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Gull ID please (1 Viewer)

rimmer

Registered Insane
First looked like a glaucous gull but the primarys look too dark but not dark enough for herring gull
so is it either or a glacousXherring
photo taken on 10/06/04 at Amble just north of newcastle
 

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Thanks micheal

ps
is that a mallard hybrid in the harbour or just a domestic
 

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Ooops-that´s really weird.Have only read about that hybrid compination before, but never saw it.

Does it have a blue speculum like mallard?

And how does it feed-like Eider or like Mallard?
 
I've never seen that combination before either Michael.
This following combination is rare but regular in Iceland
http://www.hi.is/~yannk/myndir/rarity/yk_hybrid030404.jpg
but I've never heard of Mallard x Eider. I'm waiting for the male Steller's Eider in eastern Iceland to produce offspring with the Harlequins it has spent the last six years with. What do you think that might look like?

You're Glaucous x Herring hybrid probably came from Iceland, there are lots and lots of them here.

E
 
Joern Lehmhus said:
Ooops-that´s really weird.Have only read about that hybrid compination before, but never saw it.

Does it have a blue speculum like mallard?

And how does it feed-like Eider or like Mallard?
Hi Joern,

It's the only one I've come across, too. Given the white pattern on the head, I'd suspect the Mallard side of the family was at least part farmyard Mallard, though I don't know for definite. Yes, a speculum, though maybe a bit darker than on (normal) Mallards - Dave's photo shows it well.

Not sure how it feeds, I've not spent enough time with it (just loafing when I've seen it!), but as it hangs out with Eiders, I'd suspect it feeds like them.

Checked up in the bird club bulletins - it first appeared early 2003, and has been there ever since.

Michael
 
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Hi all,
Are there any photos of the putative hybrid gull in fresh plumage?I'd have thought that the faded primaries could be explained by wear,and can see very little else that would mitigate against this bird being a pure Herring Gull.
Harry
 
Harry Hussey said:
Hi all,
Are there any photos of the putative hybrid gull in fresh plumage?I'd have thought that the faded primaries could be explained by wear,and can see very little else that would mitigate against this bird being a pure Herring Gull.
Harry
Hi Harry,

I don't think this bird ever has fresh plumage. It moults in tatty feathers from the start :eek!: . . . at least, I've never seen it looking anything other than very dishevelled!

Probably not helped by the diet of refined white bread from birders and other tourists, or the semi-permanent thin slick of boat oil from the marina . . .


brianhstone said:
Whatever next?! I am waiting for the Glaucous x Eider hybrid ;)
Gurk! The mind boggles!

Michael
 
brianhstone said:
Whatever next?! I am waiting for the Glaucous x Eider hybrid ;)
I presume all these bizarre hybrids are product of randy drake eiders rather than sluttish females.
Reminds me of the story of the male pec seen trying to mate with a dead male red-necked phalarope - transpecific homosexual necrophilia!

Rob
 
Hi Rob,

Since it lives with Eiders, I'd guess it was raised as an Eider, by an Eider, so therefore more probably the result of a sex-crazed* drake farm Mallard raping a female Eider

* All farm Mallards are sex-crazed, they're selected for it to increase egg production for the farmer

Michael
 
Michael Frankis said:
Hi Rob,

Since it lives with Eiders, I'd guess it was raised as an Eider, by an Eider, so therefore more probably the result of a sex-crazed* drake farm Mallard raping a female Eider

* All farm Mallards are sex-crazed, they're selected for it to increase egg production for the farmer

Michael
Valid point, but drake eiders always look like randy b*ggers! I guess a female eider could look pretty much like any other female duck (not sure about goosander though!

Rob
 
Hi all
this is a better pic of the EiderXmallard

also one of both the gull and the duck together
anyone want to guess what the young will look like
 

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What makes it a glauc/herring hybrid ?. This is what I thought it was when I first saw it. BUT WHY? When searching for unusual birds (which is what I do) I Look for birds that don't look right and work for I.D. from there. This bird does not look right to me for pure Herring gull. It strikes me as overall too pale, bill, legs, iris, mantle feathers. The bill looks too large, the head shape wrong, it looks too vicious.The dark primaries exclude pure Glauc. What are the scientific reasons for it not being a worn Herring Gull. I have never managed to become a "scientific" birder and still after 30+ years have trouble seperating feather tracts. My descriptions to record commitees are awful because of this. One of the main reasons I use bird forum is now that I am regularly birding again I would like to become more "scientific" Advice gratefully taken.
 
Hi John,

It is the presence of several features that point strongly towards Glauc: that it is a huge brute, easily Greater Black-back size (tho' perhaps not quite so long-winged); the bill pattern with a sharply demarcated solid black tip to an otherwise pink bill (which it also had last summer, when still just a first-summer bird: Herring wouldn't show this), the head shape, etc.

When it was first found (6th July last year), it was actually identified as Glauc at first, it was only later (late September, tho' it had been missing for a while) that people realised it also had Herring features, particularly after it moulted and got fresh(er!) plumage showing the dark wing & tail tips (it was very faded & worn last summer!) and the heavier mottling on the breast

Assuming Edward is right that it's from the hybrid population in Iceland, there's no reason it should be a first-generation hybrid, it could well be an nth-generation hybrid, which could show just about any combination of GG and HG features, not necessarily exactly half-way between as a first-generation hybrid would tend to be (Edward, is this true of your gulls? any thoughts on where you'd fit this on a scale GG-HG?)

Michael
 
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