or shirt pocket that you can carry anywhere, out of sight, then double hinged is your only option. I am not aware of any single hinge models that will fold down to that size (but then, until last December, I had never bought anything but “big 3”). . .

B I tend to carry the Ultras when I am in the field working and know I will be needing them and the Zeiss when I am going to be in the office or have site visits or meetings where a pair of bins around your neck would look a little odd. . .

C The main difference, as I see it, is with a single hinge that will not go in your pocket, you tend to set them and leave them that way, where on a double hinge, you tend to get them out, adjust and use them, then fold them back up and put them back in your pocket. If you are going to set them and carry them around your neck a larger, single hinge would probably be better. . .

D I like to have bins with me when camping, hiking, fishing, hunting, flying, canoeing, sporting events and other activities. Heck, I have even used bins at chess tournaments.

Ron

Ron:

Thank you for the above comments, as well as your comments in the Leica section.

In this thread, I have a few comments below--and a question in B .

A Yes, I definitely want to pocket the compacts in my trousers or pants, for the reasons you mentioned above.

B Would you care to expand on your preference of the Leica for field use and the Zeiss for office use? I would be very interested in hearing more.

C Thank you for this illustration. I definitely want to pull them out of my pocket, use them, and immediately put them back in my pocket. I do not see myself walking about with them dangling on a strap around my neck or wrist.

D You hit the nail on the head. I want to use my compacts in the way you describe. :t:

Thank you for walking me through the posture and social issues of carrying compacts.

--Bob
Kentucky, USA
 
Last edited:
Ron:

B Would you care to expand on your preference of the Leica for field use and the Zeiss for office use? I would be very interested in hearing more.

--Bob
Kentucky, USA


Hello Bob;

The reason for the difference is just a size issue, probably vanity. The old Zeiss are a pair of old 8x20 Individual Focus I have had for 40 odd years and a sentimental favorite. By today’s standards, they are terrible, outside coatings probably gone, no phase coating and eye relief so bad I can not see full FOV without pressing against eyeballs till it hurts. But, they are the smallest, lightest ones I own, with the exception of my 6x20 B IF’s. For comparison here is a table. The dimensions are what I call box dimensions, not the advertised ones, I measured each H, W and D at the maximum point. The weights are with the supplied case. I will say that I put the Nikons in the Leica case when I use them because the Nikon case is absurdly large. Dimensions are out of the case.

Zeiss 8x20 IF 3.43x2.52x1.10 9.5 ci 5.3 oz.
8x20BR Ultra 3.61x2.60x1.72 16.3 ci 10.5 oz.
8x20 LXL 3.78x2.61x1.81 17.9 ci 12.1 oz.

Around the office, I wear at least a tie and on a lot of occasions, a suit. I can carry the Zeiss and they do not present a noticeable bulge. Most people around the office know I have them because I am forever being asked to borrow to look at birds (winged and wingless). The IF is not a problem because I am looking at fixtures during site visits to determine type of parts, etc.

In the field, I use the center focus Leica (or whatever) mostly for the better optics, but also for the center focus in case birds or wild life appears. I will change to the Zeiss 6x20 if in real thick cover for a little more brightness and FOV or the 8x20 or 7x20 IF Leica’s when in a plane or on a boat because I like IF in those situations. If I know a day ahead of time that I am going to fly a route, I may opt for something larger.

Hope this helps, could go on but this covers my basic use.

Ron
 

Attachments

  • PC090002.jpg
    PC090002.jpg
    82.5 KB · Views: 504
Last edited:
compare question

The two Nikons in your above question are in completely different leagues. The premier lx is far superior to the travelite.

Spunky12
 
Hi Ron;

I carry a Zeiss 8x20 IF in my wife's car and they keep me well occupied when my wife is grocery shopping. Mine were also bought in the mid 60's. They are a very nice pair of optics in my opinion and they are truly pocketable.

Don
 
Ron:

Thank you for expanding on the form & function reasons for rotating your compacts throughout the day and week. Your binocular collection must be the envy of many compact users. I wish to particularly thank you for the dimension table, as well as the photograph of your 40-year trusted sidekick--the Zeiss 8x20 IFs.

It is comforting to hear from another enthusiastic user when you go through the research and purchase steps for something as unique as compact binoculars. Your comments across the various posts describe exactly why I want a quality compact in my pocket.

--Bob
Kentucky, USA
 
Warning! This thread is more than 17 years ago old.
It's likely that no further discussion is required, in which case we recommend starting a new thread. If however you feel your response is required you can still do so.

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top